Bodytype

[shawnsegler]

Being small is better for doing qingong.

S

[LJN]

I teach different body types and ages.
The baguauqan I am a proponent of has three styles for body types, Gong Bao Shan method big fellows strong and heavy like a mountain, Gong bao Zhai method for average and tall persons it is even handed and level in it's methos like shaking some ones hand, Gong bao Tian for smaller thiner people it characterized by quicker lighter stepping and faster hands. The method of training is generally the same for each body type however the results tend to be according to the persons body type and consonance.

Note this is my personal nomenclature/methos and not a part of the orthodox language.


I do have a some perceived difficulty training big heavy guys, interesting that my three newest students are big.

[Mephisto]

If I recall correctly, a lot of famous bagua people (especially Cheng style) have been described as "big and strong".

[mixjourneyman]

Interloper, have you studied mma? To what extent have you put your ima into mixed martial format?
Its harder than one would immediately think.

[Interloper]

Mix,
When I talk about MMA, I'm referring to adapting a foundation of traditional MAs, not the sport uses and applications such as in Pride or UFC. I doubt I'll be trying out that type of venue any time soon. Or ever, actually.

I've been working IMA into boxing (easier than you think), which is part of my background, along with P/K and striking arts(also part of my background). Grappling, not so much as IMO I have not put in enough mat time on my own and need to get out at some point and mix it up in some friendly bouts with grapplers. I do believe that grappling is a crucial skill set, and I want and need more of it. It is a great vehicle for applying IMA body skills, and I have found that what I do have of grappling skills has been hugely augmented by having and applying IMA skills through them.

That said, I have had some successes that surprised even me, in appying what I have of internal body skills to boxing. Part of that success included spontaneously KOing a guy who outsized me by half-a-foot and outweighed me by 50-60 lbs. and had far superior reach.

Cordially,
I.

[mixjourneyman]

Fair enough.

I'm doing a lot of boxing hand work and muay thai type leg work. I found it was easier to pick up the thai kick because I have good flexibility.
The hand work I can't reconcile with ima yet. Jab at least (since you don't want to telegraph the jab and the ima methods tend to do that).
I can def see the use of ima movement skills in cross, hook, and uppercut though.

Thanks for sharing.

[Interloper]

Mix,
With IMA, the handwork should be about the easiest part, I've found. You should be able to apply it no matter how you punch. And instead of jabbing and retracting, why not connect with it instead and bury the guy into the floor? If you train for "sinking jin," it's something your body carries with it whether you are standing toe-to-toe or are in motion, and it is applicable both when your opponent attempts to land a punch on you, or you land one on him. Either way, he's the one who pays.

[mixjourneyman]

Doesn't that kind of negate the idea of the jab (quick punch that can go rapid fire and come back to guard before you get hit)?

Still, its worth trying out.

[Interloper]

I'm telling you man, IMA changes whatever "art" you're working with and from. Since I started training it, my boxing has changed. I don't jab anymore. Except to feint, that is. If the guy tries to knock your arm away or punch past the jab, you connect and stick to him with your jab... so it goes from being a jab to being an entry point into your opponent's center. Then you stuff his ass into the ground.

Hell, come to think of it, maybe I'm not even really boxing anymore.

[mixjourneyman]

I'm just trying to stay objective.
Believe me, I'm gonna be trying this stuff out the next time I meet up with my sparring partner.

[Bao]

Doesn't that kind of negate the idea of the jab (quick punch that can go rapid fire and come back to guard before you get hit)?

according to Dempsey, a jab should should shoot out like "a bolt of lightning" that doesn't need to come back fast, because it should knock your opponent down.

[mixjourneyman]

It would be interesting if Dempsy were still alive and boxing. Without it we can only try to interpret his words.

[H2O_Dragon]

I'm telling you man, IMA changes whatever "art" you're working with and from. Since I started training it, my boxing has changed. I don't jab anymore. Except to feint, that is. If the guy tries to knock your arm away or punch past the jab, you connect and stick to him with your jab... so it goes from being a jab to being an entry point into your opponent's center. Then you stuff his ass into the ground.

Hell, come to think of it, maybe I'm not even really boxing anymore.

Yeah, but that doesn't negate the benefit of the jab from a boxing viewpoint. You can snap the job to gauge distance peck at him. You can throw it as a power shot to knock him of balance (think lead hand beng) And yup, you can use it to stick and enter. Seems to work best for me when I mix it up so the guy doesn't know what's coming.

[Interloper]

Yeah, but that doesn't negate the benefit of the jab from a boxing viewpoint. You can snap the job to gauge distance peck at him. You can throw it as a power shot to knock him of balance (think lead hand beng) And yup, you can use it to stick and enter. Seems to work best for me when I mix it up so the guy doesn't know what's coming.

From a boxing viewpoint, sans IMA, a jab is another "external" technique that can be developed to a point of great finesse. But it's still external technique. And I believe that stuff like jabs can be risky because in withdrawing them to rechamber/re-fire them, you leave a "void" that your opponent can jump into and exploit. With IMA, you have sealed off all openings in yourself against an external boxer. You're not as vulnerable. IMAs let you punch and stick, connect, and manipulate your opponent via his spine.

Dempsey was a marvel, and IMO he finessed his way around the vulnerabilities of a jab by eliminating the void ---- by training to make his jabs powerful and quick enough to KO his opponent so he wouldn't have to retract his arm and "fire" again. But he was still an external boxer, great as he was.

Before I trained internally, I was no Jack D., but my jab was pretty quick and powerful. I've had guys who outweighed, outreached and outmatched me telling me that they would not want to get hit by one of my punches. My cross had knock-out power, as did my hooks and uppercuts. But -with- IMA now, there's more I can do with a punch beyond just going for a percussive KO. You can also completely dominate and control your opponent's body whether he initiates the punch/attack or you do. I find that it opens up a new horizon and takes boxing to another level. Just sayin'.

[C-Hopkins]

Any other members have any more input on some of the other systems and how they relate to bodytype?