Piquan Zhuang Versus Santishi..

[MaartenSFS]

Since I've begun studying Xingyiquan I've noticed some profound changes in myself. Increased stability and a stronger structure are the most pronounced. The first month I tried to learn the Wuxingquan (and Wuhuapao) as fast as I could, when I had time to train for four hours every day. I soon became frustrated, though, and realised that, although I was seeing progress, I wasn't making efficient use of my time. Furthermore, I ended up not liking the forms as much as I initially thought and felt that I have already learned most of the techniques that I liked from other arts.

So, for the second month I have concentrated entirely on Piquan (which includes Zuanquan) with a little bit of Wuhuapao, solo and with a partner when available. Now, I have found that I'm improving much faster than before and I've even decided to not learn much else beyond this and just add Piquan Zhuang (doing Zuanquan and Piquan line drills very slowly) to the core of my system. I also had time last month to put everything that I learned from my previous master together into a very short, two-minute form. What I really needed was to improve my structure and footwork and get a little more Zhijin (straight power) and it's starting to pay off.

So, why Piquan Zhuang over Santishi? Firstly, due to an old foot injury it's very uncomfortable to stand in one position that long. Secondly, it's boring as fuck. I have patience to do a lot of things like hanging off of a cliff for hours photographing a tree frog or getting up at four to do line drills over and over and over, but standing is not one of them! Also, when doing Piquan slowly I'm doing Santishi over and over, with the footwork that I'd actually use in a fight. One of the reasons that I quit doing Taijiquan was because the system lacks efficiency. Xinyiliuhequan, Xingyiquan, Baguazhang etc. get to the point quite fast. Since I studied a combination of those systems and others it's taken some time to put together a cohesive curriculum.

It doesn't make sense for me to dedicate large portions of time to standing (or Chansijin for that matter). Training Piquanzhuang I am training my structure, my root, my footwork and later, after I gradually increase the speed, my Fajin. I have my own version of Zhanzhuang in which only the upper body moves, a little bit like Chansijin but in a fairly high stance and directly applicable to combat (after adding footwork). Piquan Zhuang is a perfect addition to my (and anyone's) system. I think that it's really the core of the art, which is why it's called its Muquan (mother fist). Doing a half an hour of it goes by really fast and the benefits become obvious very soon. The rest of the art can be substituted with pretty much any other art and it wouldn't matter much.

I'm going to spend most of my time with Wu Shifu making fucking sure that I master Piquan (and by inclusion, Zuanquan). The other three I have learned in other arts already... In about four months I plan to begin visiting the local Sanda schools at least once per week and putting everything that I've learned to the test until I leave China at the end of next year..

[yeniseri]

As I think I understand it, santishi is a specific foundation exercise and it can be done across systems whereas piquazhang has it own specific system training requirements.

[Overlord]

As I think I understand it, santishi is a specific foundation exercise and it can be done across systems whereas piquazhang has it own specific system training requirements.

I think he mean Piquan Zhuang~ an exercise to cultivate Piquan power~
Cheers

[Strange]

只怕熟练的一招

[MaartenSFS]

那你最好怕我的劈拳！我已经打了一千多！再给我一年。。。

[MaartenSFS]

As I think I understand it, santishi is a specific foundation exercise and it can be done across systems whereas piquazhang has it own specific system training requirements.

I think he mean Piquan Zhuang~ an exercise to cultivate Piquan power~
Cheers

Yes. I can see where he got confused with a difference of just one "q" and "g".. I've changed the spacing accordingly.

[Josealb]

Yeah, its boring. Its tedious. It seems like moving gives you so much more in return, and you can do more, than if you just stand there. All this can be true depending on the person, and your reasons are understandable.

Stuff like standing is like building a really solid base for a building, and it never ends, you can just reinforce it, and make it stronger, and stronger, and able to hold more stuff on top of it in a very stable way. Moving, technique training, stepping, etc, is like adding rooms, other floors, infrastructure in general. In my experience, ive met people with a lot of infrastructure, but very poor foundation, and they cant really make their stuff work very well, unless the other person has less of a foundation than them.

[Strange]

heh heh
i wish the most stubborn and single-minded perseverance.

some ppl say that you should "bring it"
i try to do it everyday but it just occurred to me that this thinking is wrong
cos you still need a conscious effort to "bring"
oh no, we're dealing in martial arts and its a dangerous place for wrong thinking.
i think the correct way is that "it" follows everywhere you go, like a shadow

[Bao]

So, why Piquan Zhuang over Santishi? Firstly, due to an old foot injury it's very uncomfortable to stand in one position that long. Secondly, it's boring as fuck. I have patience to do a lot of things like hanging off of a cliff for hours photographing a tree frog or getting up at four to do line drills over and over and over, but standing is not one of them!

If you can't do for an injury it's reasonable to change an exercise to another. If it's just because of boredom you can practice Santishi while watching TV or something. My second XY teacher used to do that.

Also, when doing Piquan slowly I'm doing Santishi over and over, with the footwork that I'd actually use in a fight.

Interesting... What kind of footwork? When you practice piquan you are supposed to go lower than what feels "natural" and "comfortable" in order to practice rooting skill. When you fight, you would probably use a higher stance. So what you mean is that you took away Santishi after one month and practice piquan higher than normal. Do you think that your piquanzhuang is enough for rooting skills?

One of the reasons that I quit doing Taijiquan was because the system lacks efficiency. Xinyiliuhequan, Xingyiquan, Baguazhang etc. get to the point quite fast. Since I studied a combination of those systems and others it's taken some time to put together a cohesive curriculum.

IME, it depend on the teacher. Some XY teachers will have you standing for 6 month, and after that the five elements only for the following two years. Bagua can be taught as slow as well. Some Taijiquan teachers will move very fast to push hands and applications practice.

I usually put people in front of a bag or use a kicking protection to practice punching one of the very few first classes. People usually don't understand this, but I believe that this is a great way to start studying tai chi principles as whole body movement, and practicing internal calmness and relaxation under pressure. People think that Qi must come first. But in tai chi, it's proper functional use of movements that moves the Qi.

It doesn't make sense for me to dedicate large portions of time to standing (or Chansijin for that matter).

You are entitled to your own opinion.

[san5324]

Maarten, I'm quite curious, how many different versions do you practice? I love the different feeling when I practice the 5 different versions my teacher taught me.