Differences in Santi stance

[SquattingMonkey]

Hi all, this is my first post for a new topic so go easy on me ok. I just started learning Che Xingyiquan and Dai Xinyiquan and I have a question regarding the Santi stance. I have been taught to turn the toe of the lead foot in at an almost 45% angle same as the toe of the rear foot turns out. In all refernces to the Santi stance I have found in books and on the internet they say the toe of the lead foot should be straight not at an angle. I was wondering if any of you practice the Santi stance the same as me and whether or not it is just a variation of Che Xingyiquan and the other styles of Xingyiquan.

[johnwang]

If you

- turn your front toe in, you can protect your grion, and you can also bite your opponent's leg if in "uniforn stance"
- keep your front toe forwad , you are ready to move in.
- turn your front toe out, you can resist againt a low round house kick or a sweep, and you can also bite your opponent's leg if in "mirror stance"

[Aged Tiger]

Hi Monkey,

Well, I was taught to turn in about 30 degrees (roughly), Hebei & Sun style, but 45 is not uncommon from what I've seen. The reason I was given, is to protect the inner shin area as well as the groin by the slight angle.

But, that's just me. I'm sure some of the others here can give a better explaination or reason not to.

BTW, do you use a double or single Tsuan when going to PI chuan and Santi, in the Che style you are learning? Just curious.

Cheers,
Chas

[SquattingMonkey]

Thanks John, that makes a lot of sense. I feel a lot better practicing it that way now knowing it's application.

[Aged Tiger]

If you

- turn your front toe in, you can protect your grion, and you can also bite your opponent's leg if in "uniforn stance"
- keep your front toe forwad , you are ready to move in.
- turn your front toe out, you can resist againt a low round house kick or a sweep, and you can also bite your opponent's leg if in "mirror stance"

John,

By "biting" do you mean trapping or seizing?... best wording I can think of....

Chas

[SquattingMonkey]

Hi Aged Tiger, I just learned Pi chuan a few days ago so don't laugh when I tell you I am such a noobie I don't even know what a single or double Tsuan is. Please explain and I'll do my best to answer you

[mixjourneyman]

In this event its probably best to do what your teacher tells you.
Each different system does things its own way.
You will find out its uses soon enough!

[Aged Tiger]

Hi Monkey,

OK, I should have said "drill", as in the second fist, but as you drill the right hand out before doing Pi chuan with the left hand, do you drill with both hands together, or just the right, with the left at the dantien?

(hope that explains better, sometime I expect everyone to just read my mind, sorry)

Chas

P.S. Keep up the practice every day.

[johnwang]

By "biting" do you mean trapping or seizing?... best wording I can think of....

Put your foot behind your opponent's leading foot and use your shin bone to press againt the insde of his leg.

[Aged Tiger]

By "biting" do you mean trapping or seizing?... best wording I can think of....

Put your foot behind your opponent's leading foot and use your shin bone to press againt the insde of his leg.

OK, I was thinking in the right area.

Thanks for the pic.

Chas

[SquattingMonkey]

Hi Monkey,

OK, I should have said "drill", as in the second fist, but as you drill the right hand out before doing Pi chuan with the left hand, do you drill with both hands together, or just the right, with the left at the dantien?

(hope that explains better, sometime I expect everyone to just read my mind, sorry)

Chas

P.S. Keep up the practice every day.

Oh, I getcha, I drill with both hands together.

[Aged Tiger]

Cool, I actually like both hands better. Makes for a strong entry.

Chas

[Iskendar]

By "biting" do you mean trapping or seizing?... best wording I can think of....

Put your foot behind your opponent's leading foot and use your shin bone to press againt the insde of his leg.

Do you use the term biting for the outside version as well?

[johnwang]

If you use your left leg as in this picture then your shin bone will be against the outside of your opponent's leg. Since it will be easier for your opponent to bend his knee a bit more to release your pressure, it won't give you the same "biting" effect. In SC, there is a different term for that move and that's called Tso which is pretty much like to use a “sticky” sweep to life your opponent’s foot off the ground. You can still use that move to force your opponent to step back.

[Pandrews1982]

All stances in Xing Yi are San ti they are just variations. Step into a Heng/Pao with weight on the front foot - this is san ti but with the "front leg" hiding at the back to avoid being kicked out. San ti is more about body alignment than the actual posture its the way in which the body triangulates to make a "sphere out of triangles" which gives a very strong external structure. Try to count the triangles which are present in the classical san ti shi posture. Front foot, back foot and hip; back foot, shoulder and front hand, front foot front hand and shoulder, etc etc.

The classical "san ti shi" also has a number of variants. As long as the weight is kept back and the knees, hips, shoulders, elbows and hands are all coordinated then the exact weighting shouldn't matter too much. Make sure that the weighting is such hat if someone tries to sweep your front leg you will stay balanced on the back leg, and also do not straighten the front leg too much as it is dangerous to stand in this way in case you are kicked and the knee or leg can be broken or damaged. In terms of the angle, the 45 degree turn is probably to put the knee and upper leg into a position which blocks a kick to the groin. This shouldn't be a problem if you have the foot forward either because the knees should seek each other at all times meaning it should feel easy to close the knees to defend against a kick to the groin or you should just move away using a tui (retreating step).