Teaching forms

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Teaching forms

Postby Steve Rowe on Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:43 pm

I've taught both Japanese and Chinese Martial Arts all over the World and found the best language to use generally was English. Even if we had Japanese or Chinese names we would have to translate them into English to explain the cultural aspects.
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Re: Teaching forms

Postby Andy_S on Thu Oct 30, 2014 7:36 pm

Interesting question.

I know the translations in English of all the form names, and also many of the Chinese phrases (though I don't speak or read Chinese). Even so, IME, few of the terms really offer much understanding that really inform the physical practice.

Some terms are simply descriptive of the physical action
Raise hands
Brush knee, twist step
Etc

Others are metaphorical:
'White crane spreads wings' is pretty simple: The movement looks rather like a crane spreading his wings.
'Sparrow ground dragon' also makes sense if one has a little bit of imagination: A dragon swooping down low like a sparrow

OTOH, other posture names make no real sense, and I am not sure what they refer to at all:
'Six sealing, four closing' is a mystery
'Single whip" likewise - the only explanation of this that did make sense (it is like a pole being held over the shoulders) was, I was later told, an incorrect translation

Given what Wayne has written above, perhaps Willy - if he is reading this - will chime in.
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Re: Teaching forms

Postby leftwose on Thu Oct 30, 2014 9:35 pm

from my limited understanding:

Six Sealing, Four Closing is an incorrect translation. It is more along the lines of 'as if closing(sealing) a door' which makes more sense if you look at the move and see how it could be closing a door (on an opponent) as it tries to open. Redirect and close(seal) the door(gate)

Single Whip refers to the single metal rod(whip). To wield it you must support it with the other arm(and body) and move it by coordination.


I never really understood any of the alliterative(chinese) names until I had a teacher that explained it a bit. For example, I was taught that it was White Crane FLASHES wings, not spreads. Flashes is demonstrative, spreads could be deliberative.
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Re: Teaching forms

Postby charles on Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:12 am

In my understanding of it, forms are a continuous sequence of movement or actions. For pedagogic reasons, rather than have one long undifferentiated sequence, these movements/actions are punctuated at "random" intervals with names. It allows students and teachers to refer to specific points in the sequence. Some of those names are "descriptive" of the physical actions and others are references to cultural icons.

For those sufficiently interested, understanding or interpreting the names can provide insight into aspects of Chinese culture and history. In many cases, getting hung up on linguistic translation issues, such as whether a white crane flashes versus opens its wings, can be a distraction. For example, there are lots of practitioners who debate linguistic aspects, but relatively few who have advanced physical skills.

In addition, many skilled teachers break each named form "movement" into multiple individual parts. In my experience, those that don't are glossing over the details, either because they don't know them or aren't too interested in teaching them. Ymmv.
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