Trump makes the cut

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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby windwalker on Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:47 am

Canon 2C. Membership of a judge in an organization that practices invidious discrimination gives rise to perceptions that the judge’s impartiality is impaired.

Canon 2C refers to the current practices of the organization. Whether an organization practices invidious discrimination is often a complex question to which judges should be sensitive. The answer cannot be determined from a mere examination of an organization’s current membership rolls but rather depends on how the organization selects members and other relevant factors, such as that the organization is dedicated to the preservation of religious, ethnic or cultural values of legitimate common interest to its members, or that it is in fact and effect an intimate, purely private organization whose membership limitations could not be constitutionally prohibited.

http://www.uscourts.gov/judges-judgeshi ... tes-judges

It would seem that the judge based on his actions and cultural affiliations and support of,
would give the Trump some concern given the positions he has outlined in protection the the US border.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 9:13 am

chud first:
Kind of like saying, "All white jury", like it's automatically a bad thing.


"Bad," no, the word would be "unfair BECAUSE they were White." Now, of course, if Trump is right that the judge is biased against him QUOTE: "because he's Mexican and I want to build a wall" --which was his answer 23 times when he defended his statement-- Then it why couldn't a non-White defendant say that the White judge and jury were biased? Given that in some Southern states, at some points, all the judges belonged to the KKK. In fact, it would be reasonable to assume. IF Trump is right about "heritage" being a deciding factor. AND the solution (the ahem, "American" way is that justice (and judges) are supposed to be blind. IF Trump is right, then how could anyone who's known to support Trump's wall get a fair trial from a Mexican judge, or a Muslim judge, or a "liberal" judge.

@windy :)
well it wouldn't be true, nor would it have anything to do with what the clip outlined. In both post you either excuse the behavior or as in this post redirect...


I didn't bother to watch the clip. I can address what Trump said, which was that the judge was biased because he was Mexican. 1) he's no more Mexican than Trump is German. 2) The judge, in fact, doesn't belong to a political action group (La Raza); he belongs to an association of Hispanic lawyers known by the same name. This was even pointed out on FOX news. 3) The judge could have had the trial start before the election. Instead, he postponed it until the election was over. If he wanted to hurt Trump's chances, he seemed to have acted against that wish. 4) If the judge's background (parentage) was really a legal issue, then Trump's lawyers would have jumped on it from the beginning. Or they would have made the claim in court.

5) Is Trump said that the judge had simply been "Unfair," okay. Saying that the judge is unfair BECAUSE he is Mexican, and BECAUSE Trump wants to build a wall, is as even most Republicans have acknowledged that the Trump's remarks fit the "textbook definition of racism." (Btw, I think they're technically wrong, so I just call it stupidity. It's also contrary to American principles --as I understand them. YMMV.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 9:33 am

I'll bet that Trump, and most of his supporters, also believe that they'd be absolutely fair if they were judging a "Mexican" born in Indiana. I mean, how could anyone even question their objectivity and commitment to justice.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 9:44 am

windwalker wrote:
Canon 2C. Membership of a judge in an organization that practices invidious discrimination gives rise to perceptions that the judge’s impartiality is impaired.

Canon 2C refers to the current practices of the organization. Whether an organization practices invidious discrimination is often a complex question to which judges should be sensitive. The answer cannot be determined from a mere examination of an organization’s current membership rolls but rather depends on how the organization selects members and other relevant factors, such as that the organization is dedicated to the preservation of religious, ethnic or cultural values of legitimate common interest to its members, or that it is in fact and effect an intimate, purely private organization whose membership limitations could not be constitutionally prohibited.

http://www.uscourts.gov/judges-judgeshi ... tes-judges

It would seem that the judge based on his actions and cultural affiliations and support of,
would give the Trump some concern given the positions he has outlined in protection the the US border.


It's probably just an oversight on your part and not deliberate dishonesty, but the section concerns a judge who belongs to an association that promotes or practices discrimination. So, if a judge belonged to the KKK, then his impartiality could be questioned. Makes sense, but what group does the judge belong to? Here's the answer.
As Donald Trump’s attacks on U.S. District Judge Gonzalo Curiel's Mexican heritage were being roundly condemned, he and his supporters turned their fire on an innocent bystander: The San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association, which counts Curiel among its members.

San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association is a pretty typical professional group that promotes diversity and Latino empowerment in the legal community. You can find similar organizations for African American lawyers, Asian lawyers, female lawyers and so forth, as well as parallel organizations in almost every other industry.

Now, thanks to a smear campaign by Trump and his supporters, who have used Curiel's connections to the group to justify the presumptive GOP nominee's attacks on him, the attorneys group has had to defend itself against claims of having a "radical" agenda, being racist, and of unduly influencing Curiel. Like other institutions and people targeted by Trump and his associates, the attention has also led a backlash of "hateful" phone calls, emails and Facebook post, according to the group.

“Mr. Trump is a smart man, and he’s a deploying a certain kind of language that is xenophobic and jingoistic which he has used to rally his campaign, and I think he’s done this to distract people," San Diego La Raza's president Luis Osuna told TPM.


So, if some fool argues that belonging to that group is disqualifying, all he has to do is Google ... Jewish lawyers association, Asian-Pacific bar association, etc., etc. But, let's not forget the BIG lie often works.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 9:51 am

Better yet, from the president of their organization.
San Diego, CA – The San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association along with Tom Homann LGBT Law Association and Justicia Criminal Defense Lawyers announce a response to Donald Trump’s misleading remarks about the San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association and his repeated comments regarding U.S. District Court Judge Gonzalo Curiel.

By Luis O. Osuna, San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association President:

In recent days our organization and Judge Curiel have become the targets of Donald Trump’s attacks. The comments made by Trump have been misleading, blatant lies and even racist in nature. Given the amount of attention that Trump’s remarks have produced, this statement seeks to clarify who we are as an association, our purpose and the abject impropriety of Trump’s criticism of Judge Curiel and his attacks on the independence of the judiciary.

A part of the general public has made assumptions about our organization based on our association’s name. It is important to note that while the term “La Raza” literally translates into “the race”, its literal translation does not reflect its cultural meaning. In that context, La Raza refers to the concept of the power of the people working together in the name of justice and in the face of adversity. It is in this sense that our association invokes “La Raza.”

The San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association (SDLRLA) is a local diversity bar association whose reputation among the San Diego legal community is highly regarded. Our focus is “to advance the cause of equality, empowerment and justice for Latino attorneys and the Latino community in San Diego County through service and advocacy. We are dedicated to promoting diversity on both the bench and bar…” (http://sdlrla.com/about/mission-statement/).

SDLRLA’s membership consists of lawyers, judges, law students and other professionals who work with lawyers in a professional capacity. Our membership of about 300 individuals is not monolithic, consisting of members with diverse backgrounds–conservatives, liberals, Republicans, Democrats and Latinos and non-Latinos alike.

We provide our members with professional development seminars, professional networking events, mentorship programs, and award scholarships and bar stipends open to law students of all ethnic backgrounds. In addition, we provide the Latino community with information about legal resources, organize “Know Your Rights” seminars and host candidate debates during local elections that focus on issues primarily affecting the Latino community. While our association is non-partisan, we do endorse candidates whose values align with our mission statement; however, such endorsements have included candidates from both major political parties.

Contrary to what Trump has stated, we are not affiliated with the National Council of La Raza (NCLR). NCLR is a wholly independent civil rights and advocacy non-profit organization. (http://www.nclr.org/about-us/who-we-are/). SDLRLA has not been involved in organizing any Trump protests, nor do we work in conjunction with NCLR.


As an association that provides limited services, we direct members of the Latino community in need of help to other organizations. As such, on our website we have a page titled, “For the Community,” which lists links to numerous organizations across the country that serve the Latino community. These organizations focus on various issues, including police practices, healthcare, immigration and human trafficking, to name a few.

On this page there is a link to NCLR’s website, constituting the only tenuous connection SDLRLA has to NCLR.
Furthermore, SDLRLA does not condone any of the violence exhibited by both sides of the protests taking place outside of Trump rallies throughout the country. Our association is committed to effecting change through lawful means and firmly believes that violence only serves to undercut otherwise legitimate concerns.

Regarding Trump’s comments about Judge Curiel. Judge Curiel is a member of our association, as are many other local attorneys and judges of all ethnic backgrounds. By now, most people are aware of the barrage of attacks levied by Trump. Specifically, Trump’s racist remarks claiming that Judge Curiel’s Mexican heritage makes him incapable of acting in an unbiased manner while presiding over two of the Trump University lawsuits.
Appropriately so, the judicial code of conduct does not allow Judge Curiel to respond to Trump’s unjustified attacks. Nevertheless, it is imperative to clarify that we are not speaking for Judge Curiel, but rather, we are speaking as legal professionals concerned about the baseless attacks on a man of integrity and their wider implications. As fellow members of the professional legal community, it is incumbent upon us to defend Judge Curiel’s unimpeachable integrity and to highlight the dangers of such criticism of a federal judge by a presumptive presidential nominee.

Judge Curiel, who is a U.S.-born citizen, is a well respected member of the legal community. His reputation is held in high esteem by attorneys who have encountered him both as a federal prosecutor and as a state or federal judge. He is an exemplar of public service who risked his life in prosecuting members of the Arellano-Felix drug cartel. A task he courageously and successfully undertook took to protect all Americans–his own Mexican heritage notwithstanding.

The notion that Judge Curiel’s Mexican heritage precludes him from being impartial as he presides over the Trump University lawsuits is completely at odds with the views of legal experts across the nation and untethered from reality. African–American judges have presided over civil rights cases; female judges have presided over gender discrimination matters; both have done so impartially. One need only look to Justice Clarence Thomas of the U.S. Supreme Court who has repeatedly ruled to strike down laws enacted to protect the rights of African-Americans, despite his own ethnic background.

If we allow Trump’s comments to become perfunctory within the normal parameters of political discourse, we then risk descending into a country that reduces every individual down to their ethnic heritage, gender, religion or political ideology. Inevitably, this will lead to the improper use of these metrics to measure an individual’s abilities.

Trump’s repeated accusations of Judge Curiel display an utter lack of understanding for the role we play as attorneys and judges sworn to follow the law and uphold the Constitution. We do not question Trump’s First Amendment right to give his opinion as a named defendant in a civil suit; however, Trump is not the average civilian––he is the presumptive presidential nominee for one of the two major political parties.

This fact should raise concerns among all Americans on both ends of the political spectrum. His persistent attacks on Judge Curiel are not only racist, but they provide an ominous portent of how Trump may use the power of the presidency to intimidate federal judges. Such abuse of executive power poses a threat to all Americans. It is an independent judiciary and a respect of the separation of powers mandated by the Constitution that secures the civil liberties and freedom of the American people. Moreover, Trump’s comments only serve to foment the public’s distrust in our nation’s judicial system, thereby undermining one of the three pillars of our democracy.

For the foregoing reasons, we call on other bar associations to join us in denouncing Trump’s comments and demand that he retract his remarks.
Sincerely,
Luis O. Osuna, SDLRLA President
Media: To schedule an interview or request more information, please contact Luis Osuna at 619-948-7668 or [email protected].
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby windwalker on Sun Jun 12, 2016 10:37 am

ya I didnt read all that stuff,,,,why would anyone when you dont even take the time to listen or view any thing counter.


as far as the

"The lawyers association “was formed with a desire to effect change in San Diego by representing the interests of the Latino community, identifying issues which involved the Latino community, and advocating for those issues,” according to its website. It was incorporated as a 501(c)(6) organization in 1979, and in 2005, it formed the San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association Scholarship Fund for Latino students."

"Osuna, the SDLRLA president, said the two groups are separate.
“The only connection we have is that we provide services to the Latino community,” he said. “We are not affiliated in any other way.”

Ok, its just another Hispanic group that they provide services to that happens to be involved with issues regarding immigration which
they advocate for.

got it ;)


had you watched the clip,,,all this is brought out and detailed....but why bother...

reading the interview is not much better they keep trying to fit it to their narrative.

Dickerson: Let me ask you about, what does the Mexican heritage of the judge in the Trump University case have to do with anything?

Trump: I think it has a lot to do with it. First of all, I've had terrible rulings forever. I had a judge previous to him and it would have been a very quick case. This is a case I should've won on summary judgment. This is a case -- and nobody writes this, and they all know it, but they don't like to write it -- the plaintiff in the case was a woman.

She was so bad that under deposition it was over. I mean, she couldn't have been the -- it was a disaster. They went before the judge, they said, "We don't want her to be the plaintiff. We want to put somebody else in." So we said, "Well, that's fine. Dismiss the case.

You have to dismiss the case." Wait a minute -- she gave letters, the most incredible reviews of the college you've ever seen, of the university. She gave the most incredible -- then on top of it, we have a tape where she's talking about it in the most glowing terms. You wouldn't speak about your college --

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/art ... -trump-un/
Last edited by windwalker on Sun Jun 12, 2016 10:48 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby windwalker on Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:00 am

"POR LA RAZA TODO; FUERA DE LA RAZA NADA"

yep seems ok ;)
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:05 am

Well, so, you believe that an American with Mexican parents will rule against Trump because he wants to build a wall. Think about it, though, does the Trump "university" case have anything to do with immigration? Is this judge in favor of illegal immigration or drug trafficking? Hmm, in both cases NO. The judge actually had to receive police protection because of his stand on immigration. Afa the charges against Trump U, there's also a case in NY. Eric Schneiderman, the NYS Attorney General calls it a fraud http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/e ... aud-223812. But, he's Jewish, so maybe he should recuse himself because he's either for or against a wall.

Anyway, here's another reason Trump's argument is stupid. Does he (or you) really think that "ONLY" Americans of Mexican descent disagree with Trump on many issues? And, for gosh sake, "Mexican" is not a race, religion, or creed. In this case, it's the place where someone's parents were born. There are probably more judges with parents or grandparents born in Mexico. They probably wouldn't be acceptable either. They're good enough to go to war though. It seems like Trump's whole shtick depends on people being bullied into self-rejection. I mean, being of Mexican heritage isn't a "bad" thing, no matter what one's political beliefs are. Accusing someone of being "Mexican" is the same as accusing Trump of being "White." Like it or not, they're both supposed to be "American."
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby windwalker on Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:20 am


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_jq5iUqtBo

Like it or not, they're both supposed to be "American."


sure they are ;) ,,someone might want to let them know....
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:35 am

Not just Mexican-Americans have been violent at political rallies. It has nothing at all to do with their heritage. Do you watch soccer?

Trump's not right because others do wrong. Are you really trying to make a statement about Mexicans or Mexican-Americans?

sure they are ;) ,,someone might want to let them know....


Yeah, that's the thing with Trump. Just like Palin, thinks there are "us and them" Americans. And ultimately anyone who disagrees their comments are un-American. It's funny. Jeffery Lord, Trump's spokesman on CNN, called those who criticized Trump's judge comments Racists.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby windwalker on Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:02 pm

It has nothing at all to do with their heritage. Do you watch soccer?


no i dont watch soccer,,,but I think I can see a lot of people with flags that are not the US.
the same people burning the US flag,,,your ok with that?

your saying it has nothing to do with their heritage mmmm... ok if you say so ::)

Trump's not right because others do wrong. Are you really trying to make a statement about Mexicans or Mexican-Americans?


no you are,,,you have yet to address any legal issues regarding why the judge did not make a new case....
nor have you shown any similar cases with the same rulings

in the clip which you didnt watch it mentioned other cases are shown in which the judges recuse themselves
to avoid the issue that the Trump has with this case.


Yeah, that's the thing with Trump. Just like Palin, thinks there are "us and them" Americans. And ultimately anyone who disagrees their comments are un-American. It's funny. Jeffery Lord, Trump's spokesman on CNN, called those who criticized Trump's judge comments Racists.


What would be the basis of the comments against the Trump.
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:42 pm

your saying it has nothing to do with their heritage mmmm... ok if you say so ::)


QED
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby grzegorz on Fri Jul 22, 2016 1:06 am

It seems that John Kasich was offered the president's while Trump would be busy making America great again.

https://www.yahoo.com/celebrity/john-ka ... 29631.html
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby Steve James on Fri Jul 22, 2016 11:36 am

Memories, memories ... never forget.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNiqpBNE9ik
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Re: Trump makes the cut

Postby KEND on Sat Jul 23, 2016 3:18 pm

About 83 years a populist demagogue made a speech in a place that has once more appeared on our screens [munich], a lot of smart people thought they could control him, a lot of otherwise sensible people saw him as a savior, all of them were proved wrong.The 2015 census showed 33% of the adults had attended college, by the look of it emotion trumps education
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