Steve James wrote:I tend to think that sports athletes and martial artists tend to think their opponent will be a martial artist or athlete. So, the debates about the effectiveness of wing chun or tcc focus on what those arts don't have that others do. MMA has accentuated those debates because the mma athlete specializes in being a generalist. He or she has to be capable in striking, kicking, stand up, and ground game.
Steve James wrote:I think it's impractical for the average person seeking to learn how to defend himself to think in those terms. First off, get a weapon. An adult needs a means of self defense today, not in a few years or with much training. It's the weak who need it most. Secondly, the weakest, the people who need it the most, may never be able to compete with a sports athlete. They may, however, be able to defend themselves from unskilled attackers. Just the willingness to fight back might help, or at least discourage some attackers.
Oh, but I agree with the benefits of pressure testing. Just so's you know.
grzegorz wrote:Matt Thornton! Talk about a blast from the past...
Yeah, he came about time and had a good message but more and more I see the value in martial arts as a hobby and realize that not everything needs to do kill kun do.
For me and most others I know training is a great stress reliever and great exercise. If an adult finds themselves getting into fights perhaps they should examine the choices they are making in life.
Matt Thornton wrote:"When I say aliveness, I don't mean sparring. . . . Aliveness is incorporated in every drill we do. If you're going to a wrestling gym, there is going to be live drills. They don't have to be brutal or hard. And, they are not sparring. There is a sense of timing because they're alive. That is the ultimate answer to why some arts work and some arts don't."
grzegorz wrote:As much as I enjoy grappling I still think knife fighting and probabaly Krav Magav will be more realistic in a lot of ways since grappling is based on one on one MMA fighting.
Mix it up I say. Experiment and try different things to see where you are at. There is no reason for everyone's journey needs to be the same.
Steve James wrote:Re: "Today's attackers"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osRLJKnOB34
Some people study "martial arts" to be able to protect people like the one above. Today's attackers, in my neighborhood, go after the obviously weak. Modern mma has nothing to do with it.
Afa the
marvin8 wrote:At 1:52 Matt says:Matt Thornton wrote:"When I say aliveness, I don't mean sparring. . . . Aliveness is incorporated in every drill we do. If you're going to a wrestling gym, there is going to be live drills. They don't have to be brutal or hard. And, they are not sparring. There is a sense of timing because they're alive. That is the ultimate answer to why some arts work and some arts don't."
Matt Thornton wrote:. . . The way real style is developed is you learn the fundamentals of base, of movement of footwork, of distance of body mechanics, of applying joint locks and the positions on the ground. Those fundamentals transcend culture, body, era and venue.
The attacker in the video starts out grappling (headlock).
Aliveness (pressure testing) would help this 79 year old man realize his weaknesses and take subsequent steps accordingly. Steps may include training awareness of environment, avoiding dangerous situations, weapons, etc.
Here is what Matt did say if you care to opine. At 8:08:
Matt Thornton wrote:
. . . The way real style is developed is you learn the fundamentals of base, of movement of footwork, of distance of body mechanics, of applying joint locks and the positions on the ground. Those fundamentals transcend culture, body, era and venue.
Steve James wrote:The attacker in the video starts out grappling (headlock).
Do you honestly believe that the headlock is new or has anything to do with modern mma?
marvin8 wrote:Again, Matt is not talking about MMA (or sparring). He is speaking about aliveness: timing, energy and motion. Aliveness (pressure testing) would help this 79 year old man realize his weaknesses and take subsequent steps accordingly. Steps may include training awareness of environment, avoiding dangerous situations, weapons, etc.
At 1:52 Matt says:Matt Thornton wrote:"When I say aliveness, I don't mean sparring. . . . Aliveness is incorporated in every drill we do. If you're going to a wrestling gym, there is going to be live drills. They don't have to be brutal or hard. And, they are not sparring. There is a sense of timing because they're alive. That is the ultimate answer to why some arts work and some arts don't."
Steve James wrote:marvin8 wrote:Aliveness (pressure testing) would help this 79 year old man realize his weaknesses and take subsequent steps accordingly. Steps may include training awareness of environment, avoiding dangerous situations, weapons, etc.
Easy for you to say, but true. Otoh, one of the things he can't do is run away, either
Anyway, my point was that some people study martial arts to be able to defend those who can't protect themselves. I'm not saying that people should not "pressure test" their arts and be aware. I'm saying that it's the people who obviously can't do that type of testing who are generally the victims. They're not going to the gym at the rest home to do light drills. Nor do I even think that fighting back would work for the 79 year-old in the video.
marvin8 wrote:Again, Matt is not talking about MMA (or sparring). He is speaking about aliveness: timing, energy and motion. Aliveness (pressure testing) would help this 79 year old man realize his weaknesses and take subsequent steps accordingly. Steps may include training awareness of environment, avoiding dangerous situations, weapons, etc.
Steve James wrote:marvin8 wrote:Here is what Matt did say if you care to opine. At 8:08:
Matt Thornton wrote:
. . . The way real style is developed is you learn the fundamentals of base, of movement of footwork, of distance of body mechanics, of applying joint locks and the positions on the ground. Those fundamentals transcend culture, body, era and venue.
I have no problem at all with what Matt did say.
marvin8 wrote:
Again, Matt is not talking about MMA (or sparring). He is speaking about aliveness: timing, energy and motion. Aliveness (pressure testing) would help this 79 year old man realize his weaknesses and take subsequent steps accordingly. Steps may include training awareness of environment, avoiding dangerous situations, weapons, etc.marvin8 wrote:
RobP3 wrote:marvin8 wrote:
Again, Matt is not talking about MMA (or sparring). He is speaking about aliveness: timing, energy and motion. Aliveness (pressure testing) would help this 79 year old man realize his weaknesses and take subsequent steps accordingly. Steps may include training awareness of environment, avoiding dangerous situations, weapons, etc.marvin8 wrote:
Awareness, etc, none of which MT teaches, as far as I know. In fact, I had an SBG instructor tell me I was some kind of psychopath because we involve weapons in our training. His focus was purely on "nice" training with a lot of putting other things down. It's another construct, similar to what they criticise in some ways.
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