Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

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Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:35 am

http://youtu.be/CXY5qsHD6d8

I found it today, sorry if it was posted before,
very interesting to compare with today executed versions :)
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby yeniseri on Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:00 am

Interesting! When I initially started taijiquan, I learnt an alleged "Old Yang" jian which shared similarities with a liuhejian, close to the aforementioned form displayed above.
It would be quite an event to show the transition from that form to the present.

BTW I could be mistaken but I saw somewhere or I was told that in the early years of re-engineering of taijiquan, many of the stalwarts of family styles had to learn wushu and other forms as part of re-education and that could be a display of that re-education programme of that era. ???
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby leifeng on Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:25 am

This is exactly how I learned the jian form. I thought it was pretty standard. Isn't it?
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:29 am

i don`t have even remote idea how chen standard looks like.
I learned/ing/ from the female direct Master disciple ,
but
her form looks close to present Master presentation, which is quite different than Chen Bing present form, or above video, for ex.
Depending of the age and mileage form will naturally change "outlook" :) ,
so
>standard< will vary accordingly , me thinkin`
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:34 am

ps
>outlook< of the form depends mainly from training intentions ,visibly present or hidden there .
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby Andy_S on Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:37 pm

That is the usual jian form that everyone in the village lineage learns; this was shot in the 1980s by a Japanese crew in Chenjiagou.

How is this different from today's versions?
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:11 am

i can speak from available videos only, and how i learned -
shortly :
- only chen bing form right now, is as low, as posted above, but less dynamic anyway.

:-\
I`m simply feel disappointed the way of the sword around.
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:16 am

have to give a try German long sword competitions :D
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby Andy_S on Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:14 pm

All the weapons forms can be done fast or slow.
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Wed Feb 25, 2015 10:58 am

oh, well, yes, I know that,
same with hand as the weapon only :)
hard to explain ,
but
speaki`n standardization :
above is kinda >standard< for me

chen bing is close
http://youtu.be/icxGuADIokQ

this is watered down showtime
http://youtu.be/0WOz1PCMkao

It`s not about the speed , the mind?.
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Sat Feb 28, 2015 2:31 am

This Gents performance is always looks "the same" for me /in all the way positive meaning -rock- / , doesn`t matter slow or fast
http://youtu.be/6XcQmzX64Ys



hmm, or its my impression only.
I judge from video performances only, don`t know the guys personally
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby Andy_S on Sat Feb 28, 2015 2:42 am

Wiesiek:

I am afraid you have lost me.

The "watered down showtime" performance by Chen XW is the exact same form as Chen Bing's. And this should not be surprising: Chen B is the senior student of Chen XW's younger brother.

So, they are all in the same lineage doing the same thing.

You can use MA for personal development or for performance or for fighting. But the root (at least here) is the same.
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby wiesiek on Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:40 am

watered down intention - sounds better ?
again,
it is maybe for my paint trained eye only, but 1st vid. XW is better than 2nd,
and
i put his family master vid. , to show that Bing is closer to 1st XW performance not the 2nd.

my writing is pointless, if you dont`t see difference there.

i like wudang master performance the most , all movements/roots of chen system are there too.
and
anyway
the German Straight Sword meetings, are the only places where u may check - where the sword and you are
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby leifeng on Sat Feb 28, 2015 7:43 am

By watered down do you mean the small steps and being careful not to step out of the carpet?
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Re: Chen sword form - old vid. chief of the system

Postby sinkpoint on Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:40 pm

It's the weighting of the sword. The sword looks noticeably heavier in the earlier videos. He was more careful about the cutting path.
this is the essential difference between a "dance" and a "martial" performance, the awareness and respect for the weapon's destructive ability.
A good swordsman respects the sword, and optimizes his movements for the sword, instead of forcing the sword unnaturally to his will.
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