The Russians are coming.

[vehu]

[grzegorz]

I disagree about nazis. I've known people with swastika tattoos and people who were skinheads. It's just a word and for these people it was just phase they went through after dealing with anti-white racism and getting jumped by minorities. American History X shows how this works very well. These people had nothing to do with the holocaust.

Can you prove the CIA was responsible for the Chechen war? By the way, the documentary wasn't just for you. Sounds like you didn't watch it anyway.

When RTF runs out of footage in Eastern Ukraine they could just run footage of what the Russians did in Chechnya. In fact they should do a split screen of both events. Like I said the Ukraine is dealing with their terrorists the same way as the Russians.

If you want I'd be happy to present more evidence of Putin's history of murder. Could be why some of the world wants nothing to do with him. I'd rather deal with a puppet than a murderer.

[Azer]

I disagree about nazis. I've known people with swastika tattoos and people who were skinheads. It's just a word and for these people it was just phase they went through after dealing with anti-white racism and getting jumped by minorities. American History X shows how this works very well. These people had nothing to do with the holocaust.

Sure I've seen it that movie too.

Can you prove the CIA was responsible for the Chechen war? By the way, the documentary wasn't just for you. Sounds like you didn't watch it anyway.

Actually, I was talking about Saudi Arabia, a special friend of the US/NATO with very similar idealogical leanings.

When RTF runs out of footage in Eastern Ukraine they could just run footage of what the Russians did in Chechnya. In fact they should do a split screen of both
events. Like I said the Ukraine is dealing with their terrorists the same way as the Russians.

What's RTF?

Murder in Chechnya was wrong, that doesn't make murder in Ukraine right. Particularity, when these crimes are white washed by the ironically named "free press".

If you want I'd be happy to present more evidence of Putin's history of murder. Could be why some of the world wants nothing to do with him. I'd rather deal with a puppet than a murderer.

Present away if you feel the urge to, do check your sources though. I would however wager that I know more on this topic than most board members, so I doubt it would be of relevance to me.

[grzegorz]

Here's is the nazi word being thrown the other way. From now on perhaps I'll use the word nazi for Putin and the rebels.

[Azer]

You can, but you would need to present evidence for it to be convincing I. E. showing political/ideological nazi traits or even open displays of nazi symbolism and such.

[grzegorz]

Treatment of gays, suppressing the media and not respecting the borders of neighboring countries.

[Azer]

Lol... if you're going by that criteria, you will have a very long list of nazi countries.

Meantime, the US has started back peddling and making excuses, and has yet to provide any evidence for its assertions despite claiming to have some.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28429161

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28415769

Funny that, all you would see in the 'exceptionally free' MSM is "Russia, Putin, Russia, Putin..." but no evidence, just crap like "maybe", "likely", etc. Its also very odd that the MSM has tried to again whitewash the fake Ukranian evidence which has now been verified as fake and yet hardly any reports or even comment on actual evidence provided by Russia.

Perhaps its time to wheel out Colin Powell again.

[grzegorz]

They've tracked the location in the where the Buk fired the missle to the town of a Snizhnoye in rebel territory.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -site.html

[windwalker]

So why hasn’t this question of U.S. spy-in-the-sky photos – and what they reveal – been pressed by the major U.S. news media? How can the Washington Post run front-page stories, such as the one on Sunday with the definitive title “U.S. official: Russia gave systems,” without demanding from these U.S. officials details about what the U.S. satellite images disclose?

http://consortiumnews.com/2014/07/20/wh ... n-ukraine/

one would think if they had such images, there would be no questions
about where it was launched, and who.

The officials also declined to provide more details on the satellites and other sophisticated sensors that enabled them to trace the path of the missile, citing concerns about compromising secret U.S. capabilities.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/nat ... story.html

should be easy to go to the site and see if it has traces of a recent launch.

[grzegorz]

People will just say it was made on a computer. They've named the town and from my understanding it was same location the rebels say they shot down a plane on social networks.

The US isn't backpedaling as much as saying they can't name the person who pushed the button.

I'd actually have more respect for whoever did this if they just admitted it and apologized. This is just pathetic!

[Steve James]

Nobody likes to admit mistakes. In this case, not everyone there knows who did what. However, certainly someone does; and whether he or she talks now or sometime in the future, the truth will come out (just as in KAL 007). Someone gave the order, and someone pushed the button. It's useless to blame the "pro-Russians" or Russians for the crash. Otoh, the treatment of the scene, the bodies, the recorders, etc., is another issue. MSM (i.e., CNN) has shown pictures of the cockpit which inspectors have allegedly said has been deliberately sawn in two.

[grzegorz]

No one here is blaming the Russians as much as we are discussing other things related to the crash.

It was obviously a mistake but someone should own up to it for the sake of the victim's families.

[Steve James]

Yeah, but people seem to be defensive about it; i.e., many of the arguments have been explanations of how the Russians or pro-Russians were not involved, or that someone else was. My point wasn't that anyone wasn't at fault. My point was that, in all likelihood, 99% of the pro-Russians or Donetskians (?) are appalled at the loss of life. So, imo, action against them as a group --because of the accident-- really has nothing to do with caring for the passengers. There should be anger, a lot of it, and it should be as focused as possible. Hey, people are going to blame the US or Ukraine, too.

[grzegorz]

Monday's Daily Show.

http://thedailyshow.cc.com/full-episode ... sue-turton

[windwalker]

Some of the Stingers that the U.S. supplied starting from 1987, could have been used during the U.S. intervention in Afghanistan. Due to political reasons, U.S. and coalition forces generally play down or even deny any MANPADS involvement in the Afghan War by Afghan insurgents, attributing the attacks to unguided RPGs. However it became clear that coalition aircraft came under attack by different types of MANPADS in different instances.[31][32]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIM-92_Stinger

just for reference
civilian jets fly at 32000 to 40000 feet.
stingers have a range of about 25000 feet.