Taiwan martial arts demo

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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby Giles on Mon May 08, 2017 9:20 am

Even in the “normal” tuishou section I see some very dubious body alignment in the white-jacket man. Principally speaking you need good underlying alignment as the precondition for leading a more determined or stronger opponent into emptiness, even if the opponent doesn’t actually feel this structure. (Dr. Tao Ping Siang was super-soft but he always had excellent structure to back it up, even in a mini-sized parallel stance). The timing of the man’s changes between absorb/pull and project looks mostly OK but I would guess that a single determined, slightly less cooperative grab on his arm would make him tense up and seriously compromise or collapse his structure. He even walks in a sort of clumsy and ungrounded way.
- But if he tossed me around, I’d eat my words and bow low to him…

No comment on the kong jin show.
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby Steve James on Mon May 08, 2017 9:25 am

[Oops. I meant to put this in the other thread. This has nothing to do with empty anything].

The Classics say:
The feet, legs, and waist should act together
as an integrated whole,
so that while advancing or withdrawing
one can grasp the opportunity of favorable timing
and advantageous position.

If correct timing and position are not achieved,
the body will become disordered
and will not move as an integrated whole;
the correction for this defect
must be sought in the legs and waist.

The principle of adjusting the legs and waist
applies for moving in all directions;
upward or downward,
advancing or withdrawing,
left or right.

All movements are motivated by I [mind-intention],
not external form.
Last edited by Steve James on Mon May 08, 2017 9:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby windwalker on Mon May 08, 2017 12:43 pm

Giles wrote:- But if he tossed me around, I’d eat my words and bow low to him…



Why not allow for others to have an understanding or experience that
you have not experienced yet, but would be willing to accept after experiencing it.

Maybe they as you felt and thought the same way and have come to an understanding of a different way
through an experience that you have not had.

The question of faked vs real always comes up...always a possibility.

It is interesting how different teachers, with different students tend to show and react
the same way doing the same things....one might give pause and ask why?
whats really going on?
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby C.J.W. on Mon May 08, 2017 3:04 pm

The teacher in the demo is in CMC's lineage and a student of the late Dr. Tao Bingxiang. Tao was one of CMC's top disciples who was for his PH skills and also knew Liuhebafa.

By all accounts, Dr. Tao was the real deal and, ASAIK, not a proponent of "no-touch energy."

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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby windwalker on Mon May 08, 2017 4:28 pm

GrahamB wrote:Seriously, what is wrong with people????

https://www.facebook.com/wushu.soul/vid ... 057227249/


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQI-VkdOu-E

(Watch out for the Chi shockwave at 5.30!)


They might ask the same about someone who obviously does not agree with a practice going out and posting practices that he does not agree with, questioning practices that he does not practice.

What's the point?
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby phil b on Mon May 08, 2017 6:21 pm

Windwalker. For the sake of those of us who have not reached the level required to appreciate what is really going on in the op, what is one viable use of pretending that your teacher can chi blast a circle of students?
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby windwalker on Mon May 08, 2017 8:31 pm

phil b wrote:Windwalker. For the sake of those of us who have not reached the level required to appreciate what is really going on in the op, what is one viable use of pretending that your teacher can chi blast a circle of students?


Your in Taipei. Why not stop by some of the local guys in your area doing the same things and ask them about it

http://taichitaiwan.blogspot.tw/
.

They do speclize in helping people understand it, maybe they can help you.
Last edited by windwalker on Mon May 08, 2017 9:08 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby Finny on Mon May 08, 2017 9:39 pm

Why does he have to go to someone else for an answer regarding your point of view on this shite?

You are the one who has chastised those who critique this rubbish, and suggest that one can "come to an understanding of a different way
through an experience that you have not had."

If you have had this experience, which your constant defense of hopping, chi blasting woo woo stuff would imply - why can you never answer this simple question.. simply?

windwalker wrote:
It is interesting how different teachers, with different students tend to show and react
the same way doing the same things....one might give pause and ask why?
whats really going on?



It's also interesting that these same different teachers, with different students... when tested, have universally, completely, utterly failed to reproduce these abilities against anyone NOT their student.

What's really going on?

If these skills work - against anyone other than a cooperative student taking a dive - why do they not work, against anyone but a cooperative student taking a dive/hopping around like an idiot?

It's ok, we know - we'll just have to agree to disagree, until we can encounter a master skilled enough to 'open our eyes to it'.. fortunately for me, in my home town there is one such group. Unfortunately for me, they have already demonstrated their abilities against anyone outside their cult:




I guess I need to get to Taiwan?
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby phil b on Mon May 08, 2017 9:51 pm

windwalker wrote:
phil b wrote:Windwalker. For the sake of those of us who have not reached the level required to appreciate what is really going on in the op, what is one viable use of pretending that your teacher can chi blast a circle of students?


Your in Taipei. Why not stop by some of the local guys in your area doing the same things and ask them about it

http://taichitaiwan.blogspot.tw/
.

They do speclize in helping people understand it, maybe they can help you.


When I first arrived in Taipei I checked out some groups and teachers. There is a good reason why I don't train with them, namely they couldn't do to me what they did to their students. I'm not saying they had no skill, just that what they wanted to teach didn't work against me, so why learn it?

My offer stands. If you can educate me as to my error, I'm not far from you. We can grab coffee and then you can show me what a fool I have been.
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby windwalker on Mon May 08, 2017 10:15 pm

Why would anyone show you what you already know.
I too visited some of the groups there. For me they don't have much of an interest. Other s might find them interesting. Some of them had skill just not the type I look for.

You seem to be confused about, having an empty cup and the one offering tea.
Last edited by windwalker on Mon May 08, 2017 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby phil b on Mon May 08, 2017 11:46 pm

windwalker wrote:Why would anyone show you what you already know.
I too visited some of the groups there. For me they don't have much of an interest. Other s might find them interesting. Some of them had skill just not the type I look for.

You seem to be confused about, having an empty cup and the one offering tea.


Sigh, let's try another way. I do not know why people play act that their teacher can use chi blasts etc. I've never trained with a teacher that uses that approach. You always defend such approach as having a viable purpose. I do not know the purpose and have not yet met anyway who can show me the purpose. I am more than willing to be educated provided the teacher can demonstrate it on me. I know how to empty my cup but I won't empty it to have it filled with horse piss, and told that if I open my mind it will taste like Chardonnay.
Last edited by phil b on Mon May 08, 2017 11:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby wiesiek on Tue May 09, 2017 12:54 am

ha,
it seems, that phil like straight green,
absolutely no
overbounded artificial flowery scent lightheaded in the mist

:)
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby Giles on Tue May 09, 2017 1:19 am

windwalker wrote:
Why not allow for others to have an understanding or experience that
you have not experienced yet, but would be willing to accept after experiencing it.


In principle I do allow for this. My attitude is NOT: "Just because I haven't experienced something, and I also consider it unlikely, I state categorically that it's impossible." Leading on to...
The question of faked vs real always comes up...always a possibility.

Indeed, always a possibility. But still quite unlikely. And, as said, if the man already demonstrates very dubious basic body alignment during cooperative PH with his own students, that seems to me a very poor foundation for developing excellent soft-touch (or "no-touch"!) skills against anyone acting less cooperative.

....one might give pause and ask why? whats really going on?
. Which is just what we're doing.

C.J.W. wrote: The teacher in the demo is in CMC's lineage and a student of the late Dr. Tao Bingxiang. Tao was one of CMC's top disciples who was for his PH skills and also knew Liuhebafa.

By all accounts, Dr. Tao was the real deal and, ASAIK, not a proponent of "no-touch energy."


I was lucky enough to train in Dr. Tao's seminars for a few weeks and got some hands-on time with him too. I also saw him deal with less cooperative, rather 'rude' pushing a couple of times, which he managed extremely well. As said, even though by this time he was very old, small and of seemingly frail build, and put a great emphasis on yielding and moving his torso, he always had great alignment if you looked closely. None of the "deficiences and excesses" in body structure that I believe I see in the thread-starting video. He also gave an excellent lecture on theory, which was very physics-based (he was an aeronautical engineer). In my experience at least, he never demonstrated or espoused anything like chi-blasts, even though he could 'blast' someone pretty well with a soft touch and minimal movement once he had undermined their structural integrity (which usually didn't take long :D ).

-- All this on the basis of my limited experience - I was just a seminar participant, certainly no indoor student...
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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby wiesiek on Tue May 09, 2017 1:28 am

https://youtu.be/1wFmtTuYA5o

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Re: Taiwan martial arts demo

Postby GrahamB on Tue May 09, 2017 1:59 am

windwalker wrote:
GrahamB wrote:Seriously, what is wrong with people????

https://www.facebook.com/wushu.soul/vid ... 057227249/


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQI-VkdOu-E

(Watch out for the Chi shockwave at 5.30!)


They might ask the same about someone who obviously does not agree with a practice going out and posting practices that he does not agree with, questioning practices that he does not practice.

What's the point?


Practices that I practice I practice but they take practice. Wouldn't you agree?
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