挤 Ji as "squeeze"

[Appledog]

I am mystified as to how there is so much confusion over this.

Ji at it's core is a technique which is trained in push hands. It's #3. Ji counters lu, and is countered by an. This is direct and physical. Whatever else Ji is you have to start here, especially in any sort of explanation of how it is trained. The separation and identification of energies in push hands must be clear and distinct.

There isn't really any kind of intellectual understanding of a mental visualization based jin which is unrelated to or separate from the physical technique as shown in the push hands exercise. You have to start at the beginning with these ones!

[johnwang]

If you use Ji to counter Lu but with the same angle, your Ji can be your opponent's "more Lu". You can use Ji to counter Lu but you have to change the angle. IMO, 45 degree to 90 degree will be proper. That 45 - 90 angle will help you to land your leading leg "behind your opponent's leading leg".

The key point is you have to apply Ji during the beginning of your opponent's Lu. If you wait too long, your opponent's Lu will prevent you from changing that angle.

[Subitai]

Oh my gosh...I hope people aren't "making a Mountain" out of Triangles?

That's the basics.

I learned about those in CIMA from my own sifu. They referred to triangles of alignment and also power. In Xing Yi as well as any good kung fu...it can be used. Actually all over CMA...I just happen to be doing some Xing Yi at the time.

An example of one is: Nose - to front toe (foot) - to front hand "Tigers mouth".

Not to mentions so many other arts using it...especially FMA...tons in that.

[Subitai]

Don't wander off the path - ji is using Jin in a direction away from the body. That's it.

Pretty much...I know it sounds to basic but I learned Ji primarily as "Press" but also "Forward"

[wayne hansen]

I am mystified as to how there is so much confusion over this.

Ji at it's core is a technique which is trained in push hands. It's #3. Ji counters lu, and is countered by an. This is direct and physical. Whatever else Ji is you have to start here, especially in any sort of explanation of how it is trained. The separation and identification of energies in push hands must be clear and distinct.

There isn't really any kind of intellectual understanding of a mental visualization based jin which is unrelated to or separate from the physical technique as shown in the push hands exercise. You have to start at the beginning with these ones!

You are talking about the 4 corner pushing exercise here and you are right
The thing most people miss is it is the neutralisation of the elbow joint that sets up press
When I see most people do this exercise they just follow and don't seek active participation
Each person should be trying to use each of the 4 as a committed attack
It is best to have one person take a turn of attacking with one technique until both have done each of the 4
Then go to freestyle

[wayne hansen]

ah got it now read the link.
he did ok there old bao

though you know it's not just with two hands. it can be one hand striking. it can be an elbow.

the support can be almost anywhere. As long as you have 2 lines of intent in the body (triangulating toward eachother) and it's in the right sort of shape to support it.
the classical yang posture is just like a pro to type example kind of thing.
You can also use the intent to press the opponent as a tactic, beyond yourself - like others have brought up.

ji has quite a lot going for it I would say.

I agree press can be done with any part of the body
One translation I like for press is jostle
I would define that more as coin off a drum head jostle or sneaky as a ninja jostle being the two approaches
Think as press as being the red carpet at the arrival of push
As CMC said
A hand is not a hand the whole body is a hand

[BruceP]

Key-lock, Kimura, Shoulder lock....press

[Steve James]

Key-lock, Kimura, Shoulder lock....press

If you have the standing key-lock, don't you have to let go to press? Anyway, I like the idea of the Kimura to press.

[everything]

I think everyone understands what ji is, as demonstrated in that Push Hands movie clip and in PH patterns.

What I am talking about is: the word (in simple every day use, nothing "abstract") means pressing in, crowding in, squeezing, fill in the space, etc., which is obviously useful in various MA ways. However either

1) people don't know the common word (now you do).
2) they know it but consider those moves and energies to be different
3) know it and consider it all to be similar (think about what the PH movie guy does, as a sort of pulse in a fraction of a second, vs. slowly getting rear naked choke which is a squeeze and literally a triangulation, or say, juji gatame - where your hips really do that triangulation on one point (while applying split), or judo pins, vs. space creation in escapes, etc.). All of that fits the common word use. You press/squeeze/compress/take space, but at different rates of time with different app outcome. At minimum I'd say the common word applies to MA well in all its connotations, but possibly not TJQ. In that case, I don't really care about the TJQ narrow technical term, but would be interested to know if you have a different general and useful term.

I thought this was pretty clear but hopefully if you disagree you only disagree with 1 of the above 3. I think it's pretty understandable if your position is #2. I think it's also understandable if my position is #3. #1 is also understandable but that should no longer be the case.

[BruceP]

No, Steve. Press is the lock

[Steve James]

Well, if ji is squeeze, it has as many connotations as the word because words are ideas not things. Squeezing an orange and squeezing into jeans are not the same thing. But, that's not important. Make it work.

[Steve James]

No, Steve. Press is the lock

Ok, I could imagine the Kimura. The shoulder lock could be done with one hand/arm, but it'd turn into a Kimura. Anyway, no complaints, just curious.

[everything]

more the orange than the jeans. although the jeans are squeezing.

press/squeeze/compress happens in all those apps including the PH movie one and the kimura. same "abstract", different "concrete".

[Bao]

Well, if ji is squeeze, it has as many connotations as the word because words are ideas not things. Squeezing an orange and squeezing into jeans are not the same thing. But, that's not important. Make it work.

All Chinese characters can mean many different things depending on context. Chinese is a contextual language, a simple translation is not enough. This means that all names in tai chi chuan have a tai chi chuan specific meaning, and not a general meaning.

[Steve James]

This means that all names in tai chi chuan have a tai chi chuan specific meaning, and not a general meaning.

And, obviously, that's why everyone in tcc agrees.