Rotations in movement

[Bodywork]

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[jaime_g]

In a very very simple level, just for health:

Lateral loss while closing the knees means that you are experiencing knee valgus. That's dangerous for your knee in many ways, but if anyone wants to defend that as a good thing, I will listen.

[charles]

Beautifully stated.

Few people will disagree with that statement.

Where it goes to hell is HOW one achieves what you have stated. Egos, lineages and styles enter into the picture and everyone goes off in a different direction. Not all roads lead to Rome; not all paths lead to the top of the mountain.

[Bodywork]

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[D_Glenn]

What does 'Central equilibrium' mean to you? Are you referring to what those words mean in English or are you talking about 'Zhongding'?

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[yeniseri]

Generally, it depends on the sport!

Even baseball waist mechanics and a {lesser-e relative term here) sport of golf, requires some degree of waist rotation. Wrestling, judo, etc but the better exponent uses his body'd level of conditioning and training to attempt to incorporate and make their 'game' better.

[amor]

These rotations are exact and difficult to do as the tightness in the hips and knees will pull you out of line (the OP's videos show this regularly). This is one of the main reasons that the loosening of the joints is so often mentioned in the arts. An increased range of motion of tendon/muscle/fascia chaining -done in the appropriate directions- produces a pronounced; mass x acceleration. and this is not acheived in normal athletes.
*Note
Again, it isn't all about power either. It is producing power, while retaining central equilibrium that is the defining difference. It makes aiki in fluid movement.

I would say the difficulty is not in loosening the hips and knees, its mainly in the upper ribs section getting it to fill the armpits evenly not one side too much one side too little which will really depend on how well you can line up the scapulae on the ribs and will be hampered if there is any tightness in the intercostals especially lower ribs which usually is tight due to diaphragm being there and in most people its tight.

But this central equilibrium you mentioned is about keeping the chest sunk to allow rotation which will automatically try to pull one side back into spinal extension, but your not allowing that otherwise you would be offline. So it's a constant change between phases of flexion/extension which gives you a rotational but vertical or rising quality to the movement. Is that correct?

Must admit anyway its refreshing to hear all this from a purely mechanical perspective rather than the usual chinese terms such zongding etc. which im sure everybody can invent a hundred definitions of what that means to them.

[Bodywork]

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[Franklin]

I wouldn't agree that the chest needs to be sunk. Even more so, that it needs to be sunk for rotation. The chest works with the upper back to join the lower back to make a bow. Hence, Six curves, five bows
Too many ICMA people I've met have sunk chests and it prohibits better freedom of movement. While it never really rises, it can join the spine to make a fuller bow, informing the arms. If you think of a bow coming down the spine and informing the legs.... How would it extend upward and inform the arms?

Loosening:
Sorry to disagree. Maybe YOU found certain things easier. I've taught a couple thousand people over the years and in my view
1. Tightness through rotations and loss through knees, hips, shoulders and elbows is difficult for the majority of people to work through.
2. Rotation of the trunk leaves them split from groin, floating ribs to shoulders. You can't really use the pure power of the legs to the spine to the arms when you split yourself along the way. And you will never make dantian/ hara work.
3. Making these connections and using them together is first done systematically and you work on a total looseness in the connections.
4. Getting everything connected and free, then leads to acceleration with and through the joints in vertical translations.
Otherwise all your connections, bows, and rotation can result in random losses system wide or just locally. It all contributed to people being off lined and handled as they really never acheived equilibrium through yin yang (Aiki-in-yo-ho)
It's fun watching people try to produce yin yang in a joint.... They are clueless. It's push pull all the way.

I agree about terminology
Whether its Chinese, Indonesian, Indian, or Japanese, terminology?
I've used them all but hey... If you can't explain it in mechanical terms.... How can you say you can do it?

Bodywork

I know you stated previously that you won't post any videos of yourself..
curious if there is anything floating around the web in video format- that is a bit representative of what you teach (not just personal written testimonials..)?
you said over the years you have had thousands of students...
just curious... what your method of training consists of..

and if its a japanese system of body development
it would be interesting to see how it compares to chinese methodology...

Franklin

[D_Glenn]

Here's a good article about Fangsong: https://taiji-forum.com/tai-chi-taiji/b ... -s-skills/

The key point being that you have to strengthen the legs before you can fangsong the leg joints-

As each part of a joint is loosened, other parts of the body assume the workload of holding the body. In the beginning, this is mostly felt in the legs. Loosening the hips a little brings a significant additional workload onto the thighs. Until the legs become used to doing this extra work, no more loosening of the hips can be learnt. Loosening the hips a little makes the legs work much harder. Practicing with this extra work in the legs makes them stronger. When they have been strengthened in this way and are used to this extra work, then more loosening can take place. There is a saying, to gain taiji gong fu, go to bed with tired legs and wake up with tired legs. In other words, loosen the hips so the legs work so hard that even in the morning they are still tired.

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[Bao]

I wouldn't agree that the chest needs to be sunk. Even more so, that it needs to be sunk for rotation. ...
Too many ICMA people I've met have sunk chests and it prohibits better freedom of movement.

Agreed to 100 %. Sinking the chest is such a misunderstood concept! especially in tai chi. There should be movement and mobility. Not a fixed position of any part of the body.

Good to see others preaching against the choir.

[windwalker]

Must admit anyway its refreshing to hear all this from a purely mechanical perspective rather than the usual chinese terms such zongding etc. which im sure everybody can invent a hundred definitions of what that means to them.

Really not true, Zongding is what it says it is and understood in that way
by anyone who uses this terminology.

Asking for explanations in mechanical terms with out showing it seems like
a poor way of trying to either explain or say something.

There are countless clips of noted Chinese masters explaining this and showing it.
As Franklin noted, it would be interesting to see how this compares to Chinese methodology

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw43Ox1 ... voedGO7m3C

many of the answers to questions posed by the OP can be found in this one clip.

[willie]

Must admit anyway its refreshing to hear all this from a purely mechanical perspective rather than the usual chinese terms such zongding etc. which im sure everybody can invent a hundred definitions of what that means to them.

Really not true, Zongding is what it says it is and understood in that way
by anyone who uses this terminology.

Asking for explanations in mechanical terms with out showing it seems like
a poor way of trying to either explain or say something.

There are countless clips of noted Chinese masters explaining this and showing it.
As Franklin noted, it would be interesting to see how this compares to Chinese methodology

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw43Ox1 ... voedGO7m3C

many of the answers to questions posed by the OP can be found in this one clip.

English!

[Bhassler]

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[windwalker]

English!

haha BTDT

its dosent work,,,I had someone translate one of his clips awhile back.
It was not what some wanted to hear, nor what others could understand,
or what many could do...

all questioned many mocked it....

I thought it would be rather obvious what he was showing
cross body alignment, equal and opposite movement, intention and action combined
many other things....and very clearly shows this

Rotations in the human form have to have two components; rotation and vertical translation to have true stability and in order to be balanced. This achieves a dynamic, central equilibrium.

its one of the main points he talks about..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw43Ox1 ... voedGO7m3C