LHPF - training methodology?

[Yeung]

LHBF trains to contain all eight methods in every move.

By neutralization in the martial sense is to neutralize the incoming force of the opponent and not neutralization within the self.

You mentioned Wan Tin Hung, you don't mean Cheng Tin Hung 鄭天熊?

[MaartenSFS]

And here I was hoping to get some actual information on how LHBF is TRAINED...

I have seen the style around these parts occasionally. From what I've seen, it is a lot like another style of Taijiquan. One ex special forces bloke spends half a morning doing slow-motion walking. You forget he's there, that's how slow he is. When he does his form it's painfully slow. Another master does Wu style Taijiquan and his is very, very slow as well. Not that doing a form slow is Taijiquan. I have seen another practitioner, several years ago, doing his form and drew my conclusion there. Same with what I've seen of Heihuquan.

According to my Shifu the slow-walker has some of the best Gongfu around and is almost impervious to any attack (can take a lot of punishment with seemingly no effect). Not my cup of tea, though..

[Yeung]

Yeung, your reply is very amusing to me
because it purports that you know me better than i know myself

you observations are wrong, LHBF and its practitioners have nothing against "neutralization".
in this case, what is the meaning of methodology?
it is asking for a description of path that LHBF practitioners have walked on
do you know LHBF?
do you practice it?
do you teach it??
if not, name dropping xingyi, taichi, yiquan have no meaning

your writing is a mess of confusion.
i say again, if you do not know, say so
do not assume
it is laughable

This is interesting from someone did not tell anyone the type of qigong is being practiced.

I worked with Lung Wah 龙华 between 1989 and 2010 on a number of practical and theoretical aspects of LHBF and its development. or simply the application of Internal Martial Arts to fighting and martial sport. It is not name dropping, it is a genuine attempt to differentiate LHBF from Xingyi, Taiji, Bagua, and Yiquan.

Very sorry about the confusion, and I hope further discussion with clear up some of the difficulties.

[suckinlhbf]

Yeung
The eight methods already include nutralizing incoming force and oneself. And 拳無三下。It's 尹天雄。
Lung wah was one of the best and very open to share. Twenty years time with him should know a lot. Can you share the discussion on differentiating lhbf and other arts?
I will be in Hk this December. We should go yum Cha.

[Wanderingdragon]

[quote="MaartenSFS"]And here I was hoping to get some actual information on how LHBF is TRAINED...

Yes unfortunately,as usual the discussion has devolved into the usual blather of technical terms and historical conjecture, intellectual posturing

[Strange]

Yeung, i do not know what you mean when you say "worked"
it can have many different meanings and their meanings may be proffered as and when is convenient
I noticed that you did not answer any of my questions directly
as such, i shall assume "worked" does not include any of what i mentioned

but do not misunderstand me, i know that there are martial arts scholars who just do book
research on the different types of martial arts.
its all good

in your "work" between, 1989 and 2010, did you perchance come across the following：
走避开合顺 翻腾定化粘
搬扣劈搂撑 截拿崩推缠

i think most likely you have not
if you did you would not have said that LHBF practitioners do not advocate "neutralization"

you can make comparison all you like
but to ppl who practice, like me, the difference would be like night and day.
if you are making a genuine attempt to differentiate your mentioned different types of martial arts
what are your research findings so far?
what are you comparing? origins? martial principles and theories?
internal strength cultivation methods? fighting techniques and principles?
evolution and changes through each generation? historical, cultural, economic background that impact the martial arts?

[Strange]

yes many want to learn
but few want to take the simple, direct and honest path of asking respectfully

like Laozi said:
my Way is broad and flat; easy to travel on
but people just choose to walk on small, narrow, crooked paths full of hidden dangers

[suckinlhbf]

get some actual information on how LHBF is TRAINED

I don't know how others learn LHBF. I started with the Zhuji. Half year to learn the first half, another half year to do it, half year for the second half, and then many years to refine. In between, learn zhang, other forms, drills, push hand, wooden ball. Learn from another teacher through sparring, didn't focus on form, but focus on wooden ball. We gotta to know what we are doing and what for, or its a total joke.

[Wanderingdragon]

http://www.liuhebafachuan.com/videos.html, really had high hopes for this link but for some reason they can't seem to get the history complete.

[Wanderingdragon]

Questions for the understanding and development of sound structure. For open ended angles which is more structurally supportive, acute or obtuse ?
if an appendage of a structure rises above the height of the core structure, does it support the center or jeopardize the integrity of the structure ? again which offers the greater resistance and flexibility an acute angle or an obtuse ? finally , how do you topple a ball ?

[Wanderingdragon]

If you understand these realities you can recognize the efficacy of an form in this case Zhu Ji, as well as the understanding of the proponent

[suckinlhbf]

acute or obtuse

greater resistance and flexibility an acute angle or an obtuse

Actually, I don't really care about those. My approach in training is to get what I want. Say training on a straight punch, I would first make it clear what do i want to do. Punch with a distance, punch after touch with no distance, punch to break the bone, punch to hurt the organ or punch through the body? After that, just do it and keep on putting in those ingredients that can help serving my goal. Those ingredients may come from the teachers, own experience and knowledge, or anywhere. With the practice, the angle, structure, stepping, flexibility, co-ordination, power, etc will kick in. The hardest part is how active I have to engage myself into. I would prefer the approach on doing it and let the body tells and follows what I want to do. It is the LHBF song and Five Word Song that bring me into this approach.

how do you topple a ball

Its a ball. No matter how do you topple it, the ball is still there as a ball. Nothing changes.

[I-mon]

Strange, I have noticed in the last several threads that you have been talking down to people who appear to be several decades older than yourself, and who have apparently been practicing martial arts since around the time that you were born - RobP with his 25 years of Taijiquan, before he switched to Systema which he has been practicing for ten years or so, and now our new forum member Yeung who has been practicing internal martial arts since at least 1989, and quite possibly for much longer than that. If I'm not mistaken, you yourself are in your early 30's. You seem to hold Chinese martial arts traditions very highly, so I would suggest that you could start by talking to your elders with respect, whatever martial arts they practice, and whatever their opinions might be.

[Strange]

I-mon, how i talk is between me and the person i talk to
the person i talk to will understand
it is not any of your business

you say Yeung have been practicing since 1989
please re-read what he said carefully and do not come to a wrong understand
he said "worked" with Lung Wah and he insist that it is no name-dropping
so far he did not say he practice
i know because i asked him a direct question and he did not give a clear answer

so can you tell me from where did you understand that he said he practice martial arts, specifically LHBF, since 1989

you are mistaken, i am not in my 30s
so what you said are all based on the unrelated, unconfirmed or just plain incorrect
so please

[Wanderingdragon]

LHPF is the essence of understanding true physical nature. If a straight punch is met by the proper angle it will never penetrate, no matter the persistence of your attack, it is wasted energy and a exercise in futility. Understanding LHPF means to only hit by reason , what you want, cannot be had if you do not seek open passage, to seek such without open passage, to strike without reason is the antithesis of what LHPF purports to be.