Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

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Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby marvin8 on Wed Nov 01, 2017 8:47 am

Yang Lu-Chan → Yang Jian-Hou/Yang Ban-Hou → Yang Shao-Hou (1862-1930) → Gu LiSheng

Liang De Hua Taijiquan
Published on Oct 31, 2017

Master Chi Qingsheng is the indoor student of GM Gu Lisheng (Gu Luping). Gu was a student of both Yang Shaohou and Yang Chengfu:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Wt0aEoNdZU


Another disciple of Gu Lisheng —> Zhang Zhuoxing

Acupunctuur Hoorn
Published on Jun 19, 2017

Zhang Zhuoxing's 80th birthday taiji demo.

Student of Gu Lisheng and You Zhixue:

They both were students of Yang Shaohou:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Tq33U8okvg

Acupunctuur Hoorn
Published on Jun 19, 2017

Taiji-demo 2005.

With Shi Danqiu (student of Gu Lisheng and Zhang Zhuoxing) and Willem Hartog:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-zBWLhg40s
Last edited by marvin8 on Wed Nov 01, 2017 9:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby kenneth fish on Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:23 pm

I think you mean Gu Liuxin, who was also a student of Chen Fake

Last edited by kenneth fish on Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby marvin8 on Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:44 pm

kenneth fish wrote:I think you mean Gu Liuxin, who was also a student of Chen Fake


Not really familiar with them myself. However per this discussion, they are two different people; Gu Lisheng being fourth generation and Gu Liu Xing being fifth generation:
Yang lineage and other translations, http://www.yangfamilytaichi.com/phpBB3/ ... ?f=4&t=460.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby Rhen on Thu Nov 02, 2017 6:39 am

The "Old Yang" 108 forms is a bit too embellished for my taste. I got to about 2 minutes of watching.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby Ron Panunto on Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:29 am

kenneth fish wrote:I think you mean Gu Liuxin, who was also a student of Chen Fake



This is exactly the choreography of my first Chen routine.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby Yuen-Ming on Thu Nov 02, 2017 7:04 pm

marvin8 wrote:Yang Lu-Chan → Yang Jian-Hou/Yang Ban-Hou → Yang Shao-Hou (1862-1930) → Gu LiSheng


Yang Shaohou briefly taught at the Sport Institute in Beijing run by Xu Yusheng together with a number of other famous masters.

As this was a public venue all those who attended were just open students, and they were taught an open curriculum which was a mixture of things coming from the various teachers.

Some of these people, including Gu Lisheng, later taught openly and most of so-called "Shaohou" lineages seen around these days derive from this bunch of people.

Nothing of what they did in Beijing, or what their descendants teach today, have much or anything to do with Shaohou's actual (disciple) curriculum and this is why what people see today from these lineages bear such striking resemblance to Yang Chengfu's style.

YM
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby kenneth fish on Thu Nov 02, 2017 7:36 pm

+1
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby Rhen on Fri Nov 03, 2017 6:33 am

Yuen-Ming wrote:Nothing of what they did in Beijing, or what their descendants teach today, have much or anything to do with Shaohou's actual (disciple) curriculum and this is why what people see today from these lineages bear such striking resemblance to Yang Chengfu's style.

YM


something does not sound clear about your statement. Did you mean to say, that what these "Shaohao" folks are teaching today has little resemblance to what the Yang's teach today?

That of course makes sense, and why some people are now pushing that the older ways of "Shaohao" and "Jianhao" generations seem to be "BETTER" somehow as to what the Yangs are currently teaching.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby oragami_itto on Fri Nov 03, 2017 8:42 am

Rhen wrote:
Yuen-Ming wrote:Nothing of what they did in Beijing, or what their descendants teach today, have much or anything to do with Shaohou's actual (disciple) curriculum and this is why what people see today from these lineages bear such striking resemblance to Yang Chengfu's style.

YM


something does not sound clear about your statement. Did you mean to say, that what these "Shaohao" folks are teaching today has little resemblance to what the Yang's teach today?

That of course makes sense, and why some people are now pushing that the older ways of "Shaohao" and "Jianhao" generations seem to be "BETTER" somehow as to what the Yangs are currently teaching.


IMHO the art has advanced, but things have been lost that would be nice to still have. Taijiquan is the classics, remove everything that doesn't fit.
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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby Yuen-Ming on Sat Nov 04, 2017 3:13 am

Rhen wrote:something does not sound clear about your statement. Did you mean to say, that what these "Shaohao" folks are teaching today has little resemblance to what the Yang's teach today?

That of course makes sense, and why some people are now pushing that the older ways of "Shaohao" and "Jianhao" generations seem to be "BETTER" somehow as to what the Yangs are currently teaching.


I mean that what we all see mostly on the web which claims Shaohou (or Jianhou, Banhou etc) lineages is either totally made up or at best derives from public students of a Sport Institute in Beijing during Republican Era. These students learnt a public (made up for purpose) short curriculum from a group of notable teachers, then passed down their stuff some of which still survive these days ... as you can see from the opening video.

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Re: Old Yang style big frame 108 movements — Chi Qingsheng

Postby Yuen-Ming on Sat Nov 04, 2017 3:17 am

oragami_itto wrote:IMHO the art has advanced, but things have been lost that would be nice to still have. Taijiquan is the classics, remove everything that doesn't fit.


Advancing or retreating is very much a matter of perspectives

From a martial standpoint, the art has obviously made HUGE steps backward simply because “evolution” only happens when there is a need. And for what “martial need” concerns, the martial arts have become very much obsolete in China with the end of Qing dynasty hence - from that moment onward - it has been very much a general downfall

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