Private Lesson — Chen Zhonghua

[marvin8]

Published on Dec 28, 2015
Chen Zhong Hua:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyXlS0zx3G8

[GrahamB]

Marvin - is that you?

[marvin8]

Marvin - is that you?

No, that's not me. I think its someone named Willy.

At 31:12 Chen says, "This is called lowering the center of gravity." Starting at 31:30 of the video. Chen brings up the concept of heaviness. “This is called heaviness. . . . It’s like a lead blanket on you.” At 33:10 & 33:45, Chen lifts his feet in the air, yet still becomes heavy.

This seems similar to the concept Adam Mizner was trying to show in my post, Unthrowable w/o Rooting, viewtopic.php?f=6&t=24377.

[Bao]

Generous teacher, good clear hands on instruction.

At 31:12 Chen says, "This is called lowering the center of gravity." Starting at 31:30 of the video. Chen brings up the concept of heaviness. “This is called heaviness. . . . It’s like a lead blanket on you.” At 33:10 & 33:45, Chen lifts his feet in the air, yet still becomes heavy.

Lowering center of gravity and "heaviness", two different concepts.

This seems similar to the concept Adam Mizner was trying to show in my post, Unthrowable w/o Rooting, viewtopic.php?f=6&t=24377.

The word "trying" might be emphasized. Zhonghua is clear and practical. But how do you sink Qi? Sinking qi can mean different things. If you focus your intention on your foot, your Qi goes there, now you sunk down Qi to the foot. This doesn't mean that any part of your body become heavier, you have just focused on your foot. Sure, you can call "heaviness" a kind of sinking Qi or internal sinking. But this is also what happens when you really relax. People who don't understand relaxation and softness believe that relaxed means noodling. What Chen demonstrate is relaxation in a functional, practical manner. No one would argue that relaxation "works" looking at what he does. Qi can still be left out of the equation. This word is a matter of taste and about how much ego you put on in front of your students.

[windwalker]

his doesn't mean that any part of your body become heavier, you have just focused on your foot. Sure, you can call "heaviness" a kind of sinking Qi or internal sinking. But this is also what happens when you really relax.

Depends on how one looks at the interaction, and what interaction are really taken place. The idea of heavy is more of a "perception" then actual fact.
The act of fang song or "relax" allows certain factors to be used that would not normally be in what some might call an active state.

I no longer use the word "relax" I prefer and use "empty or release" which refers to "intent"
others may find different.

Like this this teacher he is very detailed.
Over the yrs he seems to have deepened his own understanding.

[willie]

.

[amor]

Like this this teacher he is very detailed.
Over the yrs he seems to have deepened his own understanding.

windy, that class is garbage, he would just need to be retrained over here. he don't have it.

What doesn't he have exactly and how would he need to be retrained over 'here'? Are you able to tell us now what he is doing wrong and what is it. that you do that you have learned from your teacher, that is a much better way.

[origami_itto]

Like this this teacher he is very detailed.
Over the yrs he seems to have deepened his own understanding.

windy, that class is garbage, he would just need to be retrained over here. he don't have it.

What doesn't he have exactly and how would he need to be retrained over 'here'? Are you able to tell us now what he is doing wrong and what is it. that you do that you have learned from your teacher, that is a much better way.

My only criticism with this video is that the guy's other teachers must be ripping him right the hell off, man.

Had to spend too much time on basic fundamentals that should have been second nature by the time you get to a teacher with this much to give.

[Bao]

I no longer use the word "relax" I prefer and use "empty or release" which refers to "intent"
others may find different.

Here, I would prefer just "sink", or "drop", because heaviness is in fact created by a feeling of internal sinking or dropping. I like the word emptiness, but IMHO that is the fundamental state of mind which makes everything else work.

windy, that class is garbage, he would just need to be retrained over here. he don't have it.

What does he lack? Or is it just the usual trollish bs?

My only criticism with this video is that the guy's other teachers must be ripping him right the hell off, man.
Had to spend too much time on basic fundamentals that should have been second nature by the time you get to a teacher with this much to give.

Unfair and insulting IMHO. Seems like you have a very clear idea about how people should progress in tai chi. Different teachers teach different things for different levels. Training curriculum varies for different styles and lineages, Some teachers, especially yang stylists, don't bother much about gua in lower levels. Others would see things that Zhonghua does as mistakes, like not turning the waist. You don't know anything about what kind of shenfa this guy was taught and how good he is in what he does. If you do movements that you are not very used to do, most people will automatically look clumsy or confused. New things or uncommon philosophies of movement can turn anyone into a beginner again.

[origami_itto]

My only criticism with this video is that the guy's other teachers must be ripping him right the hell off, man.
Had to spend too much time on basic fundamentals that should have been second nature by the time you get to a teacher with this much to give.

Unfair and insulting IMHO. Seems like you have a very clear idea about how people should progress in tai chi. Different teachers teach different things for different levels. Training curriculum varies for different styles and lineages, Some teachers, especially yang stylists, don't bother much about gua in lower levels. Others would see things that Zhonghua does as mistakes, like not turning the waist. You don't know anything about what kind of shenfa this guy was taught and how good he is in what he does. If you do movements that you are not very used to do, most people will automatically look clumsy or confused. New things or uncommon philosophies of movement can turn anyone into a beginner again.

I'm certainly being flippant and assuming that he's been learning the same chen style he's getting tutored in here. If he's coming from some other background, sure. If he's studying this style, he probably would have gotten more out of waiting till he was more familiar with the basics of the movements, which he could have gotten from a cheaper tutor. Just my own opinion, worth exactly what you paid for it.

[Bao]

I'm certainly being flippant and assuming that he's been learning the same chen style he's getting tutored in here. If he's coming from some other background, sure.

Ok, thanks for clarifying your thoughts. Personally, I don't assume anything. There are people from all kind of tai chi styles and lineages visiting Chen Zhonghua and goes to his camps and seminars.

[willie]

.

[C.J.W.]

My assessment of CZH's Taiji is that he has added elements from Yang and Wu styles to it. If you look at the Chen style practical method taught by other senior students of Hong Junshen, there are marked differences between what they do and what CZH teaches. Also, CZH is good at what he does and able to apply his materials in stand-up grappling (under PH rules.)

However, it would be interesting to see how he handles realistic punches and kicks using the principles and movements that he uses in grappling.

[Bao]

My assessment of CZH's Taiji is that he has added elements from Yang and Wu styles to it. If you look at the Chen style practical method taught by other senior students of Hong Junshen, there are marked differences between what they do and what CZH teaches.

Don't understand really what elements you think he has added. Care to exlain further?

[C.J.W.]

My assessment of CZH's Taiji is that he has added elements from Yang and Wu styles to it. If you look at the Chen style practical method taught by other senior students of Hong Junshen, there are marked differences between what they do and what CZH teaches.

Don't understand really what elements you think he has added. Care to exlain further?

CZH's emphasis on stillness (fixed anchor) and many of the body mechanics he shows are exactly the same as the "indoor materials" in the Yang style/CMC/Wu style lineages I've been exposed to in Taiwan. In all the other Chen style lineages I've seen, the focus is always on spiraling and silk-reeling which, in my opinion, is what sets Chen apart from Yang and Wu.