the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

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Maybe, but also i guess it some part it depends on what we are defining as "self defence".

Dmitri wrote:

willie wrote:he got caught in my heal hook and he didn't even know to tap so his knee popped out

...and you? Didn't even know to release it in time, or didn't even care to?

Real nice way to treat one's training partner.

Use one of the most damaging, hardest to control submissions on a guy who obviously doesn't have a lot of ground experience, humble-brag about it when the submission works.

The lesson here was...? How much time and money it takes for a knee injury to heal?

Ian wrote:

Dmitri wrote:

willie wrote:he got caught in my heal hook and he didn't even know to tap so his knee popped out

...and you? Didn't even know to release it in time, or didn't even care to?

Real nice way to treat one's training partner.

Use one of the most damaging, hardest to control submissions on a guy who obviously doesn't have a lot of ground experience, humble-brag about it when the submission works.

The lesson here was...? How much time and money it takes for a knee injury to heal?

Nope, dude hurt himself trying to twist himself out and damaged his own knee.
It should have been a much more relaxed match, but that's what "he" wanted, not me.
It's not my fault that there are idiots out there teaching in schools that keep on telling their
students lie's. What are the lie's that those school spread. "it's only sport", "It's not real".

When he left we were not upset at each other at all. He knew that it was his fault for
twisting suddenly and violently like that. You and other's seem to forget that "He is an instructor with 30 years experience".
"He makes up his own mind what he is going to try" and it wasn't a pleasant grappling match without striking either.
Get it?
Now i want you to read this line again and put it in your thick head. " he is an instructor with 30 years experience"...
This line as well. "He makes up his own mind what he is going to try"
Now the last thing. The possibility of a hidden agenda?

Dmitri wrote:

willie wrote:he got caught in my heal hook and he didn't even know to tap so his knee popped out

...and you? Didn't even know to release it in time, or didn't even care to?

I knew that you and other's would have childish remarks like this.
perhap's you should get out to a real MMA school and see how it really is, shit happens.

...I do have a training partner...

I'm sure it was worth teaching your training partner, through 6 months off and possible MRI and expensive surgery, that he's being taught wrong.

Very mature.

willie wrote:

Dmitri wrote:

willie wrote:he got caught in my heal hook and he didn't even know to tap so his knee popped out

...and you? Didn't even know to release it in time, or didn't even care to?

I knew that you and other's would have childish remarks like this.
perhap's you should get out to a real MMA school and see how it really is, shit happens.

I guess or definitions of "childish" and "real MMA school" are different.

From your post it seemed like what Ian said, like you were almost bragging about hurting the guy. If he truly hurt himself, by trying some crazy twist out of it instead of tapping, and you were just holding the position - then yes, it's on him. But that's not how your post sounded.

And I'm well aware of shit happening in training, I've been around enough, including Gracie JJ for the past 9 years - that's exactly why I made my silly childish post. I prefer to spend my time and money training and having fun, not on medical expenses and in PT. And foot locks are one of the shortest roads to very serious injury, all the while being one of the least-effective techniques in terms of actual fighting. Almost never throw them in training, because there are much better ways to train (and fight) so I feel my time and focus are better spent on other things - and those other things are also incidentally carry much lower risk of unintended injury. Just my $.02, FWIW. To each their own

Dmitri wrote:
From your post it seemed like what Ian said, like you were almost bragging about hurting the guy. If he truly hurt himself, by trying some crazy twist out of it instead of tapping, and you were just holding the position - then yes, it's on him. But that's not how your post sounded.

And I'm well aware of shit happening in training, I've been around enough, including Gracie JJ for the past 9 years - that's exactly why I made my silly childish post. I prefer to spend my time and money training and having fun, not on medical expenses and in PT. And foot locks are one of the shortest roads to very serious injury, all the while being one of the least-effective techniques in terms of actual fighting. Almost never throw them in training, because there are much better ways to train (and fight) so I feel my time and focus are better spent on other things - and those other things are also incidentally carry much lower risk of unintended injury. Just my $.02, FWIW. To each their own

O.K. your post is quite acceptable.
We used a lot of leg submissions at our school. They are very effective and that was the first time that i ever hurt anyone using them.
I have outstanding control under pressure. He was going wild.
He was alright I think, he walked away limping just a little. But there was a big pop, so yes I was concerned.
I think that the real reason that i haven't heard from him is that his ego is bruised.
One thing is Chen style, he didn't think fajin was real, Didn't think much of Chen and he didn't think the applications worked in either yang or Chen, he thought that
it was justpush hands, as i already have said, it's not...
Second i don't think that he took bjj seriously with some of the constant sport comments he made.
Thanks for your post.

I wouldn't agree to spar with someone like that. Nothing good ever comes of it..

MaartenSFS wrote:I wouldn't agree to spar with someone like that. Nothing good ever comes of it..

No...the guy was very good, i definitely respect him and his style. He wanted to win and that's what he tried to do.
That's what we are suppose to do. Train to a point of failure, determine how and why we failed and fix it.

We are grown up's, We play a hard to play game and sometimes things go wrong.
There are risks.

O.K. your post is quite acceptable.

Oh, Please STFU.

shawnsegler wrote:

O.K. your post is quite acceptable.

Oh, Please STFU.

wow i love seeing these insults, threats, and personal attacks every time i come on here. where's the mod's?
Where's XXXXX now?
what a joke...

Thanks for the responses,.So silat, systema...any others?

As far as BJJ, it might have been taken the wrong way in how I was interested in it for self defense and not sport. The Tim Cartmell video that was posted and another video posted earlier in the thread gave reason to believe that there are certain techniques or positioning one would not choose to use if learning for self defense.

Any other branches in addition to GJJ? If not, are there certain resources in addition to Tim Cartmell’s video and others that provide instruction within the context of self defense?

It's a bit old now but Greg Thompsons book is an interesting read if you want to see how BJJ is applied to a combative context. The bit on weapon retention is pretty interesting.

https://www.amazon.com/H2H-Hand-Combat- ... 1931229430

Catch wrestling styles adapted to MMA and Shooto styles are also worth investigating. Stuff like Erik Paulson's CSW.

People have already mentioned BJJ schools with a heave MMA slant like those derived from Carlson Gracie. Brazil also has Luta Livre which is wrestling style based on catch wrestling..

Combat Sambo is also a thing.

China has Fujian Dog Boxing which has a bit of a ground game in it but its more orientated towards a fighter going to ground in order to tie up and leg lock a standing opponent.

shoebox55 wrote:Thanks for the responses,.So silat, systema...any others?

Ninjutsu..
If you just want traditional, maybe it's for you?