johnwang wrote:In the XingYi system, the "training" and "fighting" are different.
In
- training, you use body push shoulder, shoulder push elbow, elbow push hand.
- fighting, your hand will go first. Your elbow chase hand, shoulder chase elbow, body chase shoulder.
johnwang wrote:kenneth fish wrote:John Wang: Abbot Heng Yueh 恆月法師 who resided in a small temple on 姆指山 could do this (I learned Buddhism and Lohan Shaolin from him). Henry Leung of Foshou YongChun 佛手詠春拳 could as well. I met several Taiwan White Crane teachers (including one still actively teaching in Jilong) who had that level of skill. Meng Zhaoshun could bring you to your knees or knock you out cold from zero distance. Oh, wait, none of these are "internal" arts, right?Wanderingdragon wrote:when this power is well trained it can be issued from a hairs distance,...
To generate power in
- 3 inch is possible.
- 1 inch is difficult.
- 1 hair distance (0.004 inches) is near impossible.
I assume we are talking about 1 hair distance or several hairs distance here. I had many lunches with Meng Zhaoshun, his wife Fu Shuyuan, and my teacher in Chun Wha San Chan Muslium restaurent. Never heard him ever talked about "1 hair distance power generation".
IMO, the human body has certain limitation. No matter how hard that you may train, there is a boundary that you just cannot go beyond it.
I have meet Karatekas in Japan that almost broke the Makiwara(striking board) in half with powerful punches, and once I met a (Chen)TJQ teacher in Beijing who showed on me some 'scary' Inch and hair distance striking power. But it's all being done on static targets, could they do it in if in a fight, I have no idea.
rojcewiczj wrote:After a recent sparring session , I was struck by the realization that extremely fast limbs are a terrible error in applying whole-body power.
Wanderingdragon wrote: Dr. Fish I'm sure by now you, like I, know internal and external are no more than how one approaches the training.
kenneth fish wrote:John Wang: Meng may not have spoken about it, but he was certainly capable of it (and had no qualms about demonstrating). I think you know Delon Tan - you could ask him about his experience on the receiving end of Meng's demonstration.
rojcewiczj wrote:After a recent sparring session , I was struck by the realization that extremely fast limbs are a terrible error in applying whole-body power. I found my self moving my limbs very fast as my opponents were doing, trying to get in strikes at range and work in knees at close range. There was all this speed and apparent force, but, for the most part, no one was struck powerfully or thrown down. Of course we were just sparring, and so holding back, but still, there was this realization that all that fast movement of the limbs is really only good for moving the limbs, not for effecting your opponent. In fact, moving you limps very fast, in a sort of twitch contraction, can only be done by isolating local muscles which disconnect you to your whole-body power. But when we move our limbs at a relaxed and steady pace they are very much connected and so can convey whole body power very very easily. The torso can be moved quickly but the limps should not be moved as fast as they can be moved through isolation. Distance should be covered with the help of the body movement. Again the torso runs no risk of disconnecting through speed. What is extreme limb speed good for? for show? for sport? All the energy is wasted in making the movement happen and very little is left for your opponent. This thinking is quite a turn around for me and so I would very much appreciate every ones feedback. If you throw something, your hand is always going to move slower than it can with nothing in your hand , and the heavy the thing you throw is, the slower your hand is going to move when throwing it.
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