Sweet Zuan Chuan breakdown from Marcus Brinkman!

[Bao]

He actually put up a new vid that seems to extend some of the ideas of the last one.

Yup, even more evident here, the elbow is not zuan. That might has been his intention from the beginning, but here it's clearly not.

[Wanderingdragon]

Right you are, it's a demo.

[shawnsegler]

Yup, even more evident here, the elbow is not zuan. That might has been his intention from the beginning, but here it's clearly not.

Well in this one he says explicitly that he focusing on the pi aspect of it in the second video but in the first one he makes it pretty clear that he's talking about the "energy" of Zuan as it's expressed from the bottom of the spine. If you watch what he's doing the line of energy remains consistent to his definition of zuan both in the shape and the way it's expressed from the base of the spine. What's different from the technical way zuan is taught as a form is that he changes the point of issuing from the hand to the elbow like you would in the windup with a flexible weapon.
My 2c.

S

[Wanderingdragon]

He actually put up a new vid that seems to extend some of the ideas of the last one.

Yup, even more evident here, the elbow is not zuan. That might has been his intention from the beginning, but here it's clearly not.

And right you are, I can't find any Zuan energy in the elbow either.

[Bao]

If you watch what he's doing the line of energy remains consistent to his definition of zuan both in the shape and the way it's expressed from the base of the spine. What's different from the technical way zuan is taught as a form is that he changes the point of issuing from the hand to the elbow like you would in the windup with a flexible weapon.

He doesn't keep the center forward, and does not tilt up the hips as he first showed for zuan. Instead he twists the waist. Different from both my definition on zuan mechanics and his own in the first clip. There's no pi either.

.... Nothing wrong with that though. I like the coiling body method, but it seems much influenced by bagua. IMO, it's better to not restrict the shenfa too much. But it's also good to not make the definitions too restricted. It can lead to confusion if the methods shown are too broad for the explanations. I like demonstrations to match the explanations and vice versa.

[Wanderingdragon]

Sorry, no matter how the motion is exaggerated, there is no issuing from the bottom of the spine nor the top, there is only opening and closing.

[shawnsegler]

Well, I don't have any huge drive to convince you of anything. I think I see where he's going with it, if it doesn't work for you then that sounds like a personal thing.

Namaste.

S

[neijia_boxer]

Nice demo, i could never do techniques explanation that well and show a variety of offshoot techniques to add like throws, elbows, takedowns, etc.

I think he said that elbow technique was called 'lying tiger'. 1000x better than fajin crap youtubes.

[Tiga Pukul]

Another question on the elbow... why is he lifting up his back leg after issuing an elbow? For us that's a definite no-no, or is it just a way of being casual about the movement?

[I-mon]

Marcus often tends to have a bit of a jazzy vibe when he's discussing concepts. You'll notice that the expressiveness of his movements generally correlates with the way he's speaking in any given moment, spiralling his body about while he thinks of which words to use, that sort of thing. Definitely all very casual, I'd say.

[C.J.W.]

Is the rising elbow strike considered zuanchuan? I can see it takes a similar, uppercut-like path, but seems to lack the "drilling" element of the fist...?

Since the rising elbow strike and it's variations are very common moves found in Xinyi Liuhe and Dai Xinyi, the two mother arts from which Xingyi evolved, it would make sense to consider the technique legitimate. (I've also seen Zuan expressed as a vertical elbow strike in a couple of lesser-known, family lineages of Hebei Xingyi that claim to be 'purer' than others.)

[nicklinjm]

The applications are fine, and I'm sure Marcus Brinkman is very good at what he does, but his descriptions of what is powering the Zuan (the movement of the hips) seems very weird to me. In Song style Zuan there's a strong emphasis on the power going in two opposite directions in Zuan, one upwards in the arm/upper body, and another downwards in hip / lower body. <Shrug>

[GrahamB]

It's almost as if.... there isn't just one way of doing it... strange..... hmm....

[Bhassler]

PENCILS ARE FOR WRITING, NOT BENDING!!!!

Feckin' monster....

[Wanderingdragon]

Although, drilling izzz, drilling