solo aikido exercises -william gleason

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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby wiesiek on Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:58 am

then,
maybe ,
Mr Gleason practicing discussed exercise just 20 years, while 30 years is required for polished perfection...:)

just shot in the dark from Krakow.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Bao on Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:27 am

Interloper wrote:Bao, breath is just part of the equation. What is relevant is the mental training and conditioning that permits someone to maintain focus under duress. That is what the warrior classes have trained for, for centuries.

My point about driving is that the human mind is capable of conditioning multiple layers of simultaneous activities, both mental and physical. That said, a person who is demonstrating a concept of internal structure and movement, should be able to do so while speaking. That was the original discussion. Fighting while maintaining that focus, is another level of the same developmental process, just with more layers of issues you must deal with, including breathing.


I completely 100% don't agree. It's not about maintaining focus, rather about knowing on what to focus or multi-tasking. Multitasking is not the same as focus under duress. You can focus and still screw up your breath. Some people use lower deep breathing when they speak, but when you stand for a crowd and want to make yourself heard, people tend to make an effort with the lungs, tense the breath and use the chest area. This will affect the balance. So it's not a question about focus, it's about physical shiftings in your body affected by how you use your breath. When you fight, the breath and control breath will be the most important, not speaking and make yourself heard. That will be a completely different issue and a too different situation to be comparable.

Now I don't make any excuses for showing bad balance. I don't know anything about his balance because I can not be there and test him. But I know that anyone can have a bad day and that it's hard to control every small shifting that happens in the body and how those shiftings affect your body.

... And I sincerely doubt that this person has a mental training that is anything compared to warriors of the old days ... ;)
Last edited by Bao on Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Ron Panunto on Tue Nov 07, 2017 10:54 am

Interloper wrote:No real cross-body connection in what Gleason is doing, and he is "double-weighting" (committing his body mass to one side of the body). That's why he wobbles.


I don't study Aikido (and maybe you don't do Taiji), but this definition of "double-weighting" is exactly opposite of Taiji's. Can these arts be that different? In Taiji, it is desirable to commit your weight to one side.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby oragami_itto on Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:05 am

Ron Panunto wrote:
Interloper wrote:No real cross-body connection in what Gleason is doing, and he is "double-weighting" (committing his body mass to one side of the body). That's why he wobbles.


I don't study Aikido (and maybe you don't do Taiji), but this definition of "double-weighting" is exactly opposite of Taiji's. Can these arts be that different? In Taiji, it is desirable to commit your weight to one side.


That's always a good discussion, right?

Double weighting is described like putting one foot on each side of a wheel with equal pressure, it won't roll.

Some folks see it in same side hand and foot being substantial, or both feet, or both hands. I see it where you have to change before you can change.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby wayne hansen on Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:38 am

Double weighting is much more subtle than that it is not only in the feet it can be many places
The feet can appear to be double weighted but not be
Wu style single whip or fan thru the back are examples of double heavy
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Interloper on Tue Nov 07, 2017 4:58 pm

"Double weighting" means different things in different arts.
In the arts I study, it means having a "dead side" that is not just "empty," but also devoid of connection or engagement, and also to have your body mass committed to only the "live" side of the body. This condition seriously compromises a person's structure (the body is not unified) and ability to both maintain the structure and to completely produce and fully use force on both sides (Yin and Yang). It's easy to take that person's center of mass and balance, on contact.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby littlepanda on Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:13 pm

Interloper wrote:"Double weighting" means different things in different arts.
In the arts I study, it means having a "dead side" that is not just "empty," but also devoid of connection or engagement, and also to have your body mass committed to only the "live" side of the body. This condition seriously compromises a person's structure (the body is not unified) and ability to both maintain the structure and to completely produce and fully use force on both sides (Yin and Yang). It's easy to take that person's center of mass and balance, on contact.



Isn't Shiko a cure for "double weighting"?

.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Tom on Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:21 pm

littlepanda wrote:Isn't Shiko a cure for "double weighting"?

.


Should be.

But I think what will be more interesting than Cady's (Interloper's) attempts to critique Gleason from her position of limited experience and skill will be a note/comment from Daito Ryu Kodokai teacher Roy Goldberg on his recent meeting and co-teaching with I Liq Chuan's Sam Chin (Sam's teaching informs Cady's practice). If/when Goldberg's remarks are posted in another venue, I'll link them to this discussion (if I remember).
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Interloper on Tue Nov 07, 2017 10:07 pm

How can you determine what anyone's degree of experience and skill is? You have never even met me, much less trained with me. I have been training in internals for nearly 20 years. Yes, I'm "still" a student and will be for life, and don't claim to be anything of an apex of the craft; however, I do not speak about things that I can't actually demonstrate with a reasonable degree of skill, or that I can't explain and instruct in, myself.

And, since when is any popular teacher's work sacrosanct and beyond critique? Can you observe and make experienced evaluations of what you are seeing? There is no attack here on individuals, only an objective observation, based on experience. When people put their videos "out there," it is valid to evaluate them objectively.

My comments in no way were pejorative, which is much more than I can say for some of the comments others are making here. Stick to fact. If you can't explain and describe what you are seeing, that's fine, but don't make the presumption that others do not understand what they are viewing.

Tom wrote:
littlepanda wrote:Isn't Shiko a cure for "double weighting"?

.


Should be.

But I think what will be more interesting than Cady's (Interloper's) attempts to critique Gleason from her position of limited experience and skill will be a note/comment from Daito Ryu Kodokai teacher Roy Goldberg on his recent meeting and co-teaching with I Liq Chuan's Sam Chin (Sam's teaching informs Cady's practice). If/when Goldberg's remarks are posted in another venue, I'll link them to this discussion (if I remember).
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby oragami_itto on Wed Nov 08, 2017 5:05 am

Interloper wrote:How can you determine what anyone's degree of experience and skill is? You have never even met me, much less trained with me. I have been training in internals for nearly 20 years. Yes, I'm "still" a student and will be for life, and don't claim to be anything of an apex of the craft; however, I do not speak about things that I can't actually demonstrate with a reasonable degree of skill, or that I can't explain and instruct in, myself.

And, since when is any popular teacher's work sacrosanct and beyond critique? Can you observe and make experienced evaluations of what you are seeing? There is no attack here on individuals, only an objective observation, based on experience. When people put their videos "out there," it is valid to evaluate them objectively.

My comments in no way were pejorative, which is much more than I can say for some of the comments others are making here. Stick to fact. If you can't explain and describe what you are seeing, that's fine, but don't make the presumption that others do not understand what they are viewing.

Tom wrote:
littlepanda wrote:Isn't Shiko a cure for "double weighting"?

.


Should be.

But I think what will be more interesting than Cady's (Interloper's) attempts to critique Gleason from her position of limited experience and skill will be a note/comment from Daito Ryu Kodokai teacher Roy Goldberg on his recent meeting and co-teaching with I Liq Chuan's Sam Chin (Sam's teaching informs Cady's practice). If/when Goldberg's remarks are posted in another venue, I'll link them to this discussion (if I remember).


We're artists and we're sensitive about our shit.

I watched the video again and I don't think the guy's a fraud or anything, he's just a smidge more wobbly on one leg than I would like to be. But I'm not doing that particular exercise on mats in front of a group while describing it. I'm also not charging people for that privilege so....

Did everybody leave happy? Do we Taijiquan players get to snark about wobbly akido-ka in their funny dresses?

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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Tom on Wed Nov 08, 2017 4:12 pm

Cady, you are correct that we have not met and I have not trained with you. I'm just reflecting assessments of people who have taught you and trained with you. The statement was "limited skill and experience," and it's in conjunction with the skill and experience levels of Gleason, Goldberg and Chin. Is that an incorrect observation?

Of course you are free to comment on what you observe in Bill Gleason. I am just more interested in what, after their recent teaching/training exchange, Goldberg and Chin may have to say on the function of shiko and related exercises in building internal connection. I know at least one of them has seen the clip in question. It's a statement of my interest, not an attack on you.

Interloper wrote:How can you determine what anyone's degree of experience and skill is? You have never even met me, much less trained with me. I have been training in internals for nearly 20 years. Yes, I'm "still" a student and will be for life, and don't claim to be anything of an apex of the craft; however, I do not speak about things that I can't actually demonstrate with a reasonable degree of skill, or that I can't explain and instruct in, myself.

And, since when is any popular teacher's work sacrosanct and beyond critique? Can you observe and make experienced evaluations of what you are seeing? There is no attack here on individuals, only an objective observation, based on experience. When people put their videos "out there," it is valid to evaluate them objectively.

My comments in no way were pejorative, which is much more than I can say for some of the comments others are making here. Stick to fact. If you can't explain and describe what you are seeing, that's fine, but don't make the presumption that others do not understand what they are viewing.

Tom wrote:
littlepanda wrote:Isn't Shiko a cure for "double weighting"?

.


Should be.

But I think what will be more interesting than Cady's (Interloper's) attempts to critique Gleason from her position of limited experience and skill will be a note/comment from Daito Ryu Kodokai teacher Roy Goldberg on his recent meeting and co-teaching with I Liq Chuan's Sam Chin (Sam's teaching informs Cady's practice). If/when Goldberg's remarks are posted in another venue, I'll link them to this discussion (if I remember).
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby Tom on Wed Nov 08, 2017 4:29 pm

oragami_itto wrote:. . . .I watched the video again and I don't think the guy's a fraud or anything, he's just a smidge more wobbly on one leg than I would like to be. But I'm not doing that particular exercise on mats in front of a group while describing it. I'm also not charging people for that privilege so....


Bill Gleason does wobble in that demonstration of shiko. So on occasion does the guy who taught him that exercise.

I've met Bill and been to training with him where we've both done shiko. In the clip posted above, what I see him doing isn't so much double-weighting as not "pulling through" with the diagonal line (and fascial connection) to raise the leg. It seems to be more primarily a segmented muscular effort. I watched Bill's shiko a number of times and that among other things was pointed out by someone more experienced than me training in the same method (I do shiko every day and although not an aikidoka have trained with a lot of the people seen on that clip). I tend to agree with that assessment. Regardless, I think that what Bill verbally describes as the how-to and the function of the exercise is correct.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby littlepanda on Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:24 pm

Tom wrote:
Bill Gleason does wobble in that demonstration of shiko. So on occasion does the guy who taught him that exercise.




I just tried doing shiko. I found that I can have better balance if I were to twist my hands in the opposite direction while doing this exercise.

for e.g. If you were to lift your right leg then turn your right palm up and your left palm down. This twist will defintely make you more stable.

.
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby wayne hansen on Thu Nov 09, 2017 2:37 am

So who was the guy that taught him
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Re: solo aikido exercises -william gleason

Postby wiesiek on Thu Nov 09, 2017 4:02 am

is it matter if exercise basics are good explained?
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