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So there, why doesn't he do it to Bill? Why only students who have been training with him find three or more years? That's the part that strains credibility.
I'm a bit surprise that WW use this as a example of Qi. I thought you you understood this kind of feat as use of "Yi". But as background maybe you meant to say that it's an example of what he says about how "Qi-masters" are perceived by common Chinese people, as tricksters performing magic for money... .?
Though, I must admit that the guy in the lecture is wrong by stating that "Qi" has never meant anything close to the English word "energy". He doesn't say exactly this, but he is referring to how the character "Qi" is understood in modern language and in Chinese dictionaries. And he says that "Qi" has no meaning close to energy. However, historically Qi can in fact mean just "energy". For the Songxue, or Neo-Confucianism, Qi was the energy formed by Principle/Li. Qi was there right in the beginning of the creation, transcending everything and shaping the material world by Li. http://warpweftandway.com/li-qi-and-tra ... fucianism/ And of course, earlier Qi is mentioned in daoist neidan practice as something circulating inside the body. So he is not really correct by his statement that Qi does not mean "energy". Though of course in modern Chinese "Qi" is just a character used to build other words.
Last edited by Bao on Fri Dec 30, 2016 5:49 am, edited 2 times in total.
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog) - Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert - To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
“I'm a bit surprise that WW use this as a example of Qi. I thought you you understood this kind of feat as use of "Yi". But as background maybe you meant to say that it's an example of what he says about how "Qi-masters" are perceived by common Chinese people, as tricksters performing magic for money... .?”
It was an example of “his” Andrew Nugent-Head's, past / background to show where some of his thinking might have started. You seemed to be confused between the interaction of “yi” and “qi” what they are and how they're used.
“So there, why doesn't he do it to Bill? Why only students who have been training with him find three or more years? That's the part that strains credibility.”
There’s a couple of reasons I could go into of why? The most basic one is that the master or masters like him don’t want to have to use their own qi. It’s much easier if they can just influence the others “qi” 3 years might be his way of saying until they've built up enough over supply of it. I’m sure this is just something he said to strangers. The teachers that I know would have no problems demoing it on anyone if they felt they were truly serious about it and felt there would be no health risk for the one demoed on.
In this case he’s being filmed why take a chance with an unknown. The demo was part of the Bill Moyers series on it. The teacher has since went home, may he rest in peace
The question for the western science is “are they right or are they just deluded”
Done a while ago. It also talks about health and qi touching on some of the topics here.
When Bill Moyers visited China to explore the mysteries, and the healing potential, of Chinese medicine for his acclaimed PBS series "Healing and the Mind," he sought out David Eisenberg as his guide.
ONCE when he was living in China, David Eisenberg relates, ''a group of schoolchildren gently took hold of my arms and walked me across the street. Having noticed my blue-gray eyes, they assumed I was totally blind and wanted to escort me through the traffic.'' But to judge by ''Encounters With Qi,'' a vivid glimpse of traditional Chinese medicine, Dr. Eisenberg is far from blind.
A doctor of internal medecine and a clinical research fellow at Harvard Medical School, he began studying Chinese as a college freshman. He was the first American medical exchange student in the People's Republic of China, spending 1979-80 studying traditional Chinese medicine. Besides being tutored in the subject, he worked alongside his instructors in clinics specializing in acupuncture, massage and herbal therapy (the main traditional mode of treatment).
His experience provided him with anecdotal evidence suggesting that such methods are sometimes of considerable value in controlling discomfort and may also aid in managing disease.
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Last edited by windwalker on Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:56 am, edited 6 times in total.
windwalker wrote:It was an example of “his” Andrew Nugent-Head's, past / background to show where some of his thinking might have started.
His thinking about what? The thinking he expresses in the lecture is based on studies in Chinese language and culture.
You seemed to be confused between the interaction of “yi” and “qi” what they are and how they're used.
I know exactly how the characters are used in philosophical contexts. The problem is how to explain what happens and the reason for doing some of the things you see.
“So there, why doesn't he do it to Bill? Why only students who have been training with him find three or more years? That's the part that strains credibility.”
There’s a couple of reasons I could go into of why? The most basic one is that the master or masters like him don’t want to have to use their own qi. It’s much easier if they can just influence the others “qi” 3 years might be his way of saying until they've built up enough over supply of it. [/quote]
There is no source whatsoever in classical texts that qi could be drained, lost or used up by using it. I've read many times people saying that "you must first develop qi to be affected." It's always an after construction, something that is never said in the vids or demos, but an explanation after someone asks or is critical. If this was true, there's absolutely no point of this kind of "testing". If it's useless against common people, why practice it? Why show it as a skill in a martial arts context?
The teachers that I know would have no problems demoing it on anyone if they felt they were truly serious about it and felt there would be no health risk for the one demoed on.
In this case he’s being filmed why take a chance with an unknown.
So if he is serious he should show it, right? Take a chance on what? Not being able to do it?
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog) - Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert - To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
There is no source whatsoever in classical texts that qi could be drained, lost or used up by using it. I've read many times people saying that "you must first develop qi to be affected." It's always an after construction, something that is never said in the vids or demos, but an explanation after someone asks or is critical. If this was true, there's absolutely no point of this kind of "testing". If it's useless against common people, why practice it? Why show it as a skill in a martial arts context?
If you could do it or had met with anyone would could do it, you would know.
What you’ve posted is not a correct understanding, something that might be better addressed in another thread.
Last edited by windwalker on Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
windwalker wrote:If you could do it or had met with anyone would could do it, you would know. .
You can have the experience of something or believe in something and still be convinced of that what someone else does is crap. And, hopefully, an experience of something wouldn't mean that you automatically come to believe that what everyone do is the real thing.
There are a lot of scumbags everywhere.... Even amongst so called qi-masters. I am certain of that.
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog) - Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert - To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
windwalker wrote:If you could do it or had met with anyone would could do it, you would know. .
You can have the experience of something or believe in something and still be convinced of that what someone else does is crap. And, hopefully, an experience of something wouldn't mean that you automatically come to believe that what everyone do is the real thing.
There are a lot of scumbags everywhere.... Even amongst so called qi-masters. I am certain of that.
Master Shi Ming , was noted for his skill whether one agrees with it or not.
Last edited by windwalker on Fri Dec 30, 2016 8:21 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Who is the “we” why not just “you” If “you“ want to be the LKJ police go for it.
Care to explain a little on Chinese thought or theory by which it’s based on? Then explain why what is shown by many masters is not in accordance with it.
windwalker wrote:If “you“ want to be the LKJ police go for it.
I had criticized LKJ clip here since the Empty Flower time. You believe it's real. I believe it's fake. There is no room left for any further discussion.
Last edited by johnwang on Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Crow weep in the dark. Tide bellow in the north wind. How lonesome the world.
windwalker wrote:Care to explain a little on Chinese thought or theory by which it’s based on? Then explain why what is shown by many masters is not in accordance with it.
Just because something is in accordance with some ancient esoteric "theory", that fact alone doesn't give it practical credence, outside of purely historical/cultural interest. There are many similar examples in the West, things like, for example, demonic possession. There are still people believing in it and practicing it (in many forms even around the world actually, not just Christians/in the West).
Most educated people choose a much clearer explanation of these phenomena by science, but there are still some who prefer to believe in things/the "old way" approach. To each their own, as always.
Speaking of believing in stuff, -- I hope Santa brought everyone something nice this Christmas.
johnwang wrote:I had criticized LKJ clip here since the Empty Flower time. You believe it's real. I believe it's fake. There is no room left for any further discussion.
Yep, it's like a modern person traveling back in time a few thousand years and having an argument with someone that the Earth isn't flat.
This very thread subject is... just...
Anyway...
Happy New Year y'all!
Last edited by Dmitri on Sat Dec 31, 2016 7:33 am, edited 8 times in total.
James O’Keefe, cardiologist-runner in the above article, has since, updated his view. Running five to six days a week and no more than five hours total per week is not generally harmful to your health.
In an article dated June 9, 2015, http://www.runnersworld.com/health/exce ... heir-views, “Excessive Exercise” Proponents Soften Their Views Advocates of controversial theory significantly increase the amount of running they recommend,
In particular, cardiologist-runners Carl Lavie and James O’Keefe have modified the approach and conclusions they took in prior work. Writing in Current Sports Medicine Reports, they seek greater balance by, for the first time, citing studies that don’t agree with the excessive-exercise hypothesis.
Modern strength and conditioning has advanced in knowledge and equipment (i.e., heart monitors, computer analysis, blood work, etc.) Good trainers of combat athletes do not over train their athletes and understand rest and recuperation is important. Combat athletes typically don’t run marathons to train for fights. They might average 5 miles a few times a week and add sprints, on other days, for HIIT training.
Western medicine has advanced from 100 years ago. Some of the past methods are now barbaric, as illustrated in the TV series, "The Knick."
“The Knick” is a Cinemax tv series that follows Dr. John W. Thackery (Clive Owen) and the staff at a fictionalized version of the Knickerbocker Hospital (the "Knick") in New York during the early twentieth century.
Published on Mar 15, 2015 Surgery prior to modern anesthesia and anti-septic technique:
johnwang wrote: There is no room left for any further discussion.
Nah, c'mon. There's always room for having a little bit of fun. This is fun!
windwalker wrote:Master Shi Ming , was noted for his skill whether one agrees with it or not.
I am not desputing that he is famous...
So is this "master"
And so was this guy...
I like this kind of "Qi-performance" better. It has a much better entertainment value.
Last edited by Bao on Sat Dec 31, 2016 8:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog) - Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert - To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
