Milo Out!

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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Ian C. Kuzushi on Wed Feb 22, 2017 4:05 pm


So there is, after all, a line that you cannot cross and still be hailed by conservatives as a champion of free speech. That line isn’t Islamophobia, misogyny, transphobia or harassment. Milo Yiannopoulos, the journalist that Out magazine dubbed an “internet supervillain”, built his brand on those activities. Until Monday, he was flying high: a hefty book deal with Simon & Schuster, an invitation to speak at the American Conservative Union’s CPac conference and a recent appearance on Real Time with Bill Maher. But then a recording emerged of Yiannopoulos cheerfully defending relationships between older men and younger boys, and finally it turned out that free speech had limits. The book deal and CPac offer swiftly evaporated. The next day, he resigned his post as an editor at Breitbart, the far-right website where he was recruited by Donald Trump’s consigliere Steve Bannon, and where several staffers reportedly threatened to quit unless he was fired.

In the incriminating clip, Yiannopoulos prefaces his remarks with a coy, “This is a controversial point of view, I accept”, this being his default shtick. Maher absurdly described him as “a young, gay, alive Christopher Hitchens” – a contrarian fly in the ointment, rattling smug liberal certainties – but Hitchens had wit, intellect and principle, while Yiannopoulos has only chutzpah and ruthless opportunism. Understanding Yiannopoulos requires a version of Occam’s Razor: the most obvious answer is the correct one. What does he actually believe in? Nothing except his own brand and the monetisable notoriety that fuels it. That’s Milo’s Razor. Understanding how he got this far is more unnerving.
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Yiannopoulos was born Milo Hanrahan in Kent in 1984 and grew up in a financially comfortable but emotionally fraught family. He later adopted his beloved Greek grandmother’s surname, but prefers the pop-starry mononym Milo. On Twitter, before he was permanently banned last July, he operated as @nero. After dropping out of two universities – Manchester and Cambridge – he wrote for the Catholic Herald and covered technology for the Daily Telegraph. On the Telegraph’s blog pages, under editor Damian Thompson, he became a professional troll; a clickbait provocateur who hated the left more than he loved anything.

In 2011, having left the Telegraph, Yiannopoulos co-founded the tech journalism website the Kernel. “Tech’s gadfly continues to provoke and irritate, often for its own sake” was Wired’s judgment, but that only helped Yiannopoulos paint himself as a thorn in the side of a complacent tech establishment. The more people he insulted, the more attention he got. But his vindictiveness wasn’t just an act. In 2013, the Kernel was successfully sued by former editor Jason Hesse for non-payment of wages and one female staffer publicly complained about similar treatment. In a vicious email, Yiannopoulos threatened to ruin her career and called her “a common prostitute”. Many profile-writers have noted that his critics won’t speak on the record for fear of vendettas. Iain Martin, the Telegraph’s former comment editor, remembered “talk of him being someone who should not be crossed” and was shocked by the cruelty of his mob-like followers, which included rape threats and doxing.
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Yiannopoulos found his stepping stone to America in Gamergate, an online movement that claimed to campaign for ethics in videogame journalism while subjecting women in the industry to brutal harassment. Unlike older conservatives, Yiannopoulos understood what was bubbling up on platforms such as Reddit and 4chan: a new gamified form of hard-right discourse based not on ideas but on memes, harassment and “saying the unsayable”, driven by white male resentment toward minorities and so-called “social justice warriors”, the au courant name for political correctness. It didn’t matter that he had recently mocked gamers as “unemployed saddos living in their parents’ basements”. For Milo, Gamergate was an exciting new front in the culture wars and the career boost he craved.

As an informal movement, Gamergate didn’t have a figurehead so Yiannopoulos gave himself the job and turned into an outlaw antihero. Gamergate’s activists and opponents both agreed that without his advocacy the movement would have fizzled out. Profile-writers and shows such as Newsnight expanded his celebrity beyond the internet. Young, handsome, charismatic and eloquent – the writer Laurie Penny called him “a charming devil and one of the worst people I know” – he was far more alluring to the media than, say, James Delingpole.
Milo Yiannopoulos speaking on campus
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Milo Yiannopoulos speaking on campus at the University of Colorado in Boulder, Colorado in January 2017. Photograph: Jeremy Papasso/AP

Yiannopoulos preached the topsy-turvy gospel of the “alt-right”: liberals, feminists and people of colour were the oppressors and bigotry was a rebel yell. “I always thought journalism was about sticking up for the many against the powerful few,” he told Fusion in 2015. Yet in the same interview he implied it was all a show: “I didn’t like me very much and so I created this comedy character. And now they’ve converged.” Whenever he gets into trouble, he blames the character. On Monday, he attributed his justification of child abuse to his “usual blend of British sarcasm, provocation and gallows humour”. Last year, he flippantly told Bloomberg Business Week: “I’m totally autistic or sociopathic. I guess I’m both.”
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In 2015 Yiannopoulos spotted his next opportunity, and perhaps a kindred spirit, in Donald Trump, a man he calls “Daddy”. (He rarely speaks to his own parents.) With Trump, the backlash against political correctness went nuclear and via Bannon’s Breitbart, Yiannopoulos became a far-right hero and gleeful scourge of liberal “snowflakes”. The Southern Poverty Law Center calls him “the person who propelled the alt-right movement into the mainstream”.

Most people who are no-platformed or shamed on Twitter didn’t set out to inspire outrage, but outrage is Yiannopoulos’s lifeblood; without it, he is nothing. He boasted that being banned from Twitter made him more famous than ever, and endeared himself to mainstream conservatives when protesters shut down his appearance at UC Berkeley on 1 February. (At previous campus events, he had targeted individual students for harassment.) Even Trump, the US’s first troll-in-chief, tweeted his support. CPac billed him as a “brave conservative standard-bearer” and an “important perspective”, not because he said anything valuable but because protesters hated him. That’s the level to which the debate over free speech has sunk.

So what is his “important perspective”? What does he stand for? It’s telling that he was banned from Twitter (no easy feat) for ringleading a campaign of harassment against actor Leslie Jones for the crime of daring to appear in the female-led reboot of Ghostbusters – hardly a vital cause. He is a gay man who hates the gay rights movement. A libertarian who calls an authoritarian president “Daddy”. A vigorous opponent of Black Lives Matter who says he can’t be racist because “I just like fucking blacks”. A self-styled second-wave feminist who sells hoodies reading “Feminism is cancer”. A conservative pin-up who claims: “I don’t care about politics.” A writer and speaker who claims his provocative statements are just “facts” while celebrating the “post-fact era”. Penny wrote that she wouldn’t debate him in public, “because I know I’ll lose, because I care and he doesn’t – and that means he has already won”. If he is indeed a supervillain, then he’s Ben Kingsley’s character in Iron Man 3: a shallow, amoral actor who plays the bad guy for money.
Milo Yiannopoulos’s enablers deserve contempt – and must be confronted
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How was this smirking void ever taken seriously? He had enablers. Not just CPac, Breitbart and Simon & Schuster, but his editors at the Telegraph, magazines who cooed over him, and every TV producer who booked him to say something outrageous while batting his eyelashes like Princess Diana. Like Trump, he is the logical outcome of a grotesque convergence of politics, entertainment and the internet in which an empty vessel can thrive unchecked by turning hate speech into showbusiness. Well, until now. Until the clown prince of outrage finally outraged the wrong people.

“Everyone who knows Milo has been absolutely shocked by his rise,” his friend James Cook told Fusion in 2015. “I think we’re all scared that one day he’s going to go a bit too far.” Milo’s true nature has been obvious for years. The vanity, the cynicism, the bullying, the financial skulduggery, the hate speech, the harassment – they’re all public knowledge. Even the incriminating podcast interview came out a year ago. It’s too late to act shocked. Doubtless his fans will stand by him in the mistaken belief that he actually cares about them, but his high-profile enablers should be asking themselves why they have only now decided that Milo Yiannopoulos has gone too far. It takes a village to raise a monster.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... are_btn_fb
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby klonk on Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:37 pm

Quick poll of the room: How many here, honestly, had heard of this Milo person before the Berkeley brouhaha? I had not. Odd the trajectories to national fame, sometimes.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby grzegorz on Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:55 pm

Perhaps Milo's is part of a vast conspiracy to get conservatives to realize that homosexuals are just like them.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Ian C. Kuzushi on Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:58 pm

klonk wrote:Quick poll of the room: How many here, honestly, had heard of this Milo person before the Berkeley brouhaha? I had not. Odd the trajectories to national fame, sometimes.


I certainly had. I got in a big fight with my sister and brother-in-law partly over their affinity with him a while back. I also argued quite a bit with Mix about him and the Alt-Right in general--also quite a while back. I don't think I had heard of him when gamergate first happened, but I was aware of him before he got booted off Twitter. That is when most people I know came to know him.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Steve James on Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:14 pm

klonk wrote:Here we see an instructive example supporting the maxim that says there is no such thing as bad publicity. Many more people have heard of this Milo character than ever did before. He is shopping his book to new publishers, and may even get them to bidding against each other. He does a good job at his chosen specialty of being outrageous--when it comes to annoying people, he has something for everyone.


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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Steve James on Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:15 pm

I first heard about him when he was booted off Twitter.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby windwalker on Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:16 pm


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP7vi9oLk54

In answer to the question no, he's not someone I had heard of or knew about.
My only interest was in the way he's been brought down, and tactics used.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby leifeng on Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:17 pm

Milo is a troll but he isn't that bad. He isn't racist and sometimes he has some good points(which he would often express in an offensive way). I'm sure the alt-right racists liked having him around for a while to recruit more people but ultimately they want him gone. What I'm wondering is whether the whole Bill Maher thing was a bait to lure him to the surface so that they could attack him from all sides by some old interviews after that. Maybe that's why Bill Maher was nice to him ::) Anyway I don't understand why leftists demonize him so much. There are far more dangerous people on the far-right they should focus their attacks on.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Steve James on Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:38 pm

Anyway I don't understand why leftists demonize him so much. There are far more dangerous people on the far-right they should focus their attacks on.


Well, one could ask why the rightists idolize him. But, if people don't know about Milo (unless they read Breitbart), then they don't know about anyone more dangerous. Milo has a platform, but doesn't actually do anything. Otoh, the dangerous people who do things end up in jail, with only small articles to recount their actions, and only on local news stations.

Besides, when one paints feminists or lgbt/q people as leftist, one has to explain the "women for" and "lgbt/q for" signs that all politicians want to have behind them at rallies. Milos, for ex., is openly "gay." Well, it's funny, actually. There is no real "left" in the U.S.. Shucks, people called Obama a leftist. Now, of course, there is a growing number of anarchists.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby leifeng on Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:57 pm

Right and left is something like yin and yang. People need to simplify everything into two extremes to understand them. However there is yin within the yang and yang within the yin. I would say Milo is a yin within the yang. You should be worried about the Yang within the Yang.
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Michael on Wed Feb 22, 2017 8:40 pm

grzegorz wrote:Perhaps Milo's is part of a vast conspiracy to get conservatives to realize that homosexuals are just like them.

LOL!
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Michael on Wed Feb 22, 2017 8:42 pm

gzregorz wrote:I don't know how well you know Berkeley but there are tons of people there on and around the campus who are not students.

I was on campus briefly just once in 2005 and also driving around the neighborhood nearby, went into the REI and a couple of other outdoor equipment stores. I did notice how the Berkeley campus just seems to flow into the adjoining 'hood, thought it was great. Also know the overhead view from The Graduate. ;)

Michael wrote: Some of those students protesting Milo's talk at UC Berkeley are just as nutty because they've learned from these profs.


gzregorz wrote:That is Blac Block that shut down Berkeley not the students. Although you did say some I haven't seen any proof of that.

I was referring to the students who were legitimately protesting and speaking with megaphones before sundown, before the riots. Here is a 10 minute video with some examples, I tried to find a shorter clip to support my calling them nutty, but it's tough searching as all you get is riot footage.

grzegorz wrote:It is clear and simple censorship as much as Black Bloc shutting him down in B-town was a form of censorship, in that case shutting down hate speech.

Can anyone give me some examples of what you think is hate speech from Milo? I've seen 10-20 short videos of him on stage and I didn't notice it.

That could be a good discussion: hate speech from the far right and my claim of nutty speech from the far left. I'll parse some of these videos of what the students and profs are saying and link some examples.

Compilation video of protesters at Berkeley before the riots, 10 minutes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJIq9W_QVsM
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Michael on Wed Feb 22, 2017 8:47 pm

windwalker wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP7vi9oLk54

In answer to the question no, he's not someone I had heard of or knew about.
My only interest was in the way he's been brought down, and tactics used.


TL;DR: Sargon says Milo did nothing wrong in his actions, did nothing and said nothing criminal, although one can disagree with his comments, and that the more important point is that this is a smear campaign that follows the same patterns as the smear campaign last week against Pewdiepie.

Here's an analysis from Sargon on the motivations behind a smear campaign against Milo and Pewdiepie that have dominated online news cycles for the past two weeks. Regarding Milo, the commentator takes the position of disagreeing with Milo's comments on pederasty, considers Milo was a victim of statuatory rape, which Milo stated in the middle of the commentary with Rogan that has caused the outrage, and the commentator says Milo did nothing illegal (16:40 in the video), highlighting that Milo calls himself a free speech warrior and that his comments are protected under free speech.

Sargon wrote:People should be free to say and think exactly as they choose. The crime, the wrongdoing, enters in with action, and Milo has done nothing illegal, and, at least in this case, has done nothing that is immoral. [17:00 in the video]


Sargon goes on to say that Milo could not have named the people at the Hollywood party from 2008 that he saw with "very young boys" unless he had evidence, otherwise he would be sued for defamation.

The remaining questions not explored are: how old were the boys exactly, did Milo see or suspect crimes, and why didn't Milo do something at that time? Milo mentioned drugs, I assume there were lots of illegal drugs and he would likely be implicating himself to report what he saw. From the comments with Joe Rogan, he was describing multiple parties and a culture of this kind of activity, and what he said sounded like a composite of multiple experiences.

Sargon spends some time recounting stories of the past two years about the culture of pedophilia in Hollywood, specifically about Elijah Wood's, Corey Feldman's and Corey Haim's warnings about rampant sexual abuse of child actors, especially boys. Sargon notes that proof of this being a smear campaign is that the people writing articles and who are outraged now at Milo's comments did not take any action even recently in regards to criminal allegations of conduct regarding recent scandals with the boys mentioned, as well as the apparent allegations against film maker Bryan Singer discussed with Joe Rogan.

One of the points Sargon makes about the hypocrisy of current outrage is regarding George Takei making similar comments to one part what Milo said. I don't think this is equivocation or defense, but another claim by Sargon that moral outrage here is entirely motivated by a goal to damage Milo and not to deal with the crime of pedophilia.

First 17.5 minutes on Milo and the remaining 9 minutes on Gamergate and Pewdiepie.

The Weapons of Culture Warriors


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP7vi9oLk54[/youtube
Smear campaigns are designed to delegitimise, not refute. This character assassination is a weapon of the culture wars.

Sources:
https://therationalists.org/2017/02/22/the-weapons-of-culture-warriors/

4CHAN board Pol (politically incorrect) had a warning about an upcoming smear piece on Milo, which occurred several hours later in the day.

https://archive.is/briVl

4CHAN board Pol wrote:FYI the MSM has a huge fucking media onslaught that is set to go live Monday to scorch earth Milo and destroy him via the pedophile label.

I'm part of a mailing list (not giving my real name or the name of the list for the sake of protecting my ass from retaliation) but they have been sitting on the story for a while, because they thought Milo was small fries and wanted to wait until he got big enough a thread to go nuclear on.

The journalists are pissed the fuck off Maher put him on the air and more so, pissed off his book deal had not been revoked (and some are pissed that Milo got a book deal from the same publisher who dropped Zoe Quinn's book, along with a larger signing bonus than most of the publisher's social justice authors).
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Re: Milo Out!

Postby Michael on Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:26 pm

Here's an example of nutty speech coming from a teacher, who was protesting at Berkeley before the riots started.

Compilation video of protesters at Berkeley before the riots 10 minutes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJIq9W_QVsM

0:30 - 1:16
Speaker says that Breitbart will announce partnership with Holocaust denier David Horowitz to make attacks in sanctuary cities against undocumented workers, students and families, then makes jump that they [Breitbart] are trying to force us [students] to shut up, put them in their places "women, or muslims, or minority, or oppressed groups, but what they'r really trying to do is trying to assert their power, threaten us, intimidate us, rape us, kill us. This is real, this is life and death. This is not an abstract theory are you interested in researching. This is about our lives, right now....When the Nazis tried to kill some of us, some of us recovered, some of them threatened me, students at my school tried to get me fired, but they didn't succeed. And the students and the parents...rallied together and not only got me my job back, but we're stronger now.

If Milo comes here [she then gives a physical description], we will shut him down by any means necessary." [Teacher finishes at 2:45 in the video]


Her speech is nutty because she literally equates what she considers Milo's hate speech, which I have never noticed, to being intimidated, threatened, raped and killed. She is making a crazy jump from point A to point ZZZZ.

I transcribed the rest of the video and did not find more nutty speech, but there were a couple of more statements that they would stop MIlo from speaking by any means necessary. Considering there was a violent riot soon afterwards, I think saying that was morally irresponsible, but protected under the First Amendment.

2:47 in the video
Young man who says he drove all day to shut down Milo, "a real fascist who has been involved in by Donald Trump's racist election." He says the students got UCLA to cancel Milo. "We think it's embarrassing that the chancellor of Berkeley is allowing a fascist, that promotes violence against women, against gay and trans people, against minorities, and against immigrants, especially right now, under Donald Trump. The Chancellor of Berkeley should resign right now."

4:00 [same student continues]
"Hate speech is not free speech. We're coming here also out of a weekend of what has been some of the most amazing days of my life, being part of a new civil rights movement, where we shut down, in downtown L.A., one million people. We shut down LAX with more than 10,000 people. Defending refugees and immigrant rights. Today, there is no way we can allow this racists, neofascist to speak here in our school today. Especially, you know, it's been over 50 years of the anniversary of the free speech movement.

4:54 [same student continues]
"But hate speech is not free speech. And Milo should be shut down. Our friends at Berkeley, UC Davis also shut him down. They surrounded the building, they know he comes out to the crowds. If he comes here, we gotta make sure we can give him a Bay Area welcome, that racists, fascists are not welcome on our campus. And that our movement that has started is fighting by any means necessary to get rid of Donald Trump, and anybody who supports his racist program of scapegoating of immigrants, of women, of gay people in America.

We can depend on Berkeley, UC Berkeley, the city of Berkeley, San Francisco, Oakland, the entire state of California, as a sanctuary state for immigrants. And make it clear tonight in action and work collectively to make sure that Milo Yiannopoulis feels unwelcome and never wants to come back again to our campus or to the state of California." (6:20 in video)

Next student (6:25 in video)
Back and forth chant:
"When Muslims are under attack, what do we do? Stand up, fight back.
When immigrants are under attack, what do we do? Stand up, fight back.
When refugees are under attack, what do we do? Stand up, fight back.
When workers are under attack, what do we do? Stand up, fight back.

Racist, sexist, anti-gay. Right-wing bigots go away."

9:50 in the video, they discuss where to move so their group can block people who want to get into the building where Milo will speak.
Michael

 

Re: Milo Out!

Postby klonk on Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:15 am

Calumny is the new politics. Tonight on the politics channel there was a debate about the future leader of the democrat committee. It was all about who could say worse things about Trump. CSpan, DNC, look it up.

I do not actually see how a self-identifying fword can make you look bad.
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