the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

General fitness is inherently more practical then arcane martial arts skills. As a hobbiest, running for the bus, or climbing the stairs without having to sit down are far more practical skills.

grzegorz wrote:I work a ton and I don't have a lot of time right now to attend regular group sessions so I mostly do a boxing/kettlebell routine these days. It occurs to me that it is not enough for competitions or anything but that dealing with an athlete in a fight can't be good. Almost to the point where I am becoming convinced that this is the edge that top fighters have. Obviously skills are skills but without fitness then forget about it.

Why don't you ask here.

Xingyiquan - Baguazhang - Taijiquan

No wonder why these arts are degrading so fast...and furiously.

No wonder why these arts are degrading so fast...and furiously.

why are the arts degrading so fast?
who says they are?

windwalker wrote:

No wonder why these arts are degrading so fast...and furiously.

why are the arts degrading so fast?
who says they are?

some people are doing these arts because of a spiritual belief.
Some for health and happiness.
Some for limited martial and social reasons.
Some for just martial in mind.
Some all the above.

i believe a lot was lost. But there are people out there who take it very seriously.

willie wrote:

windwalker wrote:

No wonder why these arts are degrading so fast...and furiously.

why are the arts degrading so fast?
who says they are?

some people are doing these arts because of a spiritual belief.
Some for health and happiness.
Some for limited martial and social reasons.
Some for just martial in mind.
Some all the above.

i believe a lot was lost. But there are people out there who take it very seriously.

And how can we know it was ever anything but?

True, nobody is training to defend their village anymore, and that itself means it's going to be debased a bit. Sport fighting is a bastardization of the arts.

People are doing their thing. Maybe somebody is taking it further the way YLC did right now but you'll never hear about it.

oragami_itto wrote: Maybe somebody is taking it further the way YLC did right now but you'll never hear about it.

Haha...
Maybe you didn't hear about it...

I'll forever mourn the loss

My view is that if you practice a traditional IMA system (i.e., an old-school system that has not been watered down) correctly and diligently, it will provide you with the level of fitness needed to utilize it effectively.

I too think that if the IMA system is not watered down, it can provide the baseline level of fitness needed, if it initially has components to build fitness. I think it's also important to acknowledge that the baseline fitness and strength of masters of the past could also be partly due to other parts of their life too. YLC was said to have had very strong arms from the manual labor he performed throughout his life, yet some IMA guys today would warn against lifting heavy stuff. Fu Zhen Song used to work out with a heavy stone ball and heavy weapons, i.e. functional weight training etc… Beyond the martial arts that were pasted down, and the documentation and 2nd or 3 hand accounts, it's hard to know the full extent of what was practiced by these masters of the past.

oragami_itto wrote:
nobody is training to defend their village anymore, and that itself means it's going to be debased a bit. Sport fighting is a bastardization of the arts.

People are doing their thing. Maybe somebody is taking it further the way YLC did right now but you'll never hear about it.

I don't see sport fighting as a "bastardization of the arts". I see it as an opportunity to develop parts of the arts, and parts of the person as a fighter. Just because someone participates in sport fights doesn't been they can't train the too deadly to spar with techniques or use them at the right opportunity. While there may not be a lot of people training to defend their village, there are plenty of people training to use it on the job, like bouncers, who face physical conflict on a regular basis. I see sport fighting as a training tool, just like sparring in your school, or solo training, or cooperative training. It has its place, and if used properly, can greatly enhance the other aspects of your training and reveal a lot about you as a fighter and things you need to work on.

me thinkin`, that generally speakin` , answer is - yes it is,
you just use different vehicle on the way.
It can be kb and randori ,pure IMA exercises or something completely different ...
Generally you are not close in one kind of activity all the time, change variations is the key to keep you vigorously interested , live and fit, until will saddle the crane

Fubo wrote:

oragami_itto wrote:
nobody is training to defend their village anymore, and that itself means it's going to be debased a bit. Sport fighting is a bastardization of the arts.

People are doing their thing. Maybe somebody is taking it further the way YLC did right now but you'll never hear about it.

I don't see sport fighting as a "bastardization of the arts". I see it as an opportunity to develop parts of the arts, and parts of the person as a fighter. Just because someone participates in sport fights doesn't been they can't train the too deadly to spar with techniques or use them at the right opportunity. While there may not be a lot of people training to defend their village, there are plenty of people training to use it on the job, like bouncers, who face physical conflict on a regular basis. I see sport fighting as a training tool, just like sparring in your school, or solo training, or cooperative training. It has its place, and if used properly, can greatly enhance the other aspects of your training and reveal a lot about you as a fighter and things you need to work on.

Sparring is definitely an effective training tool.

ps
this eye gouging and rippin` off the groin is too narrow minded for my taste

Let’s start the exploration of the use of intention by investigating how what you think of can affect how your body reacts and moves.
The first thing every student learns is how to relax. Every new student, especially those who have learned Tai Chi before, thinks they know how to relax.
But after trying Intention Exercise 1 they found that their conception of what relaxing really is about is flawed. To relax on an external level is not difficult but to relax internally, to the level that is useful for the practice and application of our Tai Chi is much more challenging.

https://mastertaichitoday.com/2015/07/0 ... intention/


What has been described as being fit, will not help one to meet the type of fitness that taiji requires.
It starts out with the wrong premise about the what is being developed the how and why.

You either got it or you don’t; when you do it will manifest itself in many other things that you do.

like daily activities that some have mentioned

If you achieve a sufficient level of relaxation you will feel that you are very light and susceptible to gentle swaying.

To stop the swaying we use our intention to settle the body by using a mental weight. In the traditional teaching of Grandmaster Wei we call this the bell clapper line. Here I am presenting a much simpler, intuitive idea of what the bell clapper line really is; an idea which if you try it a few times you can feel something so that you know that the Yang style principles of the internal are real.

https://mastertaichitoday.com/2015/07/0 ... -the-body/

The crux of the matter is time, one can use their time to be “fit” in the general sense of the word
or one can use it to train to be “fit” in accordance with taiji principles.

For many they never achieve the true level and doubt it when presented in this medium.
This is confusion which is generally cleared up when one

Finds an IMA teacher with real skill sets

I can't recall a single young tjq teacher back in the day who wasn't "fit" in the conventional sense. The difference was how he got fit. It was by doing tjq full time seven days a week. Even if it wasn't the intent, it was the result. YMMV.