Yang staff forms? modern only?

[origami_itto]

Isn’t that what I’m doing
The art of showing without showing

I mean you are definitely showing.

It's like communicating, or worshipping, you can't not do it.

But is the object of the exercise what you intend... ahhh that's where the neurosis robs your sight.

The world sees what's there regardless of what you're trying to show, Emperor.

We should have a rule in RSF that if you say someone's video is bad, you should put up your personal video to prove you can do better.

That's like having a rule saying you can't use racial slurs. It might make things seem smoother but it just keeps the hypocrites from identifying themselves.

[johnwang]

If we all share our Taiji form videos in RSF. Your hand and foot coordinate may only achieve 98%. But if my hand and foot coordinate can only achieve 96%, I will never say your Taiji form is bad because I'm not qualified to say that.

[edededed]

Not all northern CMA staff has the "yinba" grip (tiger's mouth facing each other).
(Actually, most of what I learned does not.)

As for taiji staff - I thought that maybe staff just isn't a great weapon for taiji... since the art of bludgeoning basically requires speed/momentum

[wayne hansen]

The staff especially the two man set follows all the tai chi principles of 4 ounces
Listen/neutralise/follow /complete
That is exactly why it exists
It has pushing and ta Lu
Our form uses the two opposing grips all the way thru
As does Huangs double ended tai chi pole

[origami_itto]

Not all northern CMA staff has the "yinba" grip (tiger's mouth facing each other).
(Actually, most of what I learned does not.)

As for taiji staff - I thought that maybe staff just isn't a great weapon for taiji... since the art of bludgeoning basically requires speed/momentum

Yang Lu Chan was known for his spear skills. They struck the heads off all the spears when Banhou killed his daughter and suddenly had all these staves laying around.

But basically, lotta Yang folks do spear drills with staffs. Does not make much difference as far as it goes. You can do all the same things, even poking, just not as sharp. Not just bludgeoning.

So now the story is they've always had staff, of course they have all the staff techniques, no, only the good techniques, no I can't show them to you.

I learned that one Shaolin staff form Yin Shou Gun, the grip changes. Also a Guan Dao form, same thing, the grip changes depending on what you're doing.

[johnwang]

Not all northern CMA staff has the "yinba" grip (tiger's mouth facing each other).
(Actually, most of what I learned does not.)

Here is a northern CMA staff form. "Yinba" is used all the way through.

[wayne hansen]

Little to do with tai chi pole

[Trick]

The grip of the staff/spear where the two hands “tiger mouth” face each other probably has origin from the battlefield to give stability when the spear piercing the charging armored enemy soldiers, maybe even the horse the enemy riding on ?
Look at the pole vault jumpers grip, they even get it more twisted by facing their back hand “tiger mout” to the back - maybe an even more stable grip ?

[taiwandeutscher]

From the way that they hold that staff, it looks like they are holding a spear (or a southern CMA staff). The northern CMA guys don't hold staff that way. Staff is 2 heads snake. All southern CMA single head staff came from spear.

This is how to hold a northern CMA staff - both tiger mouths face each other.

The 2nd clip here, from Wang Jinshi in Gaoxiong, is not Taijigun at all, but it is Taizu duigun from the Xiong Yanghe system, and I agree with Wayne, done really poorly. Ju Hongbin and Wang Jinshi had "borrowed" lots of Xiong material, initially were refused by Xiong himself, only to be taught by Xiong's students and it shows. Same is true for Dao and Sanshou, which never were in the ZMQ system.

[edededed]

Not all northern CMA staff has the "yinba" grip (tiger's mouth facing each other).
(Actually, most of what I learned does not.)

Here is a northern CMA staff form. "Yinba" is used all the way through.

Nice form, what is it?
Some bagua staff I learned also was "yinba."
I guess it just comes from the preferences of the creator.

[johnwang]

Nice form, what is it?
Some bagua staff I learned also was "yinba."
I guess it just comes from the preferences of the creator.

It's 昆吾棍. I have also learned another staff form 劈手竿 when I was 11 that hold the staff the same way.

The main reason that you hold a staff this way at 1/3 and 2/3 positions is if you release your

- left hand, your right hand can hold staff with 2/3 reach distance.
- right hand, your left hand can hold staff with 2/3 reach distance.

[wayne hansen]

The palms facing is not so much about penetrating power even though that was part of it
I was taught it is more about retaining the pole in one hand no mater what direction you take a powerfull strike from
It has proved true thousands of times while doing the two man set

[salcanzonieri]

From what I know, most of the 2 person staff forms found in Yang and Chen TJQ are pretty much from one of General Qi JiQuang's books on staff fighting. and from some Shaolin staff. Would make sense for Tai Chi since Chen's claim Qi JiGuang's books as a source. Chen's connections to Tong Bei would bring in the Shaolin staff, as would Chen Wangting's training Shaolin in DengFeng village with his Li family relatives (which had been doing Shaolin since 1500s).

[wayne hansen]

The pole forms I have learnt are very different to any Shaolin ones I have seen

[johnwang]

From what I know, most of the 2 person staff forms found in Yang and Chen TJQ are pretty much from one of General Qi JiQuang's books on staff fighting. and from some Shaolin staff. Would make sense for Tai Chi since Chen's claim Qi JiGuang's books as a source. Chen's connections to Tong Bei would bring in the Shaolin staff, as would Chen Wangting's training Shaolin in DengFeng village with his Li family relatives (which had been doing Shaolin since 1500s).

It's so funny that people may think if you do your weapon form

- slow, you are doing Taiji weapon.
- with Fajin, you are doing Baji weapon.

First weapon should not be done slow. Second, with the sharpness, weapon doesn't need Fajin.