Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Steve James on Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:25 pm

Can you give me an example?


The op "the rush to distance themselves from him on the part of stars and politicians is amusing."

I'd also distance myself from a friend or supporter who was shown to be a sleazeball. So, I didn't think that it was unusual to see stars distancing themselves.

Then you referred to "His lefty liberal Hollyweird friends." Maybe we can assume that those are the stars that Ken implied. But, what exactly is the view of those leftist liberals in Hollywood about sexual harassment? How are they weird? or even different when it comes to the issue?

Your argument does nothing but refocus the moral outrage on the "left," but never addresses a problem that is not confined to Hollywood or the left. In fact, people are labelled "liberal leftists" precisely because of their position on sexual harassment.

I just noted the hypocrisy of the outrage because there are plenty of examples on "the right" of sexual harassment. They're just excused. However, my point was that they proved nothing politically, and that making it into a contest was just a distraction to avoid arguing for or against sexual harassment --and laws that attempt to address it.

That's why to me it's more amusing that people on the right (specifically those who claim to be pious and devoted to "family values") readily condemn "liberals" who condemn Weinstein because they were his friends. What's the point of that? Guilt by association? Why not just join them in condemning Weinstein and sexual harassment?

Of course, it's political capital. "The left is sleazy" and unpatriotic, violent, amoral, etc. Yet, entertainers on FOX tv have been fired or retired because of sexual harassment charges? Bill O'Reilly is one; Roger Ailes, another. Last week a "pro-life" Republican governor was found to have asked his mistress to have an abortion. He resigned. But, meh, it still has nothing to do with politics. There are an equal if not greater number of pastors and priests who have been removed from office for sexual offenses.

Hey, this all makes psychological sense. If DT can be saved and get into heaven, the rest of us have a good shot. Shucks, I won't be surprised if someone eventually nominates him for beatification. Like I said, it's psychological.

Afa the original post, I agree it's hypocritical for the stars and politicians (i.e. Weinstein's hang out buddies) who knew of his alleged crimes that did not say anything to criticize him now. Otoh, I understand that the women who were affected might have been reluctant to report. And, having a secret life isn't that difficult. Keeping it secret forever is another thing.
Last edited by Steve James on Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Trick on Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:32 pm

Steve James wrote:Afa Hollywood having more sexual predators, I think anyone who believes that hasn't been around much. I guess they have never asked models, secretaries, students, nurses, or interns. Wherever there are women, there are men who harass them or worse. And many women won't say anything because they won't be believed. In fact, their attacker can go on to become president.
.

Sure everyone on this forum understand that sexual predators lurk in every corner on this planet, many have been around to know that much I guess. This tread is about Harvey and his hollywood/wired? That place probably have its share of working class such as secretaries, students, nurses, or interns, and most probably a huge amount of models too. Would not be surprised if workers within these groups are way more vulnerable working in Hollywood/entertainment business than in any other 'legal' enterprise.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Michael on Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:32 am

Okay Steve, I get what you're saying. I'm just not focused on the same things.

I assume some or all of the following apply to Trump's sleazyness: the people who voted for Trump did not take his hot-mic tape seriously, thought it was just locker room talk, didn't believe the accusations, believed some of these things were bad, but thought Trump was still the best candidate.

The thing about the Weinstein case that sticks out for me is the memory hole, which is an observation more than an argument at this point. I'm not sure what to make of it yet. The rest is just same old, same old.

Last year, after one of the allegations against Trump seemed really fishy how some random dude on an airplane wanted to be a witness to a woman's accusation Trump put his hand up her skirt sitting next to her, I just decided to wait until after he lost the election and see if anything came of it. He won and I never followed up, didn't hear about anything.

The news cycle moves on and the left's reaction to Trump's win overshadows any unsubstantiated allegations against him. They seemed to have moved on to Russia and Hillary's book tour.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Steve James on Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:03 am

Well, Trick, have fun pointing out how corrupt it is in Hollywood. The casting couch is old news, from the time Hollywood was Reaganland. It was the lefty liberal women who brought up the issue of sexual harassment. So, I find it amusing that they're being dismissed, ridiculed, and often pointed to as the problem.

Like I said, if you agree that Harvey was a scumbag, you're agreeing with a lefty liberal point of view. It doesn't make them worse. Yeah, even Harvey's wife is divorcing him. Wow, no loyalty. Unlike Hillary and Melanie who stand by their men. I feel sorry for them.

Afa the memory hole, it's just not interesting to me because it's not a problem, even if accurate. The problem is the selective condemnation of sexual harassment.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Michael on Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:23 am

It's the lefties who are doing everything right in regards to Weinstein, with perhaps the exception of the memory hole stuff. New York Times released the story, New Yorker published the audio, Dems are returning the money Weinstein donated, etc. I heard NY Gov. Cuomo refuses to return or donate the Weinstein money.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Trick on Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:29 am

Steve James wrote:Well, Trick, have fun pointing out how corrupt it is in Hollywood. The casting couch is old news, from the time Hollywood was Reaganland. It was the lefty liberal women who brought up the issue of sexual harassment. So, I find it amusing that they're being dismissed, ridiculed, and often pointed to as the problem.

Like I said, if you agree that Harvey was a scumbag, you're agreeing with a lefty liberal point of view. It doesn't make them worse. Yeah, even Harvey's wife is divorcing him. Wow, no loyalty. Unlike Hillary and Melanie who stand by their men. I feel sorry for them.

Afa the memory hole, it's just not interesting to me because it's not a problem, even if accurate. The problem is the selective condemnation of sexual harassment.

Lefty, Hillary, Melaine ???. What do they got to do with Harvey and Hollywood, are they connected ? I have no idea' I mean I really have no idea. "Hollywood was Reaganland" was this when Ronald was president or was it when he was a Hollywood actor? Anyway, let's see if this Harvey thing leads to more disclosures of Hollyweirdos
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby KEND on Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:07 am

Firstly harassment, sexual and otherwise is in every industry, it is in 'glamor' industries; movies, theater, music, advertising, modelling, which the 'beautiful people' are attracted to which seems to get more attention, their lives are larger than life so the media latches on to them. Not too many people are interested in a McDonalds employee or meter maid. Anyone who has read Hollywood Babylon should know this goes back decades so people know what they are getting into. Even Silicon valley has its sexist geeks. The main point I was making is that the stars in general [not everyone]allowed a predator in their midst and didnt out him, I see emma thompson is the latest one on the wagon, a critic of antisocial behavior but NIMBY. I recall the McCarthy days when people were blacklisted as 'commies' even if they were mildly liberal, were hounded from their jobs but stuck to their principles.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Steve James on Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:07 pm

The main point I was making is that the stars in general [not everyone]allowed a predator in their midst and didnt out him


This is what I agree with 100%. Yeah, Weinstein's actions weren't as bad as wolf-whistling or expecting the secretary to make coffee, etc.. But, sexual predators need enablers, and they can be explicitly condoning his acts or turning a blind eye. ALL of them should be condemned by those around them, not excused, no matter how minor it seems to them.

And, I totally agree that there's plenty of hypocrisy among so-called liberals.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby KEND on Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:40 pm

Latest Woody Allen defending harvie, like using gasoline to put out a fire
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Michael on Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:40 pm

Documentary about pedophiles and child sexual abuse in Hollywood, "An Open Secret" (2015), available for a few more days to watch free on vimeo. The film maker wants to make it available because of the current scandal.

An Open Secret (2015)
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Michael on Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:02 am

Here's an interview from today with Gabe Hoffman, the producer of An Open Secret.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSirxzq3Jl4
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Steve James on Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:59 am

Hmm, pedophilia in Hollywood. Who knew. Homosexuality too. Sounds like Milo would love it there.

But I think that they're found everywhere. The same "open secret" idea can be applied to the Catholic Church or any church. Someone almost always knows but doesn't say or do anything.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby yeniseri on Wed Oct 18, 2017 6:40 am

If you can bring da money in to the fix, then all is good. Power, prestige and the flowering of revenue does wonders for those making out like bandits. It has never failed.
Donald Trump, despite his talking about grabbing da p*s^y is still the darling of many people, well at least until the golden promises slips away.
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Re: Harvey where are your friends now that you need them

Postby Steve James on Wed Oct 18, 2017 7:57 am

That's the thing. His conduct is forgivable because it's just guy talk, and doesn't reflect how people act. So, women are reluctant to speak out if the act happened in private. Harvey is claiming that everything done was consensual. Cosby says the same thing, even though he drugged the women. Anybody remember Bill Clinton and Bill O'Reilly? They all deny, deny, pay off, and deny. Trump is different. He bragged about how he sexually assaulted women, and even named the woman. Okay, it's not that being a playboy isn't a wet dream for most men, myself included. I wouldn't mind running a modeling agency or beauty pageant. But, abuse is abuse, and people with power often abuse it.
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