Tommy Cheng — Classical Yang Tai Chi/Yee Chuen Do

[marvin8]

Tommy’s fighting strategies made sense to me. However, I may not agree with his inheritance of real "Classical Yang Tai Chi" and thoughts on push hands.

Awards:
1972 – Light welterweight champion title of Boxing of Hong Kong actor and action choreographer in Kung Fu movie, about 20 years.
1973 – The first man in Asia to extinguish the candle flame with a two fingers thrust without touching the candle. This was demonstrated in front of an audience of 12 thousand in the National Stadium of Malaysia in Kuala Lumpur, where the third South-Eastern Asia Kung Fu Tournament was taking place. He was invited as an honorable guest of demonstration and international judge.

Sifu Tommy first began learning the secret Tai Chi taught by Yang Luk Chien, from a Buddhist monk, Ling Yan (靈 因).

GrandMaster Tommy Cheng is now teaching the real Chi Kung & Kung Fu based on Striking Hands Classical Tai Chi called Yee Chuen Do, in New Orleans.

Excerpt from http://sifutommycheng.com/:

. . . The only reason that those people don’t use Yang Luk Chien’s way is because they do not know it. But I know, I learned it from my Sifu, Ling Yan (the monk). We can play the dangerous game in a safe way, like the electrician, they do the dangerous game everyday for a living because they know how, like driving, you don’t know how to drive, you may get killed, if you insist to do that but if you know, you drive everyday probably.

So I do it in my own way and a lot of Tai Chi people criticize me because I didn’t do “push hands” I did only “striking hands” which is the Yang Luk Chien’s way in the olden days, even the Yang Ching Fu family members don’t know.

If you don’t believe my story, please explain why no Yang family member get any combat champion in any great championship held in Asia so far? Why the Wu Tai Chi master could not push the White Crane Kung Fu Master away like “throwing a pill” in 1954 in Macau? (Wu Tai Chi came from Yang Tai Chi) if what they are doing today is the same stuff that Yang Luk Chien did in his era.

Why is a song passed down named “striking hand song”, but not “pushing hands song”? Obviously because there was striking in practice in the olden days.

My own point of view, today’s pushing hands is only a game, you cannot use it as a kind of self defense, in a real fight, nobody pushes your hand, they punch you, kick you, choke you, throw you, lock you, etc. Even though you can bounce him away, what is the use? No injury, no pain, no control, he keeps coming back, can you do it every time he comes back with punching and kicking? Tai Chi talks about stick and follow, you bounce him away, that is disconnection not stick and follow anymore, every thing has to be started all over again, is it the real Tai Chi? Look at the push hands competition, mostly bullfight, force against force, muscle against muscle, too far away from the Tai Chi principle. Some so-called master of Tai Chi cannot even handle a simple jab from an amateur boxer, not to speak of a professional one. Some Tai Chi people can fight, but they fight like a Shaolin guy by putting some external stuff in the fight, you cannot see any movement that fits what the Tai Chi bible says, it is very disappointing.

I am tired of arguing for so many years, I understand one thing that if they admit that I am right, then people will not learn from them anymore, so they have to say that I am wrong.

Published on Mar 23, 2015
Martial Taiji Workshop - This is an abbreviated clip of the Martial Taiji Workshop in Houston. Martial Taiji is nearly a lost art. Sifu Tommy is a master of this rare art and explains the fundamentals and teaches a drill used to develop some skills necessary for martial Taiji:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSMU2Vsohd4

Published on May 18, 2015
Sifu explains one of his favorite ways to go to sticky hands against a boxer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnhTY764meY

Published on Jul 30, 2015:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3fGhVtva0U

Published on Jun 18, 2014
Why should you practice the classic tai chi with Sifu Tommy? So that when you are 73 years old you can still play . watch him smile while kicking my but. Check out the very last combo/ trap of the video. So clean:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtMk78NPcr4

Published on Aug 17, 2013
Sifu Tommy teaches the Classical Tai Chi. The martial Tai Chi is called striking hands. It is the original Tai Chi passed down from Yang Luk Chan. It is much different than the "modern Tai Chi" that is called push hands. According to my Sifu, Yang Luk Chan taught push hands to people in order to hide the secret of his invincibility. This video shows Sifu (73 years old) and me practicing freely. I haven't been able to lay a hand on him in the 4 years that I have been studying with him:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaWdOtHje4E

The Eagle Fist is one of over 20 movies made by Cheng Kay-Ying (credited as the alternative spelling Cheng Chi Ying) which have been translated into numerous languages. These are the only known movies which incorporate Yee Chuen Do techniques into the mix of kung fu styles typically used in Chinese martial art movies.

In The Eagle Fist, Sifu appears in the role of the mysterious Eagle Fist master who trains his new student in the actual monastery where he once trained in real life.

Tommy, aka Cheng Chi Ying, appears starting @ 3:25
Published on Nov 4, 2015:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7skhIRXSC8

[willie]

i didn't watch all the video's but the first one looked pretty good.

Don't like those punches, but I do like the way he is integrating push with app's.

[cloudz]

Well, this is interesting and I don't think I have heard of him or seen him before.
So thanks for these and I'll be taking a good look..

But, my preliminary thoughts are that, yes he's right in a sense.
But I also think he's wrong in a sense.

By that I mean tui shou can be uses for striking, chin-na and shuai training.

That he feels there's too much emphasis on 'other things' (besides) in tai chi, is quite a common complaint from all sorts of guys..
It's usually other things that person is not interested in emphasising or using for various reasons, reasons which can vary.

[RobP2]

Skimmed through the vids - thought there was a lot of good talk but not much actual work, and certainly not anyone that looked like a boxer. TBH I didn't see anything that I haven't seen in any of the other "real" Yang family lines, but the same over-reliance (IMHO) on sticking

[cloudz]

yep, there is certainly a lack of training on show in tai chi chuan using striking from non contact.
I was doing a cool little drill just the other day using striking from non contact.

If and when I can I might try getting a clip up..

[marvin8]

Here’s an older rumsoakedfist thread discussing “striking hands.” (da shou 打手):
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3286&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15

Here's an excerpt from an intrewview with Stuart Shaw, who has a facebook page that criticizes empty force people (e.g., Adam Mizner, etc.), which I may not agree with: http://polariswushu.net/blog/2014/09/19/interview-with-stuart-shaw-and-ben-ng-progressing-taijiquan-down-in-australia/

As I have said on the forum, I would like to see “push hands” comps become a meeting ground between Taijiquan and the rest of the martial arts community. Stand up grappling, take down wrestling as a competition format is unique and with the right rule set and promotion it could become a popular sport. “Hopefully” it will make the Taijiquan community step up their training; I know that it has for me since I have been playing more with it.

Here’s the reality … Taijiquan is a toothless tiger. Somewhere along the way, probably folks like YCF, the teeth and claws of Taijiquan have been systematically removed. From there each subsequent generation have continued that trend. The whole collective herd is about to run off the edge into the abyss of delusion and martial irrelevancy and a few of us are trying to head off that occurrence … perhaps we are doomed to fail, but that won’t stop me trying.

Published on Sep 28, 2015
A progression drill from basic Tai Chi Chuan tuishou to include:

~ strikes
~ kicks
~ grappling

Dylan Green in white. Stuart Shaw in black:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jry4Jwwm0uE

[cloudz]

Stuart has some good clips up. I recall seeing some of them, in particular those 'dragon wrestling' ones.
thanks

[RobP2]

yep, there is certainly a lack of training on show in tai chi chuan using striking from non contact.
I was doing a cool little drill just the other day using striking from non contact.

If and when I can I might try getting a clip up..

Be interesting to see it.

I found some of the various 2 person forms useful, though there were various stories about where they originated. Some lines talked about "free sparring" but I never saw evidence of it. Most of the "classical" training was in push hands, application (you punch me here and I do this) or the two person sets. Outside of class we kind of just worked in our own way - back in the "old days" we just got together and threw punches at each other lol. Newspaper taped round the arms for padding and some stinky old mats

[cloudz]

Hey Rob,

In this particular instance we were using a method you are well used to in Systema.
We were going slow ..

I must be getting old!!

However the exchange was limited and geared to (certain) exchange, rather than continuing to other techniques.
Although that started to come through too, as it does after a while, and a few other techniques came about that we could look at a little..

I probably haven't done enough using the slow sparring method and in this instance isolation drilling.
It was light contact, no gear and slow and basically a counter striking drill.
With those it's important that "the attacker" doesn't lose focus and timing ("realistic matching").

[RobP2]

Hi George

Yep, in terms of learning there is a lot to be said for going slow, done properly of course. Like you say it is important to maintain speed and intention - one of the most useful things from slow work is learning to "see" how attacks develop and so be able to react earlier.

I also prefer selective or situational / goal-based sparring rather than just gloving up and squaring off (in fact I find that the least useful kind of sparring work). Outside of working a specific application I also like to keep things as freestyle as possible and move away from the "you hit me like this" approach we see so often in application work. It's also good to add in more than one-on-one to keep things fresh

cheers
Rob

[cloudz]

Indeed, thanks Rob.

[GrahamB]

Sticking like that can be very useful for negating a grappler that wants to clinch. If you watch this breakdown of Jon Jones vs Cormier you can see Jones using very similar hand fighting to that displayed in the Tai Chi clips to negate Cormier - see around 2.50 mark. Combined with striking, obviously.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhWfSj5_CuQ

[marvin8]

At 3:08 of the first video Tommy says, “If you want to beat the guy stronger than you, you should stick and hit. He cannot touch me and I can hit him.” Tommy talks about not exchanging blows, but getting control and better position against the opponent, then attack.

Demetrious Johnson uses similar strategies and principles that Tommy talks about. At 6:50 to 10:57 and 17:07 to 18:51 of the following video, Demetrious demonstrates skill in control (sticking, adhering, etc.) shutting down the offense of his opponents by controlling head, elbow, wrist, hips, and shoulders of opponents. Also, Demetrious uses forward pressure, control of space, angles and positioning to dominate his opponents.

Published on May 3, 2016
Demetrious 'Mighty Mouse' Johnson 2.0 - 'The Game of Threes'

Getcha popcorn.....

Demetrious 'Mighty Mouse' Johnson, whom after his bell to bell domination of John Dodson, went on to dominate Olympic Gold Medalist Henry Cejudo (Freestyle Wrestling), via first round stoppage at UFC 197. He now has solidified the idea I've been pondering a bit that he may very well be the best p4p fighter and complete martial artist on planet earth right now.

It is very difficult to find any flaws in his game, and a very honorable and important mention/credit to all of his success must go to mastermind coach and former competitor Matt Hume, who has developed an incredible teacher student relationship with DJ.

Here I will focus on Mighty Mouse's diverse skill set and essentially flawless technique in the 3 "phases of the game", (striking / clinch work / ground game) akin to no one in the history of the sport. From his 3 way dominance of all things clinch, entrance, attacks within, and fence/cage work, to his 3 facet grappling dominance of takedowns/takedown defense, positional ground control, and submissions, and finally his 3 polished facets of MMA striking fundamentals, footwork(balance/stance/evasion), technically sound Kickboxing/ Muay Thai/Boxing, and angular sensibilities......DJ "goes to 11", and really has become peerless at 125 lbs:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNvrD_9nJpo&t=6m50s

[Taste of Death]

.

[marvin8]

Edit:
(Sorry, the additional info wasn't necessary. Went out of town and able to delete it, now.)