Police brutality?

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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby grzegorz on Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:20 pm

The city of San Jose is looking at removing the grand jury process from their justice system hopefully other cities will do the same.
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:45 pm

how would it change anything.
they would still have to charge the officer with something.
who would charge him, the one being arrested?

this was billed as a wht officer killing a blk suspect, overlooking the fact that he was part
of team, who where affecting an arrest based upon being called and directed to.
they couldnt just give him a ticket,,,or come back when he was in a better mood.
he resisted the arrest, and died en rout because of complications due to poor health
resisting the arrest. there was no intent to kill or cause his death.

the officer in charge directed the way in which he was to be taken down.

in this case why is only the one officer being charged when he was part of team
directed by a person of "color" who didnt stop it, and didnt file any complaints againts
her officer.

the news should interview her, why have they not done this?
why has she not come out in defense of an officer under her command?

who should be charged?

as far as what cops think of it,
Joe319,

I'm not really sure what you're talking about. This website is open to the public, and anyone could grab a screenshot of the comments section on an article.

It doesn't really matter to me though, because I could give a shit less if some hipster news site gets pissy about what we have to say. They want to treat the Eric Garner case as if he was murdered in cold blood by the police. If a cop gets in a foot chase and has a heart attack due to his poor physical conditioning, the people at "Policy Mic" would say it was his fault and that he should have known the risks of the job. Well the same goes for Eric Garner. He fought some cops, and his body couldn't handle it.

"It's all in the game." - Omar Little

http://www.policeone.com/Crowd-Control/ ... -protests/

interesting reading the comments
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby grzegorz on Wed Dec 10, 2014 1:02 am

Wow a cop supports everything the cops did and attacks any criticism as a bunch of pansy liberal nonsense. What a surprise! Very profound speaker there, was he an intellectual before or after going into law enforcement?
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:51 am

try addressing any of the facts presented.
its always good to know what and where the other side is coming from
and make ones own view point on it.

you mentioned news sources but declined to post your sources

this event just as other events, looks one way until one starts to look at
the whole story, from many sources,
instead of the populist news narrative.

you mentioned going for a ride along with some officers.
what do they do when people resist arrest?

write them a ticket?
come back when they'er feeling better?
say have a nice day, this was only warning?
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby Steve James on Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:53 am

try addressing any of the facts presented.


:) Okay, do you think that the Black officer in charge should be indicted? Clearly not, your point was that it wasn't a chokehold, that it was legal, that Garner resisted, that he was out of shape and that he died in the ambulance.

So, the other point is that there was a Black officer in charge, that Black business people called the officers in the first place, and that the only reason that the White officer was threatened with indictment was because he was White. Of course, one could also say that the reason he wasn't indicted was because he was White. But, that wouldn't fit with the fact that there were non-Whites on the grand jury panel. Hmm, what does that say about them? I mean, about the Black business people who care about neighborhood crime and the Black police officers and the Black jurors? Was there a Black judge, too?

Well, I ask that because it seems like the underlying (code) argument is that the media and the race-obsessed are turning this into a race issue. Wow. Bad on them. Even though Eric Garner's daughter and mother and many of other people on tv and here have said that it isn't a race issue, the claim that it is continues to persist. The demonstrations and protests are as diverse as any that a person will ever see. It's way more diverse than most churches on Sunday. Morever, the emphasis can't be on bad White cops. White people aren't out there saying that White people are bad. It's the opposite. First of all, it's against unnecessary violence. That goes back to "Don't taze me bro." But, yes, for Black men, it is taken more seriously.

Ah, but then you ask, why aren't there demonstrations when Blacks kill Blacks, or Blacks kill Whites, or Whites kill Whites? Well, the uncoded answer is "because White people are blamed for everything." Meaning, of course, that when people demonstrate against the (multiracial) police, they are really demonstrating against White people. "Bad cop" equals "bad White man." Every time an incident like this is reported, the same sentiment arises. Personally, I think that's why the media gets so focused on these events. They know that people will watch. So, I do blame the media somewhat. But, it is made up of the same people who consume it, and it panders to them.

We have a choice, though. We can believe that it's a meaningful Black/White thing or we can see it as meaningless. We can address peoples' actions without reference to the color. Now, you'll have to excuse me, but I'll never feel bad for the way people who believe in the Black/White thing feel. I really don't care if their feelings are hurt. That's their problem. However, I will always be concerned about people who end up dead unnecessarily. It's not even about how to punish anyone. It's about how to keep people alive.
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:48 pm

I will always be concerned about people who end up dead unnecessarily. It's not even about how to punish anyone. It's about how to keep people alive


tell them not to run or resit arrest

A chase ensued and Rodriguez was hit when a police car turned a corner and in the darkness failed to see him crouching near the sidewalk, according to the police statement. "The subject either fell or was attempting to hide the spray cans under a nearby car," the statement said.

Evidence indicated that the police car was traveling less than 15 miles per hour at the point of impact, it said.


Rodriguez is the second street artist to die in the Miami area in the past 16 months. Israel Hernandez-Llach, 18, died in August last year after being struck by a police Taser gun when he was cornered by officers who spotted him spray-painting a building in Miami Beach.


maybe they should have mailed him a ticket or something.

Protesters also called for justice in Hernandez-Llach’s case. The family has sued both the Miami Beach Police Department and the officer who tased him, and the case is being reviewed by the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.


of course they are,,,justice gotta love it.
I wonder what the "protesters" would say if he had spay painted their houses or cars.
http://news.yahoo.com/graffiti-tagger-d ... 49151.html

dont try it in singapor

A former Florida State University football star may become the first American in 16 years to be caned in Singapore after he overstayed his tourist visa.
Kamari Charlton, 37, was arrested as he tried to leave the country.
He claimed he failed to leave when his 90-day visa expired because his wife was receiving medical care for complications in her pregnancy.
The offence is punishable in Singapore with a maximum jail term of six months and at least three strokes of the cane.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z3LXd6mwhC
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haha funny, he probably thought it was like the US, no victim shit gonna play there.
take it like a man,,,its only 3 strokes. and a little time.
maybe the "president" can get it reduced to 2.. maybe ;)

The U.S. Embassy said it is monitoring the case.
‘Embassy officials have provided consular assistance to this individual, including five visits by consular officers,’ said a spokesman.
‘We remind U.S. citizens that foreigners in any country are subject to the laws of that country. We respect Singapore's right to try and sentence individuals within due process of law,’ he added.
The Southeast Asian country boasts one of the lowest violent crime rates and highest standards of living in the world, but human rights groups often criticize the government for severe punishments, such as a mandatory death penalty for drug traffickers.
Singapore also reiterated a ban on the sale of chewing gum and announced a crackdown on littering this year.


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No mercy: Michael Fay was the last American to be lashed in Singapore after committing vandalism in 1994 (file photo)

Nevertheless, then and late President Ong Teng Cheong commuted Fay's caning from six to four strokes as a gesture of respect toward Clinton.[11] Shiu's sentence was later also reduced, from twelve strokes to six, after a similar clemency appeal.

Fay received four strokes of the cane across his bare buttocks on May 5, 1994, at Queenstown Remand Centre


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The Southeast Asian country boasts one of the lowest violent crime rates and highest standards of living in the world, but human rights groups often criticize the government for severe punishments, such as a mandatory death penalty for drug traffickers :o .


wow lowest crime rate, and highest standard of living in the world.
not to worry, go ol USA has got them beat we have the most people in jail than any other place in the world...

take that Singapore ;) .

havent been there in a long time, being a lifetime member of the Singapor chinwoo association
maybe I need to go check it out again,,,,nice place, good people and food.
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby Steve James on Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:58 pm

tell them not to run or resit arrest


"Them"? Can't talk to the dead, anyway.

Damn, though, that's a bunch of research and commentary. Oh well, I tried addressing the question.

Oh yeah, education is the key.
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Wed Dec 10, 2014 5:04 pm

Steve James wrote:
tell them not to run or resit arrest


"Them"? Can't talk to the dead, anyway.

Damn, though, that's a bunch of research and commentary. Oh well, I tried addressing the question.

Oh yeah, education is the key.


which I appreciated, thank you.

I do agree that being more educated on
what to do or not is key....

this is what would prevent others from joining the dead
sooner then expected.


in other places the "law" is pretty clear
caning,,,damm dosnt sound to good :o
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:09 pm

grzegorz wrote:No one is being manipulated by the press anymore than you are. I do agree that the press loves this stuff, including FOX and MSNBC (neither of which I watch or even consider news).

I'm coming at this from the perspective of someone of spent two years of my life trying to get in law enforcement. The way I see it If I was given a scenario question for this situation I would have said I would give the man a ticket and have moved and that would have been the correct answer. I know a lot of cops (both good and bad) and they've told me that things like this are a police department's worse nightmare. I even had a friend who was in a similar situation (no one died) over a hit and run and his reprimanded him for not just writing a ticket.

It should be noted that what is being argued is whether or not there should have been a trial. No one is being manipulated to believe there should be a trial but without a trial we never have all the details.


you asked for some of the details, this isnt fox ;) but it addresses many of the points that I tried to make on this case and others like it.
as far as issuing a ticket, if he took it and then either didnt pay it or failed to show up at a court date, a bench warrant for his arrest would have been issued.
it would bring it back to being arrested or resisting the arrest.

had it gone trail, the same findings and issues would have been addressed and found, just as in the TM case what ever one may think of it.
not saying there are no problems with the way the police do things, only that the problems that many are trying to address by tying it into this case IMO is very misguided.

Although the major media remain mum on the subject, it appears that a black female sergeant by the name of Kizzy Adoni supervised the arrest of the 6’4,” 400 lb. Eric Garner in New York City on July 17, 2014. As NYPD Officer Daniel Pantaleo and former LAPD Sergeant Stacey Koon can attest, there seems to a serious double standard at play here.

Unlike Missouri, New York State allows only very limited disclosure of grand jury proceedings. What follows is based on the bits of evidence that have made their way into the public sphere. The most compelling of that evidence is the three-minute amateur video of Garner’s arrest. This video has numerous edits so it is impossible to draw a perfect timeline of events.

The video shows the massive Garner loudly telling two undercover officers that he does not want to be arrested for selling black market cigarettes. Garner, 43, had been arrested more than thirty times previously on charges including assault and resisting arrest. He had also been arrested several times previously for selling unlicensed cigarettes and was out on bail when arrested. they had to arrest him

Knowing this, the officers appear to fence with Garner while they wait for back-up to arrive. They are also well aware that an unfriendly witness is shooting video. Given the edits in the video, it is impossible to tell how long they waited, but it was at least a few minutes. Finally, Pantaleo, an eight-year veteran, attempts to grab Garner’s arm to handcuff him, and Garner throws him off. “Don’t touch me,” he shouts. the video clip was edited, dosnt say who or why

At this point, Pantaleo, who is about a half a foot shorter and 200 pounds lighter than Garner, leaps up and puts Garner in a headlock. According to Police Benevolent Association President Pat Lynch, Pantaleo did “nothing more than take Mr. Garner into custody as instructed.” He did so using “the take-down technique that he learned in the academy.” The classic chokehold, the kind featured in the Spike Lee movie Do the Right Thing, is intended to cause a struggling perp to lose consciousness.

Pantaleo’s goal is to take Garner down, which he does with some success. He keeps him in that hold for about fifteen seconds. Had Garner not health problems -- obesity, advanced diabetes, heart disease and asthma -- he likely would not have been hurt. There were 228,000 misdemeanor arrests in New York City in 2013. No others ended in this fashion.


As Pantaleo and several other officers hold Garner down to cuff him, Garner repeats several times, “I can’t breathe.” He obviously can, but he is clearly in some distress. A second video shows several officers tending to Garner, now lying on his side, as they await an ambulance.

Six minutes into this second video, the officers load Garner onto a stretcher, no easy task, and he is carted away. By this point, however, he seems to have lost consciousness. He reportedly suffers cardiac arrest in the ambulance and dies in the hospital an hour later. he died later en route to the hosp

Among the few media outlets to address the role of Sgt. Adoni was the aptly named LA Progressive. Cheryl Dorsey, a black former LAPD sergeant, took Adoni to task. “I am appalled by the seeming lack of leadership displayed by the sergeant on the scene during the #ICantBreathe incident,” Dorsey wrote. Adoni, Dorsey explained, was expected to manage and control the subordinate officers under her command. “So then for a sergeant, and a black woman at that, to stand idly by and do nothing is egregious,” she concluded.

Only Pantaleo, however, faced indictment. Adoni, by contrast, was offered immunity to testify against him. Sgt. Stacey Koon, who managed the arrest of Rodney King after a high-speed chase in 1991, had no such luck. Like Adoni, he merely supervised the scene and did not touch King during the arrest. Unlike Garner, King survived the arrest. Nevetheless, Koon was tried in a criminal court for an excess use of force.

At the trial, the defense attorneys convinced the jury that the officers were following procedure. After the acquittal of Koon and three other officers, a massive riot erupted in Los Angeles that led to fifty-three deaths. In an apparent effort to appease the black community, the Department of Justice tried and convicted Koon of violating King’s civil rights -- double jeopardy in all but name -- and sentenced him to thirty months in prison.

Although not indicted by the Richmond County [Staten Island] grand jury, nine of whose twenty-four members were minorities, Pantaleo may have a civil rights case of his own. As PBA president Lynch noted, Pantaleo took Garner into custody “as instructed.” What caused Garner such distress was not so much the take-down as the pressure three officers, Pantaleo among them, brought to bear on Garner in trying to cuff him. Health professionals call this “restraint-related positional asphyxia.” It was during this sequence that Garner repeated, “I can’t breathe.” interesting enough the officer may have a case againts those in charge "Pantaleo took Garner into custody “as instructed." "restraint-rlated positional asphyxia" caused by 3 officers trying to take him down under the instruction of the sergeant in charge

Adoni could have called the officers off, much as Koon could have called the officers off King, but she did not. The initial police report quotes Adoni as saying, “The perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and he did not appear to get worse.”

That Adoni was offered immunity, and Koon or Pantaleo not, gives the appearance at least of a race-based application of justice.

Pantaleo has one other major gripe. As a result of affirmative action, collective bargaining, and the Americans with Disabilities Act, the NYPD ranks are loaded with physically useless cops. Many of them were on the scene that day. At least two male officers were less than 5’ 6” and slight. Three other male officers were obese, one shockingly so, and the two female sergeants appeared to be both short and overweight. If Pantaleo had not been there, it is hard to imagine how his colleagues would have effected an arrest.
he happened to be the lucky or unlucky one that happened to be able to effect the arrest


There are lessons to be learned in studying this incident, but none of them holds much interest for the activists, the media, the New York City mayor, and the White House. They have got their narrative, and they will stick to it, even after it falls apart. For their part, the police will quietly withdraw from pro-active policing in black communities. As the treatment of Daniel Pantaleo and Ferguson’s Darren Wilson have shown, there is no future in it.

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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Sun Dec 14, 2014 5:56 pm

all the protesting for "black lives matter"
where are they now, why is it they only seem to matter when
a wht officer happens to be the cause of death?
A 17-year-old male has been charged with murder in the shooting death of 15-year-old Demario Bailey on the city's South Side.

http://news.yahoo.com/video/teen-charge ... 39858.html


AUBURN, Ala. — An arrest was made Sunday in connection with fatal shooting of Auburn freshman football player Jakell Mitchell.

Auburn Police, along with the Tallapoosa County Sheriff Department and Jackson Gap Police, arrested Markale Deandra Hart, 22, of Camp Hill, Ala., on felony murder charges.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nc ... /20401727/
condolences to the families for their loss

2 different news sources,,,at least the reporting is consistent in their omissions.
need another t-shirt

I cant breathe / hands up don't shoot / Don't shoot me brother
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby windwalker on Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:50 am

http://news.yahoo.com/video/video-texas ... 58436.html
A Texas police officer has been placed on administrative duty after his dashboard camera caught him Tasering an elderly man.


had he died we would be hearing about police brutality ect.

what is it about resisting arrest that people dont understand
one would think that an "elderly man" would know better
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby Steve James on Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:55 am

Resistance is futile.
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby Michael on Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:30 pm

Resistance is futile.

So is talking to people on certain topics, myself included, but as men we must...not...give....up

or the other guy wins and takes all the ???
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby Steve James on Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:47 pm

Nobody's gotta win :) In fact, that's the whole point of discussion --contrary as it might seem. Even if words are violent, no blood is shed; and we can start all over tomorrow. Of course, when people take it personally, it affects the gall. Not good.

Anyway, resistance is futile works both ways. Stuff changes; people do what they do.
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Re: Police brutality in New York?

Postby Michael on Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:50 pm

windwalker wrote:http://news.yahoo.com/video/video-texas-police-officer-caught-090558436.html
A Texas police officer has been placed on administrative duty after his dashboard camera caught him Tasering an elderly man.


had he died we would be hearing about police brutality ect.

what is it about resisting arrest that people dont understand
one would think that an "elderly man" would know better


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVNwPD7CPR8
Not gonna bother trying to say anything to you, WW, but here's the video.
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