water taiji

[windwalker]

Master Lam's teaching

[Bao]

Connecting to the scapula and controlling the movements from there. Very similar to stuff that I do, the same principles and methods. Yeah, I liked the clip.

[wayne hansen]

I don’t think anyone quite gets it like the founder
I have the original dvd’s somewhere
He is my teachers favorite even though I am not as keen on his stuff

[nicklinjm]

Have had some exposure to the water taiji people in HK, the better ones can really demonstrate how real taiji jin can 'cut through' or not be affected by the power of the opponent.

Personally I think the water taiji founder (Wang Zhuang-hong) just made explicit certain power principles in Yang style taiji - the points, lines and waves. Byron Zhang is also pretty good IMHO.

Windwalker - do you find some commonalities between your Old Six Roads and what the water taiji folks do?

[windwalker]

Have had some exposure to the water taiji people in HK, the better ones can really demonstrate how real taiji jin can 'cut through' or not be affected by the power of the opponent.

Personally I think the water taiji founder (Wang Zhuang-hong) just made explicit certain power principles in Yang style taiji - the points, lines and waves. Byron Zhang is also pretty good IMHO.

Windwalker - do you find some commonalities between your Old Six Roads and what the water taiji folks do?

Byron, good friend of mine, we used to push and practice together. Many discussions on taiji theory and applications

Both his teachers good guys very open...

To be clear although my teacher used to call what we practiced "Old six roads"
He would later refer to it as simply the 88 step...Not really sure how accurate the name reflects what some know as "old six roads"

Happen to come across some clips of Gary's teaching thought some might find them interesting...

Bryon, used to invite me over to their class for some informal pushing, allowing the students to feel something a little different.
Found the water style to be quite similar in the theory aspects. although different in the physicality of it.

[Bao]

Can't find much about this "Water Taiji". But I find the name a rather absurd. It's a tautology, "water" is redundant to say the least. All Taiji is "water". if I just saw an ad or book with "Water Taiji" or "Water style Taiji" without knowing more about its background I would have a very hard time to take it seriously.

"長拳者，如長江大海滔滔不絕也" or “Changquan is like the Long River and the Great ocean, moving unceasingly.” (Chang jiang or "long river" actually refers to the Yangtze River.)

Byron Zhang is also pretty good IMHO.

Byron, good friend of mine, we used to push and practice together. Many discussions on taiji theory and applications

Bryon, used to invite me over to their class for some informal pushing, allowing the students to feel something a little different.
Found the water style to be quite similar in the theory aspects. although different in the physicality of it.

I've always liked his attitude, open and friendly.

I think understand is meant by "different in the physicality", Byron's body method is more of a traditional "yang" method. He seems to move, and generate his movements, with his whole body together. No special part seems to be storing, powering or generating strength. But of course, I could be wrong.

This vid is from ten yrs ago. Would be interesting to see what he does today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMNFfS6AHd0

[windwalker]

Can't find much about this "Water Taiji". But I find the name a rather absurd. It's a tautology, "water" is redundant to say the least. All Taiji is "water". if I just saw an ad or book with "Water Taiji" or "Water style Taiji" without knowing more about its background I would have a very hard time to take it seriously.

"Hard to take it seriously,,"


Others like the founder might "take it seriously"



王壮弘 水性太极拳

[windwalker]

"Bao" wrote
I think understand is meant by "different in the physicality", Byron's body method is more of a traditional "yang" method. He seems to move, and generate his movements, with his whole body together. No special part seems to be storing, powering or generating strength. But of course, I could be wrong.

yep could be wrong
Of course different view points might be from "being there" vs " watching" clip.


Would say it's quite different from what most might call the "traditional yang" method...in movement....


For those interested in the style contact info can be found on his site.

Master Garry Lam is a first-generation successor of Wang Style Water Tai Chi, the Great Grandmaster Wang Zhuanhong(王壯弘). Master Lam started studying martial arts ，the Northern Shaolin, under Grandmaster Yang Shangwu(嚴尚武），who learned from Grandmaster Ku Yu Cheung(顧汝章).

Master Lam has coached for martial art competitions for many years in Asia. In 1991, Master Gary Lam began studying Wang Water Tai Chi with Grand Master Wang Zhuanghong(王壯弘）.After many years, he truly grasped the essence of Wang Water Tai Chi. After Master Lam immigrated to the United States, he continued promoting martial arts and teaching tai chi chuan for more than 20 years in US.

Origins of water style taiji

[Bao]

"Hard to take it seriously,,"

Of course. The name is ridiculous. The text on the intro page as well:

"Master Wang Zhuanghong, founder of water style Taiji, not only understood how to interpret the Taijiquan Treatise, he was also deeply
inspired by the most influential Chinese Daoist motto, “The highest good is like water (shang shan rou shui 上善若水),”
from Dao De Jing (道德經) by Laozi. This captures the principle of Wang’s water type Taiji: it mimics the
quality and nature of water. Master Wang’s entire set of Taijiquan movements are like the movements
of water in nature—rolling waves and flowing currents, ups and downs."

Also ridiculous and also looks like someone who doesn't understand Tai Chi wrote it. All movements of traditional Tai Chi, regardless school or style are "like the movements of water in nature—rolling waves and flowing currents." It just states something all genuine Tai Chi should have, not something that could be particular for a certain school or style.

So of course it doesn't look serious. I thought the same about I Liq chuan, I thought it was McDojo. Anyone who understand Chinese and knows Chinese spelling finds it weird. If I hadn't seen practitioners show skill I would still believe it was McDojo.

Even if it's just a name Its still just weird that someone choose to use something that can't be taken seriously.

Others like the founder might "take it seriously"

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkH9JNBM6Jg&t=299s
王壮弘 水性太极拳

Why would anyone care about what a founder "thinks" about his own name? A name is still just a name. If he shows skill is what I would ask.

Some people would say that what he does goes against Tai Chi principles. But I understand what he does. He didn't invent that body method/mechanics. It is similar to some bagua methods, even closer to Liuhebafa, which is also called "Water Boxing". If he infused or combined this art's body method, it could explain the name "Water Tai Chi" better. But it can be found in other Tai Chi schools as well, as in one of the two "Fu" Tai Chi styles. But it's usually not that exaggerated, or evident.

Lam shows some good qualities IMHO, again close to some Liuhebafa. And again, some of it close to what I do.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPmzU5oXQ8c

But then again, your friend Byron's "Water Tai Chi" is much more restraint, looks more like traditional Yang. But sure "different view points might be from "being there" vs " watching" clip." I agree. Byron might lean more towards standard Tai Chi, or he might hide the mechanics intentionally, IDK. Hiding can also be a skill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsDEJ2y-YJg

Interesting nevertheless. Thank you again for sharing.

[wayne hansen]

He started with Wang in 91 and has been in the states for 20 years when did Wang die

[windwalker]

Lam shows some good qualities IMHO, again close to some Liuhebafa.
And again, some of it close to what I do.

How would anyone judge what you do vs what he does...."show's"

Thought some might find the "style" interesting

Should there be questions his site with contact info..

https://wangwatertaichi.com/

[Bao]

How would anyone judge what you do vs what he does...."show's"

How could anyone judge that you can do what you claim you can do?



I couldn't care less about what you or anyone else hear "judge" what I say. I saw something I thought was interesting and commented it. If someone is interested in what I do, they can come and meet me. Several people has read what I write in forums and on my blog and have either met me while they were around my place or made a trip to meet me. This is a discussion board FFS, you are meant to discuss and share your thoughts and ideas. If you are not interested you can STFU or you can try to argue, it's all up to you. But htf would you be able to judge someone without meeting up with them?

...Oh my...

[windwalker]

How would anyone judge what you do vs what he does...."show's"

How could anyone judge that you can do what you claim you can do?



I couldn't care less about what you or anyone else hear "judge" what I say. I saw something I thought was interesting and commented it. If someone is interested in what I do, they can come and meet me. Several people has read what I write in forums and on my blog and have either met me while they were around my place or made a trip to meet me. This is a discussion board FFS, you are meant to discuss and share your thoughts and ideas. If you are not interested you can STFU or you can try to argue, it's all up to you.

But htf would you be able to judge someone without meeting up with them?

...Oh my...

You mean like you’re doing now. Judging another’s work

On a discussion board where you specifically say it’s “something like what you do “.
How would anyone know?

"STFU" Nice doggy



Find always strange , historians, commentators, never seem to have any of their own work to show .
While making pronouncements on well-known people with backgrounds, considered masters in the field .
For the most part, I attribute it to ignorance .
Although I do feel bad when it specifically involves people I know.


Do find the commentary interesting although could do with out the Ad hominem,

If someone mentions it’s similar to what they do, it would be nice to see what they do .
Or think they do.

For those who do show their work “kudos “

Makes it easier to understand the perspective from which one is speaking from .

[watertaichistudent]

HI all,

Any one is interested in Water Taichi taught by Master Gary Lam may visit https://wangwatertaichi.com and checkout https://www.youtube.com/@wangwatertaichi6997

Master Lam learned from Master Zhuanghong Wang. Master Wang named his Taichi style as "Water Tai Chi" -- "王式水性太极“ in Chinese.

Master Lam is teaching in Fremont CA.

[windwalker]

HI all,

Any one is interested in Water Taichi taught by Master Gary Lam may visit https://wangwatertaichi.com and checkout https://www.youtube.com/@wangwatertaichi6997

Master Lam learned from Master Zhuanghong Wang. Master Wang named his Taichi style as "Water Tai Chi" -- "王式水性太极“ in Chinese.

Master Lam is teaching in Fremont CA.

Greetings

Can you share a little about the meaning of the name, and theory behind the movement...