Apply Taiji principles on long fist

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Apply Taiji principles on long fist

Postby Bob on Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:30 am

I-mon:

I have never seen the entire form performed but it is my understanding that the clip represents a small segment of the entire form. There is a rumor that somewhere in Taiwan there is a film clip of Liu Yunqiao performing the entire form.

My speculation is that this form influenced this Yang/Wu style of Taijiquan.
Bob
Great Old One
 
Posts: 3102
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 4:28 am
Location: Akron, Ohio

Re: Apply Taiji principles on long fist

Postby wayne hansen on Tue Aug 22, 2017 1:45 pm

johnwang wrote:So is he doing Taiji, long fist, or both?




Double weighting
Independent arm action
Locked joints
It's not tai chi
Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form
wayne hansen
Wuji
 
Posts: 2603
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:52 pm

Re: Apply Taiji principles on long fist

Postby Bao on Tue Aug 22, 2017 1:59 pm

wayne hansen wrote:
johnwang wrote:So is he doing Taiji, long fist, or both?

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guUn8BH7pNM


Double weighting
Independent arm action
Locked joints
It's not tai chi


Exactly! 8-)
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog)
- Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert
- To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
Bao
Great Old One
 
Posts: 5628
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 12:46 pm
Location: High up north

Re: Apply Taiji principles on long fist

Postby edededed on Wed Aug 23, 2017 6:43 am

johnwang wrote:Don't forget that the Taiji system original came from the long fist system. Even today, there is still a long fist form that's trained in the Taiji system.

太极长拳整个套路52个招势,其中势势相承,动作刚柔相济,缓急相兼,松脆迅猛。其技法多为乘势借力,反筋背骨,采捌肘靠,擒跌闭穴之术,打中有拿,拿中有跌,一招一势极重攻防。动作顺序可以打乱拆开单独练习,每个动作都有起承转合,可以互相衔接,它的手法多变,对练习者的悟性和身体的协调性要求较高。

但是,平常所说的太极长拳是杨氏太极门中流传的一个套路。这个套路比杨氏太极拳多了一些动作,演练速度稍微加快,有发力动作。这个套路在杨氏太极门中不同的支系里,并不一致。


I think that this is referring to the "fast form" that is only taught in a few Yang style lines - mainly only that of Yang Shouzhong (Yang Chengfu's eldest son). It seems that Yang Chengfu taught it to Chen Weiming as well, but maybe Chen did not pass it on? Although the name is "changquan," it does not look so much like longfist (slow form looks more like proper longfist maybe!).
User avatar
edededed
Great Old One
 
Posts: 3563
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 12:21 am

Re: Apply Taiji principles on long fist

Postby Trick on Wed Aug 23, 2017 7:50 am

edededed wrote:
johnwang wrote:Don't forget that the Taiji system original came from the long fist system. Even today, there is still a long fist form that's trained in the Taiji system.

太极长拳整个套路52个招势,其中势势相承,动作刚柔相济,缓急相兼,松脆迅猛。其技法多为乘势借力,反筋背骨,采捌肘靠,擒跌闭穴之术,打中有拿,拿中有跌,一招一势极重攻防。动作顺序可以打乱拆开单独练习,每个动作都有起承转合,可以互相衔接,它的手法多变,对练习者的悟性和身体的协调性要求较高。

但是,平常所说的太极长拳是杨氏太极门中流传的一个套路。这个套路比杨氏太极拳多了一些动作,演练速度稍微加快,有发力动作。这个套路在杨氏太极门中不同的支系里,并不一致。


I think that this is referring to the "fast form" that is only taught in a few Yang style lines - mainly only that of Yang Shouzhong (Yang Chengfu's eldest son). It seems that Yang Chengfu taught it to Chen Weiming as well, but maybe Chen did not pass it on? Although the name is "changquan," it does not look so much like longfist (slow form looks more like proper longfist maybe!).

"澄甫先生傳余太極拳復傳余太極長拳其中有數式為太極拳內所無者其餘大槪相同惟轉換之處前後略變易耳所以表示太極本無定法亦無定形太極拳及長拳掤捋擠按採挒肘七種勁均含在內惟缺一靠勁余欲以大捋之靠加入拳內思索數年不得其連貫轉接之法今於無意中忽然得之相接之處竟如天衣無縫竊自欣喜又以太極拳之有左式而無右式者有右式而無左式者均為加入又見河南陳家所傳太極名為舊派者其倒輦猴如摟膝拗步左右退行轉身極為輕靈亦加入名為退步摟膝共約一百零八式取澄甫先生所傳長拳而擴大之不敢言有所發明然於太極之意有增多而無減少有變換而無雷同或者可為學者研究之一助焉丁卯冬月微明識
Yang Chengfu taught me the Taiji Boxing set, then taught me the Taiji Long Boxing set. Within it are several postures absent from the Taiji Boxing set, while the rest of it is mostly the same, except for slight alterations to the turnings. This demonstrates that Taiji is basically as amorphous in method as it is in shape.
Both the Taiji Boxing set and Long Boxing set contain the seven energies of warding off, rolling back, pressing, pushing, plucking, rending, and elbowing, but lack the bumping energy. I wanted to add the bumping technique from the large rollback exercise into the set, and after pondering about it over several years, I still could not find any way to link it in. Recently it suddenly came to me by accident, and the place where it links in is so utterly seamless that I am delighted with it. [Chen placed his bumps into the second series of MAIDEN WORKS THE SHUTTLE, just before each of the four-corner pushes. (See postures 75-86.)]
In the Taiji Boxing set, there are postures performed on the left side but not on the right, or on the right side but not on the left. I have made additions so that postures are performed on both sides. [In this way, almost every posture gets practiced on both sides, though there are still a few that are not.]
We see in the “old style” Taiji taught by the Chen family of Henan that its RETREAT, DRIVING AWAY THE MONKEY is a left & right retreating BRUSH KNEE IN A CROSSED STANCE, turning around very nimbly. I have added this in and called it RETREAT WITH BRUSH KNEE.
Altogether, there are now about a hundred and eight postures [by not counting the BEGINNING POSTURE]. I have taken the Long Boxing set that Yang Chengfu taught me and expanded it. [There are only fifty-nine postures in Yang Chengfu’s list.] I would not presume to say I have invented anything, but that I have added to the Taiji concept without diminishing it, so that there is some variation rather than mere duplication, and it perhaps can assist you in your studies.
– written by Chen Weiming, Dec, 1927"
Trick
Huajing
 
Posts: 312
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2016 1:30 am

Previous

Return to Xingyiquan - Baguazhang - Taijiquan

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest