Shen in the eyes?

[Wuji]

I've been trying to hunt down an article that I read on here, or on the Dao Bums forum. I can't recall where it was, it's been quite some time. In the article Shen, and Yi were being discussed, and the idea that it can be seen from your eyes. One person commented something about the eyes being closed, and from being closed for so long through meditation it causes something to change in your eyes (not anything mystical from how he explained it, more biological chemical changes that happened from less light touching the eyes). Has anyone read this article as well and know where it is? It's been some time, so I might not be recalling it correctly.

[willie]

I've been trying to hunt down an article that I read on here, or on the Dao Bums forum. I can't recall where it was, it's been quite some time. In the article Shen, and Yi were being discussed, and the idea that it can be seen from your eyes. One person commented something about the eyes being closed, and from being closed for so long through meditation it causes something to change in your eyes (not anything mystical from how he explained it, more biological chemical changes that happened from less light touching the eyes). Has anyone read this article as well and know where it is? It's been some time, so I might not be recalling it correctly.

I haven't seen the article, but yes, you will see a spinning kind of look or a bright look in the eyes. I can't explain it in words.
it comes all by itself just from doing the forms or push hands with yi. it's acute awareness, I would call it.

1. look threw your training partners as if they are nothing more then a hologram or a silhouette.
2. internally open your eyes wider and listen backwards at the same time. this creates a dome of awareness.

[Bao]

Shen in the eyes, yeah, one of my teachers spoke about that. He said that there should be a relaxed but focused stare when you practice tai chi form or standing meditation. I find this valuable for my practice. But I haven't found sitting meditation of any value for this. Focusing a gaze and relaxing the eyes closed is, IMHO, quite the opposites.

[mixjourneyman]

Haven't seen the article, but will be interested to look if you find it!


The eyes are associated with the Hun soul and the Yinqiao meridian. the wood element and The Hun soul is associated with yang energy and if you do self cultivation practice correctly, your eyes will become brighter and more intelligent looking. One of the big reasons is because your eyes show very much about your interior emotional landscape, so if you are a very tense person, or a very sad person, or you think too much, then it will show in your eyes. It is just like how many people who are very kind have friendly eyes. People who cultivate intention and Qi are no different, they have that feeling in their eyes.

[Bao]

Haven't seen the article, but will be interested to look if you find it!


The eyes are associated with the Hun soul and the Yinqiao meridian. the wood element and The Hun soul is associated with yang energy and if you do self cultivation practice correctly, your eyes will become brighter and more intelligent looking. One of the big reasons is because your eyes show very much about your interior emotional landscape, so if you are a very tense person, or a very sad person, or you think too much, then it will show in your eyes. It is just like how many people who are very kind have friendly eyes. People who cultivate intention and Qi are no different, they have that feeling in their eyes.

Beautiful post. And so true dat is.

[windwalker]

Some thoughts on this from


http://neigong_yang.republika.pl/imperial_pdf.html

One must not misunderstand the eyes expression of "looking and not seeing" as dull staring, like a pond with still water, without movement and changes. Going out and entering of

eyes expression (Eye Spirit) is naturally interlinked with the mind and intention, which give rise to the changes of Opening-Closing of expression. When eyes expression is merged into the movements of boxing routine one should only keep the eyes open, when Eye Spirit goes out, it is for sure accompanied by the Spirit entering; entering of Eye Spirit is surely followed by the Spirit going out; only when going out and entering alternate and circulate,one can truly use eye expression in such a way that there is Yin within Yang, Yang within Yin and Yin and Yang are combined together.

When Eyes Spirit is held back and looks towards the inside, it does not mean that eyelids drop and eyes are closed or one narrows the eyes and does not look ahead; when Eye Spirit is fixed on a point, it is not using strength and straining the eyes. If the Eyes Spirit is not correctly used, then eyes may hurt because of strain, and it is not only not healthy.

[D_Glenn]

http://rumsoakedfist.org/viewtopic.php? ... 83#p359735

.

[windwalker]

"The True Teachings of Yang Jianhou's Secret Yang Style Taijiquan"

A good book to read that details some of the answers to questions about the usage of the eyes.

In the group I practiced with in Beijing they talked of "hitting" with the eyes....that is a sudden expression
of the spirit which produces some interesting results.
The link that dglenn, posted is also full of very good info...

One problem with a lot of these things I have found is that its pretty specific and is something that
unless one has some good hands on guidance its easy to feel that one is doing what is required when in fact
they are not.


http://www.chinafrominside.com/ma/taiji/weishuren1.html

Explanations of Nei Gong (Internal Skill) Principles

Excerpts from the book "The True Teachings of Yang Jianhou's Secret Yang Style Taijiquan"

by Wei Shuren

Translated from Chinese by Jarek Szymanski; ?J.Szymanski 2000

2.EYES EXPRESSION (EYE SPIRIT, YAN SHEN)

Once the principle of relaxed and straight neck is correctly understood, head will be absolutely empty and eyes expression will naturally attain (the state) of looking and not seeing, which will integrate with (the state of) ears listening but not hearing. The feeling of relaxation of the head will make one's spirit happy and influence the facial expression, showing a slight smile.



One must not misunderstand the eyes expression of "looking and not seeing" as dull staring, like a pond with still water, without movement and changes. Going out and entering of eyes expression (Eye Spirit) is naturally interlinked with the mind and intention, which give rise to the changes of Opening/Closing of expression.

When eyes expression is merged into the movements of boxing routine one should only keep the eyes open, when Eye Spirit goes out, it is for sure accompanied by the Spirit entering; entering of Eye Spirit is surely followed by the Spirit going out; only when going out and entering alternate and circulate, one can truly use eye expression in such a way that there is Yin within Yang, Yang within Yin and Yin and Yang are combined together. (Ill.4)

When Eyes Spirit is held back and looks towards the inside, it does not mean that eyelids drop and eyes are closed or one narrows the eyes and does not look ahead; when Eye Spirit is fixed on a point, it is not using strength and straining the eyes.

If the Eyes Spirit is not correctly used, then eyes may hurt because of strain, and it is not only not healthy but very harmful.

[Rhen]

In Chinese medicine it is taught the shen is expressed in the eyes. It is part of their diagnostics. Face reading, pulse taking, questions, observation, etc.

[willie]

Haven't seen the article, but will be interested to look if you find it!


The eyes are associated with the Hun soul and the Yinqiao meridian. the wood element and The Hun soul is associated with yang energy and if you do self cultivation practice correctly, your eyes will become brighter and more intelligent looking. One of the big reasons is because your eyes show very much about your interior emotional landscape, so if you are a very tense person, or a very sad person, or you think too much, then it will show in your eyes. It is just like how many people who are very kind have friendly eyes. People who cultivate intention and Qi are no different, they have that feeling in their eyes.

I think it's a bit more then that. It's more like what windwalker said "hitting". it's also called "turning it on".
Your hitting them with your Intention's, Good / Bad intent. which over powers or cross cancels.

Also, you can not think of the 5 elements in this setting "martial".
If you look at the cycle of destruction "which is only a martial theory" Wood would be destroyed by fire or metal.
Therefor, The element wood, in this text, would not be an accurate understanding. It's actually misleading and open to misinterpretation.
Soul, However would be correct.

[Wuji]

Thanks for all the replies!

My current teacher (Dai Shi Xin Yi) speaks of some of this stuff, but his English is very poor. I have a very big background with Xingyi, so I have an understanding of some of it. I did find the article I was talking about. I'll have to find it and link it for you all to read. Basically, one of the posters in the article mentioned how people who meditate heavily tend to have a shine in there eyes. It's been explained to me that when we train, we train with Qi Shi in mind, the "Killing Intent" (At least, in Dai Style we do). I've been told that you see it in the face and eyes of a solider, especially someone who has taken lives. You see it in there face, and a lot of these people have a feeling about them. One of my good friends is like this. He was originally a Marine, was recruited into Force Recon when it was still around, USMC Sniper, and was recruited by the Army Special Operations. I'm not sure what he does now. He might only be 160 pounds, and 5 foot 6. I'm 6 foot 7, and a lot more then 160 pounds. He scares the hell out of me though. It's not the fact that we've crossed hands, and he knows what he's doing (he's also a martial artist). It's also the eyes. You can feel the intent as if it was really there, from the eyes. Some of the old school stories in China spoke about intent so strong it was almost like it was physically present.

This got me thinking recently, because I remembered reading that article. I also study internal alchemy from a Chinese perceptive. I've been told, and read it through multiple sources that Shen moves Yi, and Yi is emitted through out the eyes. The article said that the reason people who meditate frequently, or have done of fair amount of cultivation have a near shine or glow from the eyes. One of the posters said it had to do with muscles behind the eye. That when you focus on things with the eye, it uses these muscles. When you start meditating and your gaze softens, you start to use this muscle less. I believe the way he worded it was that the muscle becomes translucent after some time, which is why you get this shine. I don't think it's quite this though. I personally believe that when you train, you train your Yi. That your Yi can be felt, or sensed, or experienced in some other way by other people. I do think it's expressed through the eyes. I think the intent can be seen too. Which I think we see on soldiers, and people that have similar training.

Anyway, that's my two cents. I can't wait to see the replies.

[Bao]

Interesting post...

. Some of the old school stories in China spoke about intent so strong it was almost like it was physically present.

They practice "staring" a whole lot in "Beijing Opera"/"national opera". I remember about ten years ago when I led a group travel agents to the CITM. One performance at the opening ceremony was a bunch of kids from the Beijing opera school. They just walked around in their costumes and stared at as. Holy moly, we were frightened alright. Very, very intense. And these were just kids. I can imagine someone who practiced staring for a couple of decades. Can probably scare the hell out of someone.

[Peacedog]

Various systems exist for training the eyes.

In general, go slow.

Blinding yourself by over stressing the eyes is not unheard of particularly with some of the Taoist systems.

People who practice a lot of condensing work tend to be described as having bright or glowing eyes. This appears to be more common with the Taoist systems.

+1 on killing intent as previously mentioned. For the first few months after I came back from Iraq this would manifest during odd moments. I once made a gangbanger kid piss himself when this happened at a public place. Tier one operators are often mentioned as possessing a kind of glare you don't see anywhere else.

People who practice a lot of magnetic type meditative work are said to have eyes that draw you in and are hypnotizing. Personally, I've seen this as a kind of predatory adaptation. It is also one of the reasons why I wear large clunky glasses. People have wreaked cars around me by getting sucked into my vision in the past before I wore glasses and this seems to prevent that from happening. Both times it happened were in a parking lot at night after I had been training for a few hours. In both cases I was very relaxed and talking to someone else when the other person drove by. I looked up, we locked eyes and it was if they went into a trance state....And then they ran into a parked car. It isn't a common thing it just happened a few times.

After performing a lot of high energy meditative work over the last few decades I've found that people who accidentally stare directly into the center of my eyes find this a very disturbing experience unless they know me exceptionally well. None of them were able to explain what happened afterwards thought. One person did say it was like being sucked into a black hole where they creased to exist.

[dspyrido]

[I-mon]

Watch from about 40 seconds in: