Practice after sex...

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Practice after sex...

Postby Elliot on Wed Aug 27, 2008 12:23 am

Klonk wrote:

Elliot: The idea the world is round is not precisely new. While I take your point, that new discoveries may be correct, it is very unlikely in the subject area of fistfighting, which is older than recorded history.


I'm not so sure about your theory that no new discoveries are made in the area of fistfighting. Actually, fistfighting is a very good example of my point; many traditional styles were practiced and revered for centuries, unquestioned in their deadly effectiveness, until MMA came along 15 years ago.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby edededed on Wed Aug 27, 2008 12:28 am

Andy:

Ha ha, right - forgot about that...

Stu: "Hey, look! That snake looks like my..."
Bob: "Let's eat it!"

Guess the caecilians, large worms, glass lizards, and eringi mushrooms got lucky and never got noticed by the Chinese for some reason... (Or maybe the lot of them are just called "snake" in Chinese...)

Wiesiek:

Are any animal species horny when it isn't "season" (it is always season for humans)? Maybe bonobos. But who eats bonobos?
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby wiesiek on Wed Aug 27, 2008 2:17 am

ok
:)
let`s call it a calf
ps
i have personal experience, it works ;D
Last edited by wiesiek on Wed Aug 27, 2008 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby wuchuan on Wed Aug 27, 2008 4:56 pm

Just practice, to many people look for excuses to not practice ::). If the only time I practiced was when the conditions were perfect, I would never get any practicing in.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby klonk on Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:05 pm

Elliot wrote:Klonk wrote:

Elliot: The idea the world is round is not precisely new. While I take your point, that new discoveries may be correct, it is very unlikely in the subject area of fistfighting, which is older than recorded history.


I'm not so sure about your theory that no new discoveries are made in the area of fistfighting. Actually, fistfighting is a very good example of my point; many traditional styles were practiced and revered for centuries, unquestioned in their deadly effectiveness, until MMA came along 15 years ago.


The ancient Greeks had MMA. They also thought the world was round. In broad principle, I think the past has more to tell us than the present, because there is more of it.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby Darthwing Teorist on Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:42 pm

Elliot wrote:Klonk wrote:

Elliot: The idea the world is round is not precisely new. While I take your point, that new discoveries may be correct, it is very unlikely in the subject area of fistfighting, which is older than recorded history.


I'm not so sure about your theory that no new discoveries are made in the area of fistfighting. Actually, fistfighting is a very good example of my point; many traditional styles were practiced and revered for centuries, unquestioned in their deadly effectiveness, until MMA came along 15 years ago.


Klonk is right. Pankration was much more dangerous than today's MMA. Yes, today we have some advanced understanding of the human body, but for practical applications, I am not sure that there is anything new.

Fighting arts evolve, they adapt to the environment, but honestly, MMA is a specialization for ring fighting. That does not mean that it is easy, but it is an adaptation of martial arts to a very specific environment.

So, while during any time period, martial arts are unique, because of the environment (culture, weapons, climate etc), in their essence, the basic principles are similar.
И ам тхе террор тхат флапс ин тхе нигхт! И ам тхе црамп тхат руинс ёур форм! И ам... ДАРКWИНГ ДУЦК!
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby edededed on Wed Aug 27, 2008 9:01 pm

I would say that CMA in general has many unique principles, though - although the objective (fight another person) is the same, the principles don't have to be. The reason that CMA appeals so much is the fact that it concentrates on things that most other fighting methods do not.

Pankration was fought naked, wasn't it? As a result, there were lots of, er, interesting methods that people used to get the other guy... Of course it was a brutal, bloody mess.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby wiesiek on Wed Aug 27, 2008 11:55 pm

edededed wrote:Pankration was fought naked, wasn't it? ...


focus bellow waist is not sufficient,
you didn`t count metal /bronz/ "gloves" as an sports suit, did you?
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby Elliot on Thu Aug 28, 2008 9:38 am

I agree that principles are always the same. The error is in assuming out of hand that older is better. Knowledge is cumulative, the discoveries of the past are built upon so that technologies advance, even technologies of using the human body (compare the abilities of athletes today with athletes even a few decades ago, let alone in ancient times).

The principles of medicine were the same in ancient Greece as well, to heal the sick, but if you were sick would you choose to go back in time to visit an ancient physician, or would you go to a modern hospital?

Darthwing is absolutely right, martial arts are unique to certain times, cultures and conditions. This is the primary reason most traditional martial arts, CMA included are comprised of outdated training methods and techniques. An example; Sanda is a modern culmination of older martial arts, just like MMA. It represents an evolution. How many traditionally trained martial artists can compete with a modern Sanda trained fighter?

The ancient Chinese may have come up with theories about ejaculation being harmful, and sex emptying your kidneys of jing, but modern science has proven it just isn't true. Yet many people here seem to want to look back to a less sophisticated time and follow outdated practices apparently not proven useful for anything. It's very strange.
Last edited by Elliot on Thu Aug 28, 2008 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby I am... on Thu Aug 28, 2008 10:42 am

From reading the posts following my last one, I am guessing nobody bothered to read the links I put up?
http://www.appliedcombat.com

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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby D_Glenn on Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:08 pm

Elliot wrote:The ancient Chinese may have come up with theories about ejaculation being harmful, and sex emptying your kidneys of jing, but modern science has proven it just isn't true. Yet many people here seem to want to look back to a less sophisticated time and follow outdated practices apparently not proven useful for anything. It's very strange.


Hard to say who came up with it since the same methods are found in numerous different nations and cultures such as Indian aruyvedic medicine.

You should really post the modern scientific studies that are researching 'jing'. It doesn't sound remotely plausible that something that doesn't even exist in modern medicine is being studied. :-\ And even if it were then in order to truly study the effects of it's loss we would be talking about lifelong studies since as Kreese already mentioned 'jing' isn't something that can be really quantified until you're close to zero at which point it's really too late to do anything about anyway. It is something that exists in you from the day you were born, you will never feel it's surplus, only when it's gone.

The only possible modern studies that could be said to be studying the equivalent to the chinese 'jing' (without the knowledge that there is a correlation of course) is the western studies that are being done with the 'polyamines', in which case they have proven without a doubt that there is a significant loss via ejaculation in men and menstruation in women, but the studies can't measure the total amount in the body and they are also being constantly supplemented from ingested proteins converted to amino acids to polyamines (jing from food and air), so individual to individual there are variations in the amounts being measured: http://books.google.com/books?id=x7x49C ... t#PPA24,M1

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Last edited by D_Glenn on Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:31 pm, edited 7 times in total.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby Elliot on Thu Aug 28, 2008 6:24 pm

You should really post the modern scientific studies that are researching 'jing'. It doesn't sound remotely plausible that something that doesn't even exist in modern medicine is being studied.


Exactly my point, it doesn't really exist. Yet people here are very worried about "conserving" it.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby Muad'dib on Thu Aug 28, 2008 6:31 pm

You must have missed it. The point was that scientists would not waste time studying it, if they didn't feel there was a valid basis for its existence.
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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby D_Glenn on Thu Aug 28, 2008 6:51 pm

Elliot wrote:
You should really post the modern scientific studies that are researching 'jing'. It doesn't sound remotely plausible that something that doesn't even exist in modern medicine is being studied.


Exactly my point, it doesn't really exist. Yet people here are very worried about "conserving" it.


Do you have any reading comprehension skills at all?

It doesn't sound remotely plausible that something that doesn't even exist in modern medicine is being studied. As in: it is a Chinese word for a Chinese concept. A word that doesn't exist in modern science or western dictionaries.

If you can actually read the rest of my previous post you can see that in modern medicine there is a word "polyamine" that is the closest thing that correlates to the chinese word "jing" and it is indeed being studied in modern science and applied to western medicine.


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Re: Practice after sex...

Postby Chris Fleming on Thu Aug 28, 2008 6:54 pm

I don't see it as a matter of "faith" vs science. It is more of a matter of pseudo science vs experience. At times I feel that sex has no effect, other times I most certainly do feel it's effects. What is then going on here? Science should have it down to, well, a science. In those studies, I think they are on to something, but not the entire picture. I highly doubt that sex actually IMPROVES athletic performance the next day like some of those articles would have you believe. I don't say that based on some study, but experience. Perhaps it is psychological. Doubt that too, because in my heart of hearts, I would not want to be weaker for any reason. Yet another puzzle...
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