The core - training tips?

[Rabbit]

Yes thanks

Turkish get up is really good for sure

Finding the simple hollow body shape laying down on back , 6 x 60 second sets unusually challenging

Only recently directly addressing the core and the connections between upper and lower body in a practice way

My structure is horrible and my body is loving its awful patterns but I'm on to it!

[wayne hansen]

After reading the wiki explanation I find tien kan covers all those muscles
As the hands and legs are not part of the core i don't see how handstands and the Turk apply
Even though I see they both effect the core

[Ian]

I'd suggest creating a neutral core that can support your extremities through multi-planar, complex movements without compensation... before you start trying to strengthen anything.

You really can't strengthen' your way back to neutral, only unlock and release.

And I'm talking about developing a core that can withstand thai clinches, snap downs, breakfalls, and can generate forces to bend, compress, twist etc.

[Rabbit]

Interesting comment Ian - how does one do this?

[Bhassler]

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[Rabbit]

But what does this mean?

Thai boxers work the shit out of their core .... no?

Mysterious ....

[Bao]

Neutral? Nice one, that made me feel really stupid.
An overall or general strength developed for no particular method of use of the core?

[Patrick]

´The core` is an ambiguous term and I do not know what Ian eaxactly meant, but studies have shown, that the ability to have proper activation of
certain muscle groups (i.e. transversus abdominis) is more important than just "strengthing the abs". For example in healthy individuals without
back problems the transversus abdominis contracts before the movement is executed ("feedforward").
This is best trained by using coordination stability training with different surfaces or any exercise where the limbs are suspended.
Just "strengthening" the abs wont cut it here.

[Bhassler]

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[Patrick]

Interesting. Seems we are not up to date . Could you send me the references...only if its no big effort for you. THX.

[Bhassler]

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[wiesiek]

`cause nobody mentioned it yet - KB`s is my turn

[Fa Xing]

You would absolutely not be able to do a turkish get up or handstand without a strong core, no matter how strong your arms are, it's that simple. Your entire body works as a unit, with lines of fascia, muscles, and joint systems connecting together in order to produce a particular movement pattern. The shoulder girdle which includes the scapula, latissimus dorsi, the SITS muscle group, pectoralis major/minor, trapezius, etc. all require the whole of the body to stabilize the weight overhead while moving from the prone (laying on one's back) to standing and back down again. A similar process is needed for the handstand.

I have no doubt that the Tiangan trains the core, the thought I have always had about Traditional Chinese bodyweight condition neigong is that a great deal of the time the upper body isn't loaded enough to produce the proper training response, and thus one may not get the appropriate stimulus in order to understand how to connect the core of the body (i.e. the torso) with the upper extremities.

http://functionalmovement.com/ has some great material on this type of stuff.

[Bhassler]

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[Fa Xing]

Personally, I don't consider the TGU to be much of a strengthening exercise at all. If you have good mobility and alignment, your skeleton takes all the weight and only requires minimal muscle activation. But that's for me, and others will have vastly different experiences. There are a lot of good suggestions here, and ultimately it's not about "best", it's about finding what fits one's own needs and circumstance. The only way to know for sure is to pick something that sounds interesting and try it.

I see what you're saying but if you follow that to it's logical end that means anyone can lift a 32kg (~70lb) kettle bell without necessarily building up to it (knowing the technique notwithstanding). This just isn't possible though because I've had clients/patient incapable of doing it with no KB in their hand. It very much requires a degree of strength, but it's the whole body moving as a unit and not a particular area.

I do agree that there is no best exercise out there, though. For me, I'm always out to find that exercise that gives me the most bang for my buck.