MaartenSFS wrote:The boxers do normal weight training. I do line drills holding dumbells (not a Taiji form - learn to fucking read), Zhanzhuang with sandbags strapped to my wrists, tree, rope and belt shaking, work with bricks, etc. My power comes from being able to use my whole body to punch, rather than isolated muscles, stronger tendons, training specifically for fighting, being able to shake the waist, being able to sink my weight, etc. After I train with weights, I also train without to continue using more muscles than one normally would. If I did all of my daily tasks with weights that would be great too. It's not only about improving strength, but about using all you have.
Paraphrasing assumes that you understand what you are summarising. You don't understand at all. I hope that this clears things up for everyone else..
marvin8 wrote:Published on Feb 16, 2017
A Look Into Anthony Joshua's Intensive Boxing Strength & Conditioning Training - Muscle Maximum:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4hVnLWrViY
cloudz wrote:Show me something that proves stronger tendons contribute to your punching power. You know like sports science; how that works and how much they contribute to power specifically - you know your tendons.. And no, not the equivelent of "my grandad told me".
It will be great to know how you use your tendon power to punch with and how their power is more significant than that of your muscles. Should be fucking hilarious.
Nothing wrong with strengthening tendons, I wouldn't discount some benefits, but I don't think they have very much significance to punching power, maybe other benefits are more signifuicant. But then you overstate what you've probably been told by others just as unqualified to justify yourself and the practices, but what you think just doesn't marry up well with how we understand these things today. Stay stuck in the past for all I care it's your choice, but don't sell your delusions to others please. At least if you're going to convince anyone, do it like people do in the real world; with actual research and evidence. Not old wives tales.
marvin8 wrote:-MaartenSFS wrote:The boxers do normal weight training. I do line drills holding dumbells (not a Taiji form - learn to fucking read), Zhanzhuang with sandbags strapped to my wrists, tree, rope and belt shaking, work with bricks, etc. My power comes from being able to use my whole body to punch, rather than isolated muscles, stronger tendons, training specifically for fighting, being able to shake the waist, being able to sink my weight, etc. After I train with weights, I also train without to continue using more muscles than one normally would. If I did all of my daily tasks with weights that would be great too. It's not only about improving strength, but about using all you have.
Paraphrasing assumes that you understand what you are summarising. You don't understand at all. I hope that this clears things up for everyone else..
What do you mean by, "The boxers do normal weight training. I do . . . "
I have already posted a boxer's strength workout in this thread that includes some of the exercises you mention (e.g., line drills, rope shaking, whole body, etc. Here it is again.marvin8 wrote:Published on Feb 16, 2017
A Look Into Anthony Joshua's Intensive Boxing Strength & Conditioning Training - Muscle Maximum:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4hVnLWrViY
I agree that real CMA should be tested in sparring. However, I don't think you have shown sparring against any notable fighters at the same height and weight as you. In your sparring, I mainly saw windmilling attacks from various angles and over powering opponents. That does not speak of the effectiveness of your CMA techniques, by themselves.
Why not spar Anthony Joshua (in the video), a decent Sanda, or MMA fighter in competition? That way, we can see the effectiveness of your CMA techniques. Otherwise, you are just "talking" as you yourself are proclaiming others are doing.
MMA has or had many fighters with various traditional backgrounds, including CMA and IMA. MMA is already using CMA techniques along with fighting skills. You will discover that fighting skill/ability includes more than just CMA techniques and how you look.
Taste of Death wrote:cloudz wrote:Show me something that proves stronger tendons contribute to your punching power. You know like sports science; how that works and how much they contribute to power specifically - you know your tendons.. And no, not the equivelent of "my grandad told me".
It will be great to know how you use your tendon power to punch with and how their power is more significant than that of your muscles. Should be fucking hilarious.
Nothing wrong with strengthening tendons, I wouldn't discount some benefits, but I don't think they have very much significance to punching power, maybe other benefits are more signifuicant. But then you overstate what you've probably been told by others just as unqualified to justify yourself and the practices, but what you think just doesn't marry up well with how we understand these things today. Stay stuck in the past for all I care it's your choice, but don't sell your delusions to others please. At least if you're going to convince anyone, do it like people do in the real world; with actual research and evidence. Not old wives tales.
Systema's Mikhail Ryabko and Vladimir Vasiliev as well as Dan Harden (bodywork on rsf) teach their students to develop tendon strength for martial arts. You can tell them they are deluded yourself. Vlad and Dan love being called cunts to their faces. You can bring Niall with you. Please film it when you decide it's time to teach them a lesson.
MaartenSFS wrote:The boxers do normal weight training. I do line drills holding dumbells (not a Taiji form - learn to fucking read), Zhanzhuang with sandbags strapped to my wrists, tree, rope and belt shaking, work with bricks, etc. My power comes from being able to use my whole body to punch, rather than isolated muscles, stronger tendons, training specifically for fighting, being able to shake the waist, being able to sink my weight, etc. After I train with weights, I also train without to continue using more muscles than one normally would. If I did all of my daily tasks with weights that would be great too. It's not only about improving strength, but about using all you have.
Paraphrasing assumes that you understand what you are summarising. You don't understand at all. I hope that this clears things up for everyone else..
johnwang wrote:GrandUltimate wrote:If you dont me asking, I'm curious what you would train (according to the same concept mentioned in the first post) if you wanted to be good at throwing people?
My suggestion will be:
1. Spend 6 months on 1 throw and train with your partner (for example, single leg, hip throw, foot sweep, ...).
2. 6 months later use that throw to set up other throws (for example, "single leg, foot sweep". "single leg, inner hook", "single leg, twist and spring", ...)
3. When you can use that throw (or that throw combo) to throw your resisted opponent down 7 times in a role, start your next throw and repeat 1,2,3.
By using 1,2,3, you can grow a tree. How many trees that you can grow in your life time will depend on your effort.
MaartenSFS wrote:That is true Song. ...
marvin8 wrote:MaartenSFS wrote:The boxers do normal weight training. I do line drills holding dumbells (not a Taiji form - learn to fucking read), Zhanzhuang with sandbags strapped to my wrists, tree, rope and belt shaking, work with bricks, etc. My power comes from being able to use my whole body to punch, rather than isolated muscles, stronger tendons, training specifically for fighting, being able to shake the waist, being able to sink my weight, etc. After I train with weights, I also train without to continue using more muscles than one normally would. If I did all of my daily tasks with weights that would be great too. It's not only about improving strength, but about using all you have.
Paraphrasing assumes that you understand what you are summarising. You don't understand at all. I hope that this clears things up for everyone else..
What do you mean by, "The boxers do normal weight training. I do . . . "
I have already posted a boxer's strength workout in this thread that includes some of the exercises you mention (e.g., line drills, rope shaking, whole body, etc. Here it is again.
MaartenSFS wrote:Finally watched the boxing strength and conditioning video. Good stuff. Most of it was for developing entirely different skills, though. Not that there's anything wrong with that. I wouldn't say that all of this stuff was modern training, either. It's just a different tradition.
quote]nteresting reading. Master Ming was known as Master Harry Ng here.
From what I could remember, it was common knowledge that Master Ng had a small school on Powell street where he trained the Chinese Mafia soldiers late at nite. The style that he taught was Hop Gar which has always been associated with the Chinese mafia. In the past, if you mention that you learned Hop Gar, you were a thought as a ganster and regarded as a dangerous person who should not to be associated with.
It was very common in the old days for the Chinese Mafia to hire kung fu masters such as Master Ng, put up a front kung fu school, and have them train their youth gang members known as soldiers.
Master Ng's death was an effort by the Chinese mafia to stop an uprising of their soldiers and gave the excuse that Master Ng could not control his students, i.e., the trained gang soldiers. Originally the soldiers were given an assignment but were unable to complete it but still demanded payment of $2,000 from the mafia for an unsuccessful job performed. If the Chinese mafia did not pay, the soldiers threaten to expose their gambling houses and prostitution houses.
As a result of the threat, the mafia hired a 15 year old kid and was assigned to shoot Master Ng who took four slugs (22-cal.), one in each knee and two in the chest. This sent a loud message to the soldiers-back off or your going to be next.
You might remember my saying that a lot of Mr. Long's students used his White Crane in the streets -- just as there were guys in our later school where were bouncers. But some of Mr. Long's students were street gang members, and a few of them had developed really interesting and unique ways of using White Crane.
As usual, I was pushed into sparring with pretty much anyone who walked through Mr. Long's door, and one of the most interesting of his "older" students was a gang member who had a very tricky way of using the Crane style.
I was warned about this in advance by Ron, so I had a little knowledge to start off with, but when we squared off in the middle of the room, he had a very modified version of the crane horse... so modified that you would never know he was taking up any kind of ready position.
He had a way of moving back and forth that was hard to follow, and completely disguised what he was up to. And he was kind of magical in the way he could draw your attention over "here" then slip quickly into a crane postion and attack you over "there" that was really hard to track. Mr. Long use to say "Don't let the wind blow you."
So, this guy's unique way of maneuvering your attention without telegraphing anything of value, was using his "wind" to move your attention to his benefit. It was quite an experience to spar with him. But this was another example of the ways in which White Crane could be molded to fit a particular need, to accommodate a particular set of assumptions about where you were fighting and why.
It might be fine to sink down into a fancy on-guard position in some cases. In other cases, you might not want to let a potential opponent know anything bout what you are up to decide to unload on him. Those were also the kinds of things we were experimenting with.
But this was another example of the ways in which White Crane could be molded to fit a particular need, to accommodate a particular set of assumptions about where you were fighting and why.
Mar Sik was born in America on March 15th, 1876 in the Stockton Delta area. When Mar Sik was a child his parent’s sent him to Toy Shan County in Canton China. He was about 7 years old when he learned Kung fu from his Uncle, Mar Lock, who had an alterations business. Before Mar Lock owned the Alterations business, he was a Shaolin monk (this was during the Ching Dynasty).
As a monk he was challenged to a fight in which he fought and killed the challenger and was wanted by the government. He hid away from the police and moved back to his hometown in Canton to assimilate into society. He let his hair grow out and no longer dressed like a monk.
Everything Mar Sik learned was from his Uncle. If you look at Mar Sik’s movements you can still taste the flavor of history from the old style Shaolin Kung fu.
On April 18th, 1906 Mar Sik was in San Francisco and witnessed the tragic earthquake. Shortly after the Earthquake, Mar Sik went to Stockton and worked as a kung fu Sifu for the Chinese Tong. One time there were two guys fighting and Mar Sik tried to break up the fight. One of them turned on him. Mar Sik hit the guy on top of the head with a back fist and crushed the guy’s skull and he died.
Mar Sik regretted it and swore that he would never fight again. He was wanted by the police, so he escaped from Stockton and went to Reno Nevada and hid in a Chinese labor camp for seven years.
After returning to San Francisco he was invited to be a Kung fu Sifu for the Chinese Tong. One time he was visiting his friend’s gambling house and the place was raided by the police. They arrested him and thought him to be the owner.
Mar Sik stood up for his friend and went to jail for ten years. Because of his loyalty he was the most highly respected man in the Tong and Chinese community.
Mar Sik passed away in 1973 at age 96. He did not die of illness. All of his friends were gone; he was very depressed and he starved himself to death.
When Lucky Chan took Mar Sik to the hospital the doctor put in an I.V. and Mar Sik kept pulling them out so he could die peacefully.
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