bailewen wrote:GrahamB wrote:Do you mean 6 directions not '8 energies' here? As I understand it you don't apply all 8 at once - (although every movement should have Peng) - so for example you don't apply 'Shoulder' when doing the movement Push, for example. It's not cut and dried since virtually all movements seem to have some Split, but I've never heard that all 8 should be done at once, all the time.
Well it's something I have posted a number of times over the years here. Must have missed those threads I guess.
Also, funny you should make a special exception for pengs since another thing I have argued in the past is that the obsession with peng as deserving some sort of special place among the 8 methods...is wrong.
But back on the other point about all 8; it's definitely part of why you need to practice so incredibly slow sometimes. Trying to find just 2 or 3 can be trying, let alone all 8. I've found that often what's needed is to change your perspective on the motion, literally not figuratively. As in which side is facing "front". The "lu" portion of "swallows tail" is peng if you view it from the opposite direction. It's cai and lie in terms of how you hold the arm. A 90 degree change of perspective and you can fine ji on what would normally be considered the "rear" arm. Kao can be found in the weight shift and applied early on in the motion if you turn it around 180 degrees. An is in what would be the "front" hand if you are seeing it in the "normal" way.
Maintaining all these different awarenesses at the same time can be challenging in the same way 6 directional force is.
Sorry, there are a lot of posts here - I can't keep track of them all.
Having read your post a few times now I can see where you're coming from, however, while intellectually you may have a different slant on it, I don't think that in application what we are talking about is different at all.
I say we should have Peng all the time, you say we should have all 8 all the time, right?
So, we're both agreed that there should be Peng all the time, wether you like it or not.
Now the way I see it personally there are only two primordial energies in Tai Chi - Peng and Lu (or a Yang force and Yin force, if you like, hence the name of the art) - the other 6 are just different ways of mixing/using/harmonising the two in different amounts and in different ways. A lot of the postures use more than one of them, and they are only ever made up of Peng and Lu, so you could look at it as all 8 being used at once, I just don't think that's helpful to using it and leads to an overly analytical approach.
It's a very academic way to look at it - in application you just do it, no need to worry or over analyse about what mixture of yin and yang you are using. What's more important is following the strategy of the art - listen, stick, yield, neutralise, attack. The rest flows from that.
I already know you won't agree. That's ok