"What Makes Taijiquan, Taijiquan?"

[mixjourneyman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIavXlDmBMA

Where did you get that picture of me after I ate a squeeze tube of wasabi?

[Ben]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIavXlDmBMA

Where did you get that picture of me after I ate a squeeze tube of wasabi?

Oh Mix, You continue to crack me up, as usual.

[everything]

looks like he attained good health and fitness as an old guy. that is cool, but I don't think there is any knowledge he ever was a fighter or learned anything martial. it seems unlikely given he started studying taijiquan for health at age 47. an inspiration for qigong/taijiquan for health.

his book is rather crappy imho

[mixjourneyman]

I studied with a student of his. Nothing special, but he sure thought there was....

[mixjourneyman]

After I quit with the Jou student I showed the Chen style form to another noted taiji master and he said "Thats not taiji. Maybe Shaolin, or karate, but not taiji".

[edededed]

There may be some truth in what Jou said... but on the other hand:
1. The Yangs (after Luchan) only learned the Yang form
2. Ma Yueliang (of Wu Jianquan style) was one of the best taiji fighters of his generation
3. WHICH Chen style (as we know now, there are more than one)?

[Haoran]

There may be some truth in what Jou said... but on the other hand:
1. The Yangs (after Luchan) only learned the Yang form
2. Ma Yueliang (of Wu Jianquan style) was one of the best taiji fighters of his generation
3. WHICH Chen style (as we know now, there are more than one)?

How could Ma YueLiang be tagged as one of the best taiji fighters of his generation when he obviously embraced a Qi component in Taiji?

[everything]

lol

[Haoran]

[Ben]

jou tsung hwa really pushed that whole cat-thing as being a key metaphor for explaining good taiji behavior to humans/primates.

Why does Jou Tsung Hwa continue to command respect as a teacher/practitioner and an explicator of taijiquan principles? I never had the opportunity to meet him or study with him. Was he really that good?





Besides a metaphorical nod to Zhang San Feng, Jou only ever acknowledged Yuan Tao as a teacher.



Yuan Tao did not teach Chen style. Yet somehow Jou "learned" Chen to the point where he felt qualified to teach it . . . and then somehow absorbed enough of the essence of other styles to dismiss Wu Jianquan's taiji as a flawed lesser derivative of Yang style, and Sun as a hopeless hodgepodge.

Was Jou really that good? Or was it the fact that he was Chinese that glossed over the gaps in his personal training history and the leaps of faith required to cross the chasms in his reasoning offered in support of the prima facie asininity of his assertions about taiji styles and training?

His theories were simple though sometimes controversial. The practice of taiji should follow the evolution of the art. Chen Form(s) should always be studied first, its principles understood and mastered. Only then should the Yang Form be studied, for only by mastering Chen could Yang be truly understood. The final stage of evolution was expressed in the Wu/Hao Form, which internalized the principles to its subtlest nuances. Beyond that was pure mind method. These, the “four classic forms,” as he considered them, comprised the heart of his taiji study and teachings. At the same time he made no secret of how he felt about the forms outside of these four. The Wujianquan Form was a less advanced derivative of the Yang Form. The Sun Form was a redundant hodgepodge of the three internal arts. Weapons forms were often learned too early in a student's taiji education -- a waste of time that could be better spent in practice and understanding of the principles. All other variants were simply a distraction from the originals.

http://www.taichifarm.org/Teachings_of_Jou_Tsung_Hwa.htm

I really don't know much about the man but someone I know who is pretty darn good at TJQ told me once when JTH did form it looked like a breakdancing chicken...

[everything]

I've learned some form from one of his students who is good at ... doing form.

[everything]

Coming back to this thread in a less cynical mood, I think it's summed up in the part of the article about a yang force from A meets B's yin which sends the yang back around to A. Seems summed up in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=423 Not sure that skill's not in the other CIMA though.