everything wrote:挤 Ji can be translated as squeeze. That is how the Google translates it. I think of it in this sense as "crowd" or "press in" or "squeeze in".
What do you make of this translation in a taijiquan context?
Bao wrote:This means that all names in tai chi chuan have a tai chi chuan specific meaning, and not a general meaning.
Steve James wrote:This means that all names in tai chi chuan have a tai chi chuan specific meaning, and not a general meaning.
And, obviously, that's why everyone in tcc agree.
johnwang wrote:Bao wrote:This means that all names in tai chi chuan have a tai chi chuan specific meaning, and not a general meaning.
This is why only Taiji guys use the terms:
- "carry" a tiger back to mountain.
- "fan" to shoulder.
which make no logical sense.
Bao wrote:I agree. Many names make no sense. The origin of many names are probably different than how they are understood today. For instance, my chinese teacher believed that "ye ma fen zong" should actually mean to separate two wild horses by their mane. Why brush a wild horse mane? Why should a combat technique be named after combing hair? That doesn't make sense. But now this other name makes practical sense, especially for a martial art.
johnwang wrote:If we replace
- carry 抱 by "well fed 饱" (2 Chinese character with the same sound),
- "fan 扇" by "shoulder 肩 (2 Chinese characters look similar).
it will make sense.
- well fed tiger return back to mountain.
- shoulder extend to the arm.
For each main type of force the internal practice is to think one particular acupuncture point closing against (going toward) another. This integration is called He (and in Liu He). In all Ji, we think the jiaji point closing against the yongquan point of front foot.
A closer example for martial art would be you're standing on the edge of a crowded train platform, and someone comes up behind you and try to get closer to front of platform, pushing you off the platform into the track below. That's the sense of ji in martial art.
- "carry" a tiger back to mountain.
- "fan" to shoulder.
Wuyizidi wrote:Bao wrote:I agree. Many names make no sense. The origin of many names are probably different than how they are understood today. For instance, my chinese teacher believed that "ye ma fen zong" should actually mean to separate two wild horses by their mane. Why brush a wild horse mane? Why should a combat technique be named after combing hair? That doesn't make sense. But now this other name makes practical sense, especially for a martial art.
There are lots of mistranslation/misunderstanding within Taiji, even within Chinese - from classical to traditional. For example lots of people interpret Lan Que Wei as "grasp sparrow's tail", which makes no sense, it's actually "closing (like with a traditional paper fan) peacock's [open] tail".
Wild Horse Part [its] Mane is often translated as Part Wild Horse's Mane, is another example. Translated that way, it means us (human) doing something to part the horse's mane. It's not, it's horse parting its own mane by shaking its head and neck, as when they're shaking off water:
John Wang wrote:If we replace
- carry 抱 by "well fed 饱" (2 Chinese character with the same sound),
- "fan 扇" by "shoulder 肩 (2 Chinese characters look similar).
it will make sense.
- well fed tiger return back to mountain.
- shoulder extend to the arm.
John Wang wrote:Did you also mean "Fan the back"?
- This move is not just to move your left palm in a downward half circle as "fan", it emphasizes on to send energy from back to your shoulder, throw your arm, and reach to your hand.
Wuyizidi wrote: . That we don't move each arm by itself, the other arm has to be engaged in a way that stabilizes, makes the movement of the attacking arm stronger.
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