Oh boy some more push hands vids

[origami_itto]

Yep I hid all the videos. That one was messed up though, I realized, it froze about halfway through. I rendered it across a network drive and I guess it starved out. Never noticed, nobody ever said anything. Figured it was a good sign nobody cared lol, so why bother continuing to expose myself in training for nothing more than criticism from folks too scared to show their face.

Might re-release if I get around to fixing the edit.

In the meantime, would absolutely LOVE to see some of your work.

[windwalker]

Kudos to anyone posting clips of their practice.

The OP clip, didn’t see much point in posting,
reading the some of the following post… well

Agree with Wayne’s assessment, not that it matters…
With out showing his work or those of his students as some others do,
find it hard to understand the basis of a view point…


Have touched hands with other teachers from the OP’s linage …They tended to view PH in the same way, maybe its the way their teachers viewed it…
kind of common among those not specializing in taiji…Even among many who do..

The Tung/Dong system as practiced had many practice patterns that trained and focus on different skill sets. Teaching and exposing one to different concepts they should be aware of…

Other teachers have less , as my teacher in Beijing did,,,preferring to practice directly on the skill sets themselves, it was not possible to push, at first touch it was over.
The basic beginning pattern was used, helping people to stay safe not getting injured in the process…

Those talking of free hand pushing , often have not really been exposed to any formal method except within their groups, the practice level determined by those in the group…
Being "free hand" for the most part they never really develop....Or continue to seek understanding through the practice which by its nature "free" it cannot provide...

PH itself becoming the determining way of testing skill, something that has been quite bad for taiji development…
a practice method turned into usage a kind of circular trap as it gets more and more specialized . In general those understanding this tend to avoid…

Other CMA arts using this as medium for training getting stuck in the same trap, also tend not to do well when really put to use with others who do not…
mantis, wing chun comes to mind…

Internal skill,,, external skill

All CMA is internal. The distinction one of focus and usage.

[wayne hansen]

Yes that’s the reason it disappeared
I’m sure you still have it not too late to post again seeing you both mentioned it here

[origami_itto]

Yes that’s the reason it disappeared
I’m sure you still have it not too late to post again seeing you both mentioned it here

Well as I said, I don't have a well rendered edit to upload since the one I made froze on render and appeasing your curiosity is pretty far down my list of priorities.

In the meantime, please... show us what you're working with.

[wayne hansen]

Sure

[Subitai]

So before I begin a reply to Wayne's laughable attack on me. I want to point out that I DO realize that I chose to post my vids on a public forum. Whereby it's perfectly normal to expect comments or criticism.

That being said, I was only trying to share something (in a way for people to understand) but I never attacked anyone's understanding or credibility at least nobody on this forum.

But Wayne having done so, and also attacking Itto ....( I didn't know he had beef with him, I'm not on this forum very much, i'm too busy training) ... has opened the door for me to respond in kind. He's already losing to my understanding of TC and he doesn't even know it.

In the classic, "if you don't move , I don't move....." And he did more than make the 1st move, he stuck his foot in it.

1) Wayne says basically, "he has never studied HG. but that one of his teachers has explained it to him in great depth"

WOW, just wow... you know i've never played Tennis but a pro has fully explained it to me in great depth. So now surprise!!!!! I can talk crap on people. HHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA ROTFL

Net effect , Wayne...what have we learned about you? YOU LOOSE because I already have a stick point to listen to you and have now ARRIVED FIRST. It looks bad man but by all means...keep writing your nonsense.

2) I only know Itto from the TBMA retreat. But I did touch hands with just about everyone there including him. You could watch the video of Itto and I touching hands, you couldn't possibly know my skill from that video.

Btw, If you have never been to a meet up like that, realize that you can go as hard or soft there as you wish. If you wanna sweep , do locks, or throws. Plenty of guys there willing to accommodate you.
* Now personally, my Litmus test for APPLYING is this: Can I use what I know VS opponents who are unwilling and trying hard to stop me. ESPECIALLY CAN I APPLY TO COMPLETE STRANGERS WHOM I'VE NEVER MET BEFORE?
I've been doing just that with my tai chi since the 90's non-stop. Everyone I've touch hands with, teachers and their instructors all the same thing, "You have good Tai Chi".

* Wayne commenting on me "Keyboard style" means only surface value me. So contrasting your comments to the many I have rec'd = YOU LOOSE again.

3) In reality Wayne, have you really done your homework? You are what I call a "Tai Chi Almighty-ist" (its unbecoming) How many styles of Tai Chi are there...coupled with how many teachers of different lineages? Each with their own understanding of Tai Chi. Your knowledge of tai chi couldn't possibly be THE ONLY SOURCE or reference. It smacks of Arrogance and it makes you look bad.

Its' like saying you're the only one who knows how to BBQ . HAHA.... Here again, YOU LOOSE.

4) About the grip for example, I could've went 50 ways with that but lets play.
** I could have just used PENG and adhered to his center and just thrown him back. But that is boring and everyone does that. MABE I should have had Louie do a windwalker style woo woo jumpy jump?

First, if you are one of those people that think that gripping never happens or YOUR school never approved of grabbing or training it. THAT TELLS ME ...all I need to know about you.

Second, If you're expecting a confusing example of me connecting my chi to my Friggin FASHIA ... Haahahahh... nope. Those are the people who fail the hardest under real pressure.

Third, I was using a simple example to explain to people, what is the "Point of Contact" or Stick Point as to what is the "Power Point" or focus.
Are you saying that Tai chi never establishes a point of touch? I await your almighty answer? Hahha

Fourth, I make the distinction That the point of contact is NOT necessarily the same as the point of focus or power.

Both those concepts are absolutely within Tai Chi, if you never learned that, you suck.
Extending your energy or chi to your furthest extremities like the finger tips is a common basic in our Tai Chi...and as you progress, it must go beyond your extremities. it's not about muscle or hard power.

Now, IF you learned something different...good for you. But is it the only way?

oh crap I just saw your HIGH and ALMIGHTY saying: "Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form

Your power evolves naturally from the form? Wow a nice idea... That's soft talk, that happens under nice conditions like a Lab.

You ever fought professionally or in any arena with real pressure? Did you just naturally let the form WOO WOO fa jing the guy into siberia. NO? but Please tell us how your sifu could do it back in the day.

[origami_itto]

Okay I'm gonna get that video edited lol.

[wayne hansen]

Gee I must have got too close to the truth
Yes I have fought in many local tournaments in the day
I competed in the 1975 TST World Tournament in Taiwan
Training from 73 in a Kung Fu school we had everyone come and try us out
I didn’t attack Ito
I know every time I put up an opposing view to his he thinks it’s a personal attack
It’s not
What I did say if you use him as a guage of someone having real skill it’s a low bar
No it is not the same as tennis as I was training other things with my teacher and he would explain a lot through a HG lens
I did not attack you I pointed out where you stepped out of the tai chi sphere
Nothing wrong with combining any number of arts but admit that when you step out of one that is what you are doing

[origami_itto]

Jeez wayne, why would I consider that an attack...

I put my faults on display for you. What you got to show us beyond stories about shit you did when Chuck Norris was non-ironically relevant?

[origami_itto]

Here you go.

[Bao]

Here you go.

It's set to private.

[origami_itto]

Try now.

[origami_itto]

Yes that’s the reason it disappeared

Wanted to loop back to this.

YOU are the reason I took down my videos. I put them up for people to get an idea of what push hands is about. The culture and practice and exercise out here, but you insist on being rude and insulting about the people that are showing up and putting aside their egos and putting in the work.

To be clear as my conscience, I put it up because Onassis made reference to it and it seemed relevant. The longer clip is the one that is frozen.

If all you see is people that don't get better year after year, as you said, then just don't watch. Your opinion has ceased to mean anything to me and I'll say the same to anyone who asks.

[wayne hansen]

How about someone else commenting
There must be someone who sees what is going on

[BruceP]

How about someone else commenting
There must be someone who sees what is going on

It's only acceptable to be critical of a person's work if that person isn't an RSFer. If someone is critical of an RSfer's work, they're just rude...or worse.

I posted lots of my work back in the day and it'd get shit on by people who couldn't tai chi their way out of a wet paper bag. It was always entertaining and often hilarious.

Some of the newer people here need to get a helmet