Internal and Clinch

[johnwang]

Shoulder and hip throws = Pick-Up-Needle

Too many important elements are missing.

- forward bend intend.
- hip bounce up force.
- backward sliding.
- heel up.
- ...

I don't think the "heel up" and "backward sliding" training even exist in Yang Taiji. In the following picture the arrows indicate the "backward sliding". You slide backward to your opponent's position. You let your opponent to fall at your original position.

[willie]

Shoulder and hip throws = Pick-Up-Needle

Too many important elements are missing.

- forward bend intend.
- hip bounce up force.
- backward sliding.
- heel up.
- ...

I don't think the "heel up" and "backward sliding" training even exist in Yang Taiji. In the following picture the arrows indicate the "backward sliding". You slide backward to your opponent's position. You let your opponent to fall at your original position.

There is that backwards sliding in Chen Style

[marvin8]

Shoulder and hip throws = Pick-Up-Needle

Too many important elements are missing.

- forward bend intend.
- hip bounce up force.
- backward sliding.
- heel up.
- ...

I don't think the "heel up" and "backward sliding" training even exist in Yang Taiji. In the following picture the arrows indicate the "backward sliding". You slide backward to your opponent's position. You let your opponent to fall at your original position.

You might do a front pivot, instead.

Judo Mat Lab
Published on Feb 22, 2015

A huge thank you to Fighting Films for providing special permission to use their footage. If you like Judo Mat Lab, you'll love FF's SuperstarJudo.com, which has world class coaching from some of the world's best judoka. New coaching videos are posted every day AND you'll get access to all of FF's past instructional content by Koga, Inoue, Jeon, & Huizinga!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=479P3BnhK3E

BeyondGrappling
Published on Mar 24, 2015:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqU9h-6Ybwg

Nihonden Judo
Published on Aug 17, 2014:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ex8cBgBn2I

[johnwang]

You might do a front pivot, instead.

You are talking about moving in before the hip throw and not part of the hip throw. To move into your opponent, you can use

1. stealing step - move back leg across behind front leg.
2. covering step - move back leg across in front of front leg.

Again, Yang Taiji has "stealing step" such as "fair lady works on shuttle". But I can't find the "covering step" ever used in 108 moves long Yang Taiji form.

[everything]

Judo is a grappling sport. Jujutsu is not, but obviously has grappling.

Taijiquan is more like jujutsu...

with less usefulness and/ or more "internal" depending on the person LOL.

[Ian C. Kuzushi]

Judo is a grappling sport. Jujutsu is not, but obviously has grappling.

I have no idea what you mean here. Obviously, judo has a sporting aspect, but so do many forms of jujutsu/jujitsu/jiujitsu. Shiai is one of the four pillars of judo, but that doesn't make it only a sport. The other three pillars are lecture, forms, and free play.

[johnwang]

The Judo hip throw and Shuai-Chiao hip throw are different.

- The Judo hip throw is "waist lift" that you start from a low horse stance. You then raise up to a high horse stance and lift your opponent's body off the ground. I don't train Judo so if you train Judo, you can correct me on this if I'm wrong.
- The Shuai-Chiao hip throw is to use your hip to bounce your opponent's body off the ground. In order to do so, you have to slide your feet backward on the ground.

When a SC teacher trains his students hip throw, the teacher will require his students to drill the hip throw solo 250 time nonstop. When you do it on the dirt ground, you will create a track by your "backward feet sliding".

[origami_itto]

The Judo hip throw and Shuai-Chiao hip throw are different.

- The Judo hip throw is "waist lift" that you start from a low horse stance. You then raise up to a high horse stance and lift your opponent's body off the ground. I don't train Judo so if you train Judo, you can correct me on this if I'm wrong.
- The Shuai-Chiao hip throw is to use your hip to bounce your opponent's body off the ground. In order to do so, you have to slide your feet backward on the ground.

When a SC teacher trains his students hip throw, the teacher will require his students to drill the hip throw solo 250 time nonstop. When you do it on the dirt ground, you will create a track by your "backward feet sliding".

Do you differentiate between a "lifting" throw, like your hip/shoulder throws and a "leverage" throw or trip, like the hip throw I mentioned? It establishes the hip-to-hip contact point as a fulcrum and just pushes the top half over it.

[johnwang]

Do you differentiate between a "lifting" throw, like your hip/shoulder throws and a "leverage" throw or trip, like the hip throw I mentioned? It establishes the hip-to-hip contact point as a fulcrum and just pushes the top half over it.

Just like in Taiji, Peng and Lu are different. Different throws require different power generation and different body method. This is why how you may move your hands is not important. It's how you move your body and leg that's important.

For example, when you try to lift your opponent off the ground, if you are a

- non-MA guy, you may use your arm, leg muscle, and low horse stance to high horse stance.
- SC guy, besides using low horse stance to high horse stance, you will use your "belly bouncing force".

Many people may say that Yang Taiji has "embracing" that you lift your opponent's body off the ground. But I have never seen any Yang Taiji guys ever train their "belly bouncing" power.

[marvin8]

For example, when you try to lift your opponent off the ground, if you are a

- non-MA guy, you may use your arm, leg muscle, and low horse stance to high horse stance.

There may be various ways to use leverage and timing for any one throw. The following video demonstrates "a forward throw moving backwards," which uses more timing, than low to high horse stance.

Judo Mat Lab
Published on Mar 17, 2015

Analysis of Nomura's spectacular front-pivot ippon seoi nage.
Against Yunbing Jia (CHN) at the 2000 Sydney Olympics

1:29 - skip intro
2:17 - main analysis section

Featuring:
Tadahiro Nomura (野村忠宏)
1997 World Champion & 96, 00, 04 Olympic Champion:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk9opy2U7vw

[origami_itto]

Many people may say that Yang Taiji has "embracing" that you lift your opponent's body off the ground. But I have never seen any Yang Taiji guys ever train their "belly bouncing" power.

I usually think of it as splitting, and knockdowns or trips. It's never "lifting" it's just "tipping" over a fulcrum. Hip to hip, pressure up top, they fall. All of my intention is diagonal downward, never upward during the business part of the throw. Splitting in that the attention is split, attacking low and high simultaneously.

Not sure what "belly bouncing" power is. When I have a partner I like to practice "staff breathing", a wood staff pressed between our bellies, as they breathe out, I breathe in, and we keep the staff steady between us.

[johnwang]

Not sure what "belly bouncing" power is.

[origami_itto]

Not sure what "belly bouncing" power is.

Okay, was what I thought.

[cloudz]

You might do a front pivot, instead.

You are talking about moving in before the hip throw and not part of the hip throw. To move into your opponent, you can use

1. stealing step - move back leg across behind front leg.
2. covering step - move back leg across in front of front leg.

Again, Yang Taiji has "stealing step" such as "fair lady works on shuttle". But I can't find the "covering step" ever used in 108 moves long Yang Taiji form.

Hi John,

An idea for you, if you wish to take it up is as follows, the first taiji form I learnt had this, and I still use it today. In the second round of cloud hands I use the stealing step, in the third round of cloud hands I use the covering step.

I've seen the stealing step used in some Chen style cloud hands forms and the covering step appears in the Wu style fast form cloud hands, which is overtly performed as a low kick. Sometimes I do the kick, sometimes just the step.

[GrandUltimate]

I'm sure that at least wrestlers are aware of head buts(strikes), look at a wrestlers ears.

That's true, the use of the head in wrestling is still pretty new to me, but it definitely seems like it can get aggressive.