How to help people who say they want to lose weight

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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby everything on Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:44 am

Lots of good advice, thanks.

I suppose I'd want to find two programs:
1. "program" for disciplined people such as RSF people. counting calories, adding specific exercises, nutrient timing, logging, etc., is all fine because this group can do that. last 5-10 lbs to lose. not sure of kg.
2. "program" for normal, lazy people who can't be bothered and need the "easiest" path. need to lose 20-30+ lbs. not sure of kg.

The "easy" path may work for either group. Last night I decided to not eat after 8:30 p.m. and went to bed about 4 hours later. Instant, easy weight loss, but let's see if that can be sustained for some "real" weight loss over, say, a month, and then forever.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby DiaitaDoc on Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:24 am

- avoid takeout.

- eat real food. Avoid the central aisles and frozen food sections in the grocery store.

- get rid of your big dinner plates and replace them with smaller plates.
- always eat veggies with every meal
- always add veggies to the plate first.

- micro-fast after exercise : refrain from any caloric intake for up to three hours after exercise. The longer the better.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Bao on Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:40 am

marvin8 wrote:You make a good point that some people don't like to count and are lazy. The easier you make things for them, the better.

What is your opinion, if there was a program (maybe app) where you input your weight, how much you want to lose, and within how many months. The program (app) will then calculate your calorie deficit needs and provide loads of meal plans, meals, recipes, videos, etc. Doing most of the work for you. Do you think people would be interested?


If it was made super simple, it's bound to be a success. But I think it would need to show how to eat less and how much to move more, not only keeping track on calories, that's too abstract.

Honestly, I believe that Yoga and Tai Chi are the best weight loss exercises - just learn to understand what the body wants and what it needs to feel good and healthy. Self-awareness and body awareness. I sincerely believe that this is what people need most of all.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby everything on Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:17 am

DiaitaDoc wrote:- avoid takeout.

- eat real food. Avoid the central aisles and frozen food sections in the grocery store.

- get rid of your big dinner plates and replace them with smaller plates.
- always eat veggies with every meal
- always add veggies to the plate first.

- micro-fast after exercise : refrain from any caloric intake for up to three hours after exercise. The longer the better.


these are really good "easy" tips!
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby marvin8 on Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:43 am

Bao wrote:
marvin8 wrote:You make a good point that some people don't like to count and are lazy. The easier you make things for them, the better.

What is your opinion, if there was a program (maybe app) where you input your weight, how much you want to lose, and within how many months. The program (app) will then calculate your calorie deficit needs and provide loads of meal plans, meals, recipes, videos, etc. Doing most of the work for you. Do you think people would be interested?


If it was made super simple, it's bound to be a success. But I think it would need to show how to eat less and how much to move more, not only keeping track on calories, that's too abstract.

Honestly, I believe that Yoga and Tai Chi are the best weight loss exercises - just learn to understand what the body wants and what it needs to feel good and healthy. Self-awareness and body awareness. I sincerely believe that this is what people need most of all.

Yes, there are current programs that estimate how many calories various exercises burn. A program should be flexible in that you can vary the amount of exercise and diet calories. I believe products like Fitbit can be synchronized with various programs. So, you would not have to enter your exercise in manually. Then, the calorie deficit should be automatically adjusted, depending on your amount of exercise.

Another feature should allow the input of your own recipes along with nutrition info. Then, the program should calculate how many servings, oz, portions, etc. should be eaten.

A successful program has to have enough features that address a wide target audience, ease of use, and save the time of busy, lazy people. :)

Edit: All the mentioned tips in this thread are helpful to make it easier and simple. This info can be given out to capture emails (landing page) or given out as a newsletter, forum, blog, etc.
Last edited by marvin8 on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Bhassler on Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:44 pm

[quote="marvin8"]
1. Start a food journal. Input your daily food journal in a calorie tracking journal (e.g., myfitnesspal, fitday).[/quote]

This. More and more, I think a food journal may be the most important weight loss tool there is. It doesn't have to be about measuring calories per se, but you need to have real visibility and accountability into what you're eating.

As to the original question, someone needs to tell your hypothetical friend to HTFU.
Them: "I want to have a different outcome, but I don't want to change any of my behaviors."
You: "Too bad, fatso. How about you grow up and come back when you can responsibility for you life like an adult?"

Granted, that's way over the top, but a change in body comp is a reflection of a change in lifestyle. It doesn't have to be extreme, but if someone wants a change in any area of their life, they have to commit to doing the right things. There's a lot of middle ground between being a doughy, sweating pile of cellulose and a meat-eating, fire-breathing, kettlebell-swinging maniac. A great resource, by the way, is the book Fat Loss Happens on Monday. It's a very sensible and actionable book by a guy who's been consistently successful with many, many clients.

I also like this youtube channel (it's a different guy). He's got a lot of interesting thoughts and viewpoints on diet, muscle building, calisthenics, etc.
[url]https://www.youtube.com/user/RedDeltaproject/videos[/url]
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby everything on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:06 pm

I think that's all very true, but RSF is presumably full of relatively disciplined people who can actually put in whatever work.

What if this person is your wife/girlfriend/s.o./teenage child/mother/mother-in-law and is a more "normal" person with respect to body/fitness activities? You may or may not say HTFU etc etc. Just depends on the relationship I guess. Probably you will only give one "easy" tip in some nice way, or just provide positive reinforcement.

It also doesn't work for countless Americans. The "weight loss industry" kind of thrives on the fact that all these people don't really change their behavior. Which does seem ridiculous to a bunch of us here, but it's just an observable phenomenon. We know what they should all do, theoretically, but we can't make them do it or help all of them to do it. Unless you want to turn into Richard Simmons or something.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Bhassler on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:31 pm

everything wrote:I think that's all very true, but RSF is presumably full of relatively disciplined people who can actually put in whatever work.

What if this person is your wife/girlfriend/s.o./teenage child/mother/mother-in-law and is a more "normal" person with respect to body/fitness activities? You may or may not say HTFU etc etc. Just depends on the relationship I guess. Probably you will only give one "easy" tip in some nice way, or just provide positive reinforcement.

It also doesn't work for countless Americans. The "weight loss industry" kind of thrives on the fact that all these people don't really change their behavior. Which does seem ridiculous to a bunch of us here, but it's just an observable phenomenon. We know what they should all do, theoretically, but we can't make them do it or help all of them to do it. Unless you want to turn into Richard Simmons or something.


Most people are disciplined in some areas of life, and not so much as others. It's common for people who think someone has skill in an area-- martial arts, fitness, or whatever-- to say "I want to do this, just 'give me a trick', okay?" But we all know it doesn't work that way. So why waste their time or allow them to continue to waste yours? It's a dis-service to both of you. The answer is ultimately the same as it is for most worthwhile things in life: "How do you get it? You earn it."
Last edited by Bhassler on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Peacedog on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:39 pm

+1 on the food journal. Also, some people recommend taking a picture using their cell phones before eating anything as it is a good way to break the momentum of reflex eating.

But honestly, the first and most important thing for the person trying to lose weight to understand is: 100% of weight loss is about diet. You cannot exercise your way out of being fat.

Lots of good reasons exist for exercising. Weight loss is not one of them.

Exercise to a degree can prevent someone from becoming fat.

Once you are fat, changing your diet is the only real solution. Especially for long term body composition maintenance.

Secondary facts to understand is that fat loss is almost entirely about carbohydrate metabolism. And the sad fact is that this is all about your genetics. Some people need to cut a little to lose weight and others as Charles Poloquin so elegantly put it, "get one lick of a dusty prune every two weeks."

One friend lost, a confirmed, 30 pounds in a month just by no longer drinking soda. For real.

Others have to keep it under 100 grams of carbohydrates per day of any source to lose weight. It sucks, but it happens.

Most people fall somewhere in between.

The only exception to this are people that have serious endocrine system problems, like hypothyroidism or very low testosterone levels in men, and that is why labs up front are important. But again these are relatively uncommon exceptions.
Last edited by Peacedog on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby everything on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:58 pm

Usually I explain that it's all about refined carbs and sugars. A lot of people can just cut out alcohol, sugary foods, junk carbs, sugar coffee drinks, soda, wheat, etc., and get a fairly fast improvement as well as an overall health boost. I'm definitely a fan of adding omega-3 and lots of vegetables. These are all easy "hacks" for the most part. After that it gets a little more difficult, probably because the body is so good at trying to keep an equilibrium.

Ok, tougher love seems to be the RSF consensus, though.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Bao on Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:28 am

Peacedog wrote:One friend lost, a confirmed, 30 pounds in a month just by no longer drinking soda. For real.


I perfectly believe this. People don't understand how great an impact soft drinks have. :(

There are many reasons to keep of soft drinks. There are quite a few hormone disturbing stuff in coloring and flavor. These can also affect weight. They can also affect the devemopment of kids in a negative manner. Not good.

And who wants to drink something that can be used to clean toilets and engines with? :-\

Last edited by Bao on Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Peacedog on Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:01 am

Yeah, that was interesting to watch happen.

A couple of factors were at play.

1. He was drinking one large fountain drink after another while working at a gas station. So basically he was insulin dominant all day long. His body never got a chance to go into fat burning mode.

2. He was relatively young at 29 years of age.

3. No one on either side of his family was overweight. So he had a decent genetic tolerance for carbohydrates.He was just overloading his system.

4. He always ate three fairly complete meals a day and never really snacked.

5. He was on his feet all day at the gas station, but performed no actual exercise.

The difference was remarkable. His doctor accused him of being on drugs when he went in for a followup.

While I had heard stories of this kind before, I had never actually seen it happen. And this represents what is ultimately possible if someone has the right genetics, etc. As such it was an anomaly.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Steve James on Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:12 pm

Imo, people who "say" they want to lose weight are no different from those who say they want to stop doing drugs. The answer is the same. They have to do more than "say." All the answers given in this thread will work for someone. But, helping people who want to lose weight usually involves working on the person.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Peacedog on Sat Jul 29, 2017 6:48 pm

Steve,

Very true.

I would make one caveat though: some people don't know how to lose weight.

One friend was about 50lbs over-weight and decided to do something about it. He was doing a couple of hours of cardio a day getting no where when he came to talk to me and was very frustrated.

I explained carbohydrate restriction, ketogenic dieting and intermittent fasting as techniques. After trying all three he eventually settled on intermittent fasting. He eventually lost a good 35lbs and has kept it off for the last year.

His main issue is that he had the will, but he didn't know how to do it.

Sometimes knowledge is a problem, but I agree will is usually the bigger issue.
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Re: How to help people who say they want to lose weight

Postby Bao on Sun Jul 30, 2017 3:48 pm

Peacedog wrote:Sometimes knowledge is a problem, but I agree will is usually the bigger issue.


The same with alcohol, though I know it's controversial. But at least to a certain point, the beginning stages or before it get serious, there's sometimes a decision that a person makes, that being drunk is better than staying sober. If someone believe that life is funnier and more rewarding by going around drunk, then drinking easily becomes a habit. It's sometimes a similar thing with eating, people feels that eating until they feel perfectly full gives a rewarding feeling or they regard it as a comfort zone. If people just used their brains, were smart and try to feel what's good for their bodies, many would act differently. But again, I guess it can be very hard if you were raised a certain way or if you live in certain areas where everyone act or behave in a way that is not good for them. :P But it's so easy. Oh, now I am starting to gain a bit of weight. How come? Bad sleep and anxiety? Too much good food lately? Stressed and eating junk food? Nah, that's too complicated, and what can I do about it? If God wants to make me thin again or having me stay fat, what can I do about it? :-X



...But I guess... sometimes life can be very tough...
Last edited by Bao on Sun Jul 30, 2017 3:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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