Empty Force Challenge

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Empty Force Challenge

Postby johnwang on Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:12 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIULbQ-Hh6g

Will you pay $10,000 to someone who can do this to you? If that person can't, he only need to pay you $1,000. I think that 10-1 ratio is quite reasonable.

Your thought?
I'm still allergy to "push".
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby wayne hansen on Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:49 pm

Why does he have to pay anything
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby johnwang on Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:09 pm

wayne hansen wrote:Why does he have to pay anything

You don't have that much free time to deal with fake people.

Many years ago, there was a Chi Gong master from LA who came to Austin, Texas. He could make a full room of people to walk like zombies (I saw this with my own eyes. Too bad that I didn't record it). People only need to pay him $450. Before his next trip, I challenged him if he could make me to walk like a zombie, I would pay him $10,000. If he could not, he would only need to pay me $1,000. He canceled his next Austin trip and I have never seen him since then.

IMO, to have a life time experience like that for only $10,000 is worthwhile. I'll pay $10,000 to see a real ghost so I will have ghost story to tell for the rest of my life.

When my teacher was still alive, he challenged all Taiji guys in an annual Taiji meeting. He held a piece of newspaper in front of his chest. He asked any Taiji guy to apply empty force on him without touching that newspaper. If that Taiji guy could make my teacher's heart to beat a bit faster, my teacher would knee down in front of that Taiji guy. Not a single Taiji guy in that meeting took that challenge.

My teacher always said, "All my life, I have not be able to meet a true empty force master. What's the chance that you will be able to meet any empty force master in your life time? Those empty force masters just can't suddenly crawl out of a hole somewhere." His comment make good logic sense to me.

In 1980 during a San Francisco CMA demonstration event, a Chi Gong master Liu Mu-Sheng gave a Chi Gong demo and sent people to fly in all 6 different directions. I tried to step on the stage and challenged that Chi Gong master. I was stopped by the host preying mantis master Brendan Lai.
Last edited by johnwang on Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:32 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby Peacedog on Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:10 pm

Go see Gary Clyman in Chicago. He'll do it for free.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby johnwang on Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:38 pm

Back in China, if you dare to claim that you have empty force, people will knock on your door the day after.

Do people still challenge others in 21th centry?
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby C.J.W. on Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:05 pm

IMO, empty force has more do to with hypnosis than martial arts.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby Peacedog on Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:49 pm

CJW,

Very true. The mental energy aspect of hypnosis is a crucial component.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby Bao on Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:06 pm

C.J.W. wrote:IMO, empty force has more do to with hypnosis than martial arts.


There are ways to affect or fool someone's mind. But not all of it is hypnosis. Some of what you see in martial arts circles could very well be what generally is meant by hypnosis. I've read a lot about hypnosis and know about the techniques the hypnotists use, both for therapy and for show. Hypnosis is real, but it's not something that let you do anything you want to a person like magic. Hypnosis is not a spell but can affect people. It has a psychological impact, but still it's very limited in effect. What is mostly meant by hypnosis depends on a mutual agreement. You must be willing to be hypnotised and let the other person wear down what could be called a protective barrier of resistance. If there is not a mutual agreement, the hypnotist can not do anything with you, there is always a cooperative aspect, a willingness to be hypnotised.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby Trick on Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:29 am

johnwang wrote:Back in China, if you dare to claim that you have empty force, people will knock on your door the day after.

Do people still challenge others in 21th centry?

If the challenge only involve empty force it seem rather safe, would not lead to legal issues involving physical traumas a least. Hell, if the empty forcer claim to be a strong one the “ fight” could be done over the distance of let’s say SF & Chicago 8-)
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby middleway on Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:55 am

Windwalker, nows your chance to make a quick 10grand! ;D :-X
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby windwalker on Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:12 am

middleway wrote:Windwalker, nows your chance to make a quick 10grand! ;D :-X


If JW was serious, his challenge should be for anyone to step up and show CMA working in the ring
as practiced by what are called traditional stylist using traditional styles in a public event....So far it remains to be seen.... :-\

As far as EF or kong jin, I"ve always said whether touched or not the process by which it works is the same.
For me its just a small part of a much larger concept put to use.

Most really don't discuss it when its shown in use, they will if its only written about ;)
They like talking about things only written about until its shown :o
Last edited by windwalker on Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby GrahamB on Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:33 am

So, "empty force" claims come to... nothing.... Quelle surprise?
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby windwalker on Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:12 am

johnwang wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIULbQ-Hh6g

Will you pay $10,000 to someone who can do this to you? If that person can't, he only need to pay you $1,000. I think that 10-1 ratio is quite reasonable.

Your thought?


Didn't look at the clip until now.

I notice you didn't use this clip
He talks about the same things and shows it in use.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRlS3fB ... QJz6l6sjem


why is that?

you do know that teacher Gao, is listed
as one of his Notable students


王培生
Wang Peisheng
Born 1919
Wuqing, Hebei, China
Died 2004 (aged 84–85)
Beijing, China
Other names official Name: Wang Liquan,
Buddhist Name or fahao: Yin Cheng (印城)
Nationality Chinese
Style Wu-style taijiquan
Baguazhang
Notable students Luo Shuhuan (骆舒焕),
Gao Zhuangfei (高壮飞)
Last edited by windwalker on Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:37 am, edited 8 times in total.
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby wayne hansen on Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:19 am

No empty force crap from wang just good honest pushing
So is his student better than him or are his trading partners just better actors
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Re: Empty Force Challenge

Postby johnwang on Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:09 pm

wayne hansen wrote:No empty force crap from wang just good honest pushing
So is his student better than him or are his trading partners just better actors

Never heard about Li Jinglin, Yang Chen-Fu, or Chen guys like Chen Xiaowang ever mentioned about empty force. Which hole did those empty force masters crawl out of?

Image
Last edited by johnwang on Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:10 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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