the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

Bhassler wrote:...as far as I know, Dempsey invented the thing, so if there's any disagreement he's right...

Kelley Graham wrote:

GrahamB wrote:Whole body power is literally the reason why these arts got the name "internal". One part moves, all parts move, etc. The 6 harmonies.

RSF seems to be becoming increasingly pointless - it feels like nobody is ever on the same page.

Disagreement is what discourse is for, not agreement. Please show me where ‘whole body power’ is in the poems and songs of XingYiQuan. If it appears, it will be in the context of my previous post. WOOD -> EARTH, etc. logically, whole body power applies to every action, and to everything, everywhere, so why speak of it as something with which IMA should spend any words explaining?

GrahamB wrote:

Kelley Graham wrote:

GrahamB wrote:Whole body power is literally the reason why these arts got the name "internal". One part moves, all parts move, etc. The 6 harmonies.

RSF seems to be becoming increasingly pointless - it feels like nobody is ever on the same page.

Disagreement is what discourse is for, not agreement. Please show me where ‘whole body power’ is in the poems and songs of XingYiQuan. If it appears, it will be in the context of my previous post. WOOD -> EARTH, etc. logically, whole body power applies to every action, and to everything, everywhere, so why speak of it as something with which IMA should spend any words explaining?

Oh God, that's tedious.

You are arguing about semantics without any comprehension. If you're looking for the phrase "whole body power" translated into English from Chinese originals then I don't think you'll find it, but the whole of the XY classics is talking about finding a unification in the body, splitting it into 3 parts, co ordinating the parts so they move together, so you combine everything into one.

Here's one translation:

https://www.hsing-i.com/yueh-fueis-10-theses

If you can get away from WOOD in CAPITAL LETTERS and get the essence of what it is saying you'll find that it's exactly what Byron is talking about in the OP.

Call it "threading into one" if it makes you happier. A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet.

Kelley Graham wrote:

Quigga wrote:Dunno, whole body power seems like a useful concept for explaining different things. Sure it's just a concept and as such prone to misunderstandings, illusions and imperfection, but so is everything else one uses to try to explain anything.

WBP is often used to try to convey what one feels during practice. 'Feeling connected' in various ways.

Since I always carry my body around me except for very special cases of projecting myself outside (out of body experiences, near death, astral travel - can't do that and no clue if I can learn it, smoked too much weed maybe), I obviously always have 'whole full body power'.

I personally would hate to see Graham go. He's a valuable member of our board and contributed lots of personal effort.

Every person less leads to slower discussion and less exchange on an already slow board for a very niche topic.

Let's just stay professional and not take stuff personally. I might not have to agree with everything other people say, but that doesn't mean I can't care for them.

As long as no one is actively trying to physically harm me, there's no need for me to get violent or destructive in whatever way.

That being said, this whole place obviously wouldn't run without you Kelley. You have a unique approach and lots of teaching experience. Your passion for the subject is huge. Thanks for providing this service to me and all other people on here.

I've literally started posting here when I was still a teenager, more than 10 years ago. I would hate to see this community break further apart.

I appreciate the thought. I pay for this place out of my own pocket every month. What I get doesn’t cover the bandwidth and processor fees. My direct cost is ok. The time I put in making sure things are ok I’m happy to contribute. I’m not asking for anything except understanding and tolerance for different points of view. I will not tolerate babyish ad hominem attacks and refusal to engage reasoned discussion directed my way. I have a very long list of things I’d do than be attacked over reasoned arguments. I’ve watched our discussions degrade here into ‘everything equals everything’. There are important language differences and resulting methodologies that lead to real concrete insights into one’s self cultivation and fighting prowess. These insights are specific to different arts and make life interesting. If we fail to define the boundaries of our respective arts, thousands of years of insight that is encoded into our practice is lost.

Kelley Graham wrote:I pay for this place out of my own pocket every month. What I get doesn’t cover the bandwidth and processor fees. My direct cost is ok. The time I put in making sure things are ok I’m happy to contribute.

robert wrote:

Kelley Graham wrote:I pay for this place out of my own pocket every month. What I get doesn’t cover the bandwidth and processor fees. My direct cost is ok. The time I put in making sure things are ok I’m happy to contribute.

I didn't know that. Thanks. I checked the top link and saw that you have a payment system setup. Do you have anything setup for contributions to support RSF?

Trip wrote:https://youtu.be/NnG7PWGrx20?t=43

For those of you who might be interested
in seeing Dempsey perform his drop step in motion &
under pressure
the link above shows the fight that made the falling step famous

GrahamB wrote:Really? Pulling the "I pay for this place" card is not very cool. I mean, paying for it is very cool - thank you - , but pulling the card out is not, and doesn't make you look very objective. Enjoy your fiefdom.

If anybody would like to hear my thoughts on Whole Body Power, I just did a blog post about it over on my blog where I will be enjoying my retirement and spending more time with my children, who I pay for.

GrahamB wrote:He who moves first is the master, and he who moves second is the follower. Be able to think only of advancing and do not keep thinking of retreating.

Kelley Graham wrote:What’s tedious about this is a refusal to address the point that whole body power applies to everything you do with your body.

origami_itto wrote:This is a great example of the difference in the two arts. In Taijiquan we don't move until they move. Move second, arrive first.