uproot both feet not just one

[everything]

maybe this is only a CMC thing or a Yang thing or whatnot but I was just reading something about uprooting both feet at the same time, not just the front foot, in push hands. know anything about this?

[johnwang]

It will be great if you can take your girl to bed, kiss her and have sex with her at the same time on your 1st date. It will be OK too if you can kiss her on the 1st date and have sex with her on the 2nd date. The difference is whether it takes 1 day to achieve your goal or take 2 days instead. The end result is all the same.

Uproot both feet at the same time if you can. Uproot the front foot first and then uproot the back foot later otherwise. I have always thought this is just "common sense" in our daily life which has nothing to do with CMA styles.

[everything]

lol

[H2O]

It's just one of those things that happens when everything lines up right. I get it every now and then, but never when I try to make it happen. CC Chen could do it pretty much at will though.

It's really not as big of a deal as people make it out to be. It's just one of those cool things that happens from time to time.

[ppscat]

Hi everything,

I practiced tonight just that with my teacher. It's easier when you make your opponent do a step forward first, and so use some of his momentum. Below you can see some clips with some kind of cooperation. In the first the piston is made on the opponent mainly, while in the second in the defender:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iHEdjIcRJU

Here watch at 0:38, 1:34


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZQUaaP4 ... re=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFDjQUrdtAQ


.

[everything]

thanks i know maybe doing this actual thing is not a big deal but i'd like to feel it to get an idea of it for whatever else

[H2O]

It feel kinda cool. When it gets done to you, it feels like you're pushing into a spring and it just launches you out. When you pull it off, it doesn't feel like anything. When I first started making it happen, I thought people were fucking with me, jumping away because I honestly didn't do anything.

[everything]

lol sounds fun at least for laughs, but seems like it should also give you an indicator you have this springiness and to go up-go down thing going right.

[middleway]

fairplay ... that Mr Park in the second video has something very good. Prob the most centred Taiji Push hands guy I have seen.

Thanks

Chris

[everything]

that second video is really cool. gives an idea how this skill should be transitioned/included into an application

[C.J.Wang]

The Park dude's clips have been posted numerous times for the past couple of years here and there. He's got some interesting skill for sure -- very "wavy" comparing to other Taiji teachers I've seen.

[QuaiJohnCain]

maybe this is only a CMC thing or a Yang thing or whatnot but I was just reading something about uprooting both feet at the same time, not just the front foot, in push hands. know anything about this?

What were you reading from?

[johnwang]

The reason that your opponent can uproot you because your body has no connection to his body. If you "hook" your body on his body, since both of your bodies are combined as one unit, his root will become your root. There is no way that he can uproot you this way. Unfortunately, leg bite, leg sticky, leg twist, wrist grab, elbow grab, waist control, leg hold, head lock, reverse head lock, under hook, over hook, ... are not allowed to be used in Taiji push hands, this make the uproot happen much more often than usually. By following the Taiji PH rules, you can develop certain skill (such as glue sticky), but at the same time, because the rules, it prevents you from developing other kind of skill (such as hook sticky).

For example, if your right leg hook (or twist) on your opponent's right leg, no matter how hard that your opponent tries, he cannot uproot you. This is the beauty of the "hook sticky". To connect by hook is more secure than to connect by glue. Taiji PH does trained a lot of "glue" principle but not "hook" principle IMO.

Another example, if you ask 2 Taiji guys to put on SC jacket or Judo Gi and allow grip then you won't be able to see that many uprooting as happened in PH.

I had asked this question before. If I hold on your wrist and you uproot me, what will happen after that? My body may fly in the air (assume this is possible), since my arm is connected to your arm, I'll land right back on the same spot just like nothing had happened. Your uprooting effort will be wasted IMO. In order to make your uprooting effort effective, you have to break my grip and that will lead into "grip fight", another area that Taiji PH does not cover.

When we talk about certain skill development, we should not just look from "how we are going to apply". We should also look from "how our opponent may response". This way we will not narrow our training in certain style boundary. Our training will be able to apply in much general area, and deal with opponents from different styles.

[everything]

Another example, if you ask 2 Taiji guys to put on SC jacket or Judo Gi and allow grip then you won't be able to see that many uprooting as happened in PH.

I had asked this question before. If I hold on your wrist and you uproot me, what will happen after that? My body may fly in the air (assume this is possible), since my arm is connected to your arm, I'll land right back on the same spot just like nothing had happened. Your uprooting effort will be wasted IMO. In order to make your uprooting effort effective, you have to break my grip and that will lead into "grip fight", another area that Taiji PH does not cover.

When we talk about certain skill development, we should not just look from "how we are going to apply". We should also look from "how our opponent may response". This way we will not narrow our training in certain style boundary. Our training will be able to apply in much general area, and deal with opponents from different styles.

yes, totally different with a jacket on. one grip on the jacket can be like 1,000 contact points pulling you all over. the overlap between styles can break down and get into some other kinds of difficulties. I don't think the grip has to be broken but maybe because I'm thinking in a judo sport context where you can go to the ground as necessary.

What were you reading from?

CMC simplified method book

[ShortFormMike]

funny you mention CMC because i immediately thought of that part in the book by him and robert smith that basically says "if one of your opponent's legs comes up and wheels around, your technique needs work."

CMC really inculcated that in his students--both feet must leave the ground. "work clean" is what my teacher said he was told. consequently that's what happens the vast majority of the time. it looks cool too which is the most important aspect.