Dont let a lack of knowledge stop you

[windwalker]

Zhongding demonstrations rarely attracts people who want to learn how to fight.

of course

along with jumping rope, road work, foot work drills and




Once "zhongding" is gained though "demonstrated" ability confirming it.
one should then understand that it can exist outside the body
causing interesting reactions in others encountering it.

Like the ones many of the demos are predicated on attracting those seeking to
to understand it..

[wayne hansen]

I only see one type of pushing
Pushing to teach combat
If you get use to leaning on someone in competition you will ingrain that mentality
I always yield to stimulus
I may be dense but not in pushing
Dense is the perfect word those who stay when moving is the right path
In FMA they have a saying
Every hand hold a knife
That is said for two reasons
One to get you to move in a positive manner
Two because in the Philippines it is true
It may not be me that is dense but others who I decline at mentioning

[D_Glenn]

In the bagua I practice, Tui Shou is not recommended. We’re training to always take a step. Footwork is hard enough to learn, since it’s ideally your Xindi that is learning it. Conflicting practices will make it even harder to ingrain.

.

[D_Glenn]

Windwalker, you, of all people, should know the scene in China. There’s a lot of chaff that gathers around you guys.

[windwalker]

Windwalker, you, of all people, should know the scene in China. There’s a lot of chaff that gathers around you guys.

Donno,

People have their own reasons for practice, tend to be attracted to practices based on their interest .
there’s a lot of cultural traditions and unsaid expectations, involved with practices from a different culture .

My own teacher when he was alive, was rather private about his practice, most people in the community knew of him .
respect his privacy .

Regarding the push hands. In some aspects kind of the coin of the realm.
In other aspects can lead one far away from what they might be looking for .

Different mindset.

Do with agree with what some have mentioned about push hands
while respecting and understanding those that compete.

Anyone engaging with those that do in Taiwan or China may be in for a rude awakening .

Should be clear about one’s own skill set, and what the engagement Is about .

[D_Glenn]

Windwalker, you should really try to meet my teacher sometime. I wager that he could still show you things that you can’t fathom yet.

[windwalker]

Windwalker, you should really try to meet my teacher sometime. I wager that he could still show you things that you can’t fathom yet.

Not so hard to do : )
There are some things I find interesting others not so much .

My teacher was said to be a bagua master before meeting his teacher .
I’d wager, your teacher may have heard of him or knows others, that may even have known
him directly. Beijing is not so big in some aspects

One of his students practiced a square bagua stepping pattern
interesting.

Most of the things written about here, done routinely there .
It is interesting reading about it here , while noting whenever it’s demonstrated people don’t seem to make the connection
with what in many cases they just wrote about

[D_Glenn]

MaoDun. You know the Dun side. He won’t bore you with that. Tell him who you know and he will have some stories for sure. And he might show you what you’re missing- the Mao side of things. I never talk about it.

[windwalker]

MaoDun. You know the Dun side. He won’t bore you with that. Tell him who you know and he will have some stories for sure. And he might show you what you’re missing- the Mao side of things. I never talk about it.

What I'm missing

Can you do any of what is shown


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOK3HUj75Gs&t=50s



Tie En Fang Bagua Grand Master

are they the things you won't or can't talk about

Your teacher seems like a nice guy, quite skilled...

Should I need some advice on what I'm "missing" my taiji bothers would be the first to let me know..
and they do, seems I'm missing a lot...

[Trick]

Not being pushed is good until the hand pushing holds a knife

Immovable mind

[D_Glenn]

Ah no. Nothing like that.

More like stuff that uses Fanlangjin. And it happens at full speed. Plus other things. I just thought that being who you trained with, that you might have the best chance of being shown stuff without having to train with him. But there’s no guarantee.

Also, factor in that he’s trained for 6-12 hours a day since ‘74 and he’s basically lived like a monk. He did the whole daoist ascetic practice at the age of 18-26 and that makes a huge tangible difference.

.

[windwalker]

Ah no. Nothing like that.

thanks anyway


In my teachers group when he was teaching...
many did come from different IMA / CMA backgrounds.
Some from very famous teachers of his day.

Testing things out was done was done at speed...
as in try what you like with my teacher.
Done in the spirit of testing, confirming or just his way of teaching
some of what was mentioned.

The hrs spent training

3 in the morning, 3 in the afternoon
each and everyday rain or shine, hot or cold...

kind regards

[Giles]

I only see one type of pushing
Pushing to teach combat
If you get use to leaning on someone in competition you will ingrain that mentality
I always yield to stimulus
I may be dense but not in pushing
Dense is the perfect word those who stay when moving is the right path
In FMA they have a saying
Every hand hold a knife
That is said for two reasons
One to get you to move in a positive manner
Two because in the Philippines it is true
It may not be me that is dense but others who I decline at mentioning

I agree with this. If in certain moments or exercises you let your partner push against your body and you 'absorb' this force to some extent in order to return it to the partner, then only because you are training a specific (and important) body quality that you would NOT try to reproduce 1:1 in a real situation. This should be clear to both teacher and student. And most of the time you should be immediately yielding, deflecting. Or if using more explicit 'peng' at first contact, then just for a swift moment and not in a way that will get you eating the fist (or object) in the process.

Regarding stepping or not stepping: I think fixed-step tuishou is great IF you use it for training the waist/hips/legs to do the essential neutralizing, and not muscling or blocking with the upper body and arms. That's the good thing about fixed-step (applied properly) - you have to use the lower body and the correct type of relaxation to solve the problems being experienced by the upper body WITHOUT stepping away. That's a good training situation. But then, before you get used too much to not stepping, you need to train and integrate stepping (and sense of correct distance) as well. If the fixed-step training is done well, then in Tai Chi with moving steps the steps still arise from what's happening in the hips and waist, the same connections as in fixed-step. Now the connections are not only moving upwards from the center into the arms and hands, determining how they behave, but also downwards into the moving legs and feet, determining how they behave (and step) as well. The body becomes one, the same in stillness as in movement. This changes the nature of the steps and the use of space.
Even in my beginners' classes, I get the people stepping by relaxing and moving from the center of the body when faced by an 'attack'. Which means not freezing, but not retreating or skipping away either. This can still be congruent with fixed-step tuishou.

[wayne hansen]

My students spend a long time doing exercises where the feet don’t move
Next they do a lot of walking exercises long before they learn any form
The yang system has a set method of teaching pushing
First there are yielding excises where you only use the body not the hands to yield
Next fixed feet
The difference in our school is you can move the front foot as much as you like but not the back
Next moving step 3/3 and 2/3 sometimes called moving 4 hands
Ta lu follows
Then san shou
Followed by freestyle
The 4 weapons follow the same path

[D_Glenn]

Done in the spirit of testing, confirming or just his way of teaching

That one and the other video you posted are what falls under Tuina in our school.
If my grand teacher was still alive you would have a great time learning medical Bagua from him. His teacher was a wealthy man and took in the Imperial doctors after 1911. They had learned the medical and tuina bagua from Dong Haichuan. They had to treat mostly concubines inside the forbidden city, so the techniques had to be really effective but also not hands on. My grand teacher learned everything he could from them. He could use his fingers to Daoyin inside other people’s bodies. And that would be what you’re talking about. Medical use mostly, although it’s also useful in the Snake System’s Dian Xue. Where he would use the fingers to try to get blood clots to form inside certain arteries. Which requires a delicate touch or else it just causes a bruise to form. He was trying to show me something one time and I just froze up, he was moving at a snail’s speed, all the while he’s saying “defend yourself!” over and over, he was demonstrating a blood stopping attack, fingers pressed against the side of my head, and going through all the motions, but I just stood there, until finally it hit me what he was saying. And I defended myself.

.