underwater "windmill" power better than on land

[everything]

https://sustainablebrands.com/read/clea ... -the-water

Brazilian startup TidalWatt has rethought underwater turbines — theirs are 60x smaller and produce 3x as much energy as wind turbines, are harmless to marine life, and promote the formation of artificial reefs.

80 percent of the world's energy is still sourced from burning fossil fuels, accounting for more than 65 percent of global greenhouse gas emissions. Global energy consumption has increased every year for more than 50 years, as has a corresponding urgency to shift to sustainable solutions that can keep up with demand — innovation continues in renewable energy sources such as solar and wind, but they’re not yet reliable or consistent enough to keep up with rising demand.

Another drawback is the damage that current renewable energy infrastructures causes the surrounding ecosystems; wind turbines and solar panels kill thousands of birds each year and hydroelectric dams change the ecology and landscape of rivers, threatening fish populations. Therefore, finding consistent and unobtrusive ways to source renewable energy that can keep up with increasing demand remains a critical task for innovators globally.

Enter Brazilian startup TidalWatt, which just might have unlocked the secret to capturing unlimited renewable power with no environmental risks. It has developed a new generation of underwater turbines designed specifically to capture energy in the ocean.

“When the energy source is predictable and constant, as is exclusively the case with the ocean, we say that this source offers energy security. So, in this way, the ocean is the only safe renewable energy source,” TidalWatt founder and CEO Mauricio Queiroz told Sustainable Brands®. “The ocean currents are already extensively mapped around the world; so we already know numerous positions that are ideal for the installation of our underwater plants.”

TidalWatt’s turbines are uniquely designed to capture the hydrokinetic energy associated with underwater currents. Unlike wind turbines, this technology is not based on wind/aeronautical mechanisms — which lose energy between the propellers (the venturi effect) — but continuously capture the energy generated by upstream currents.

tidalwatt.com

[vadaga]

That's cool. I also saw today a wave-top energy producer which uses a long strip of pontoons with magnets inside of them. Fancy concept CGI but no working prototype for that one yet.

[yeniseri]

There is a weather pattern where certain rivers in Brazil reverse current and creates a tidal basin that allows a
normal river to create "energy waves" (potential to be 'manipulated for humane purposes other than surfing on
the waters of a river ) and somehow this intent has allowed conceptual processees on how to increase that 'benefit' for humanity's use

[Quigga]

It might be a stupid fear of mine, but is it possible that we eventually tap into such a huge amount of movement energy from nature (waves, wind, heat, current, ...) that we disable nature's self regulation dynamic? Like neutralizing all it's momentum.

I.e. maybe some amount of waves etc are necessary to shift things around?

I doubt we are close to that point, maybe if ever. Just a thought.

[everything]

I thought the waves were due to gravity effects from the moon. A "windmill" would be insignificant compared to the moon's gravity. But theoretically could you make enough turbines that the waves are disrupted? It seems like you'd consume more energy than you get if you're trying to make something as large as the moon's gravity? Presumably you don't really need such large turbines if you figured that much out? Idk, interesting question.

[Steve James]

It seems like a legit question. Yet, the argument could be made that hydroelectric dams affect the flow of water, which has to affect the balance of nature. It's also true of windfarms. Everything we do will have some effect. Humans are the only animals that are not part of a natural balance. That started with manufacturing fire (i.e., burning stuff).

All we can do is to minimize our effect.

[everything]

we dammed the Colorado River which certainly had pros/cons. Same with the windfarms.

I think they are arguing the turbines don't have those negative effects as much ... but maybe that's not really true or humans can't quite assess fully.

I suppose if their argument is "this is better than what we did before", that's what we have to go on.

[Steve James]

Hey, energy has to come from somewhere. We've done it by burning things to release their energy. Anything that doesn't involve burning in order to extract energy is better (imo). Using ocean currents and sea-mills (?) falls into that category. The only problem is that we don't know the effects. As Quigga pointed out, harvesting the current involves slowing it down. Then there's the issue of the effect on things that live in the sea. Some people are complaining that windfarms kill birds. Would a sea mill kill fish or affect their movement patterns?

Yeah, the moon's gravitation pulls the water on the earth and causes tides. The only free energy we get is from the sun. Our problem (unlike plants) is how to convert that energy efficiently into another form of electromagnetic radiation. Btw, I think an "advanced civilization" would have learned how to do that. Having such an energy source would allow the leisure to invest in space travel. If we could do it here, we could do it anywhere.

[everything]

They claim they won't hurt fish or coral reefs, but it seems like that claim needs a lot of proof....

“A 3m diameter TidalWatt turbine is capable of producing 5 MW of power at a current of 1.87 knots — practically the same power as a 180m diameter wind turbine,” Queiroz explains. “So, the TidalWatt turbine, with a diameter 60 times smaller, produces the same power. In addition, due to the availability of the source, a wind turbine on average produces energy 30 percent of the time; our technology can produce energy 90 percent of the time. This means that being 3,600 times smaller, in coverage area, our turbines can produce three times more energy.”

“We are not just going to build power plants — we are going to build marine ecological sanctuaries,” Queiroz says. “We know that marine animals avoid moving objects; but if by chance one feels attracted to the adventure through a silent turbine that turns at 12 rpm (rotations per minute), it will, at worst, slide along with the water, much like we slide down a water slide. The probability of hitting one of the blades is practically zero, and it is impossible for the turbine to hurt or disturb any fish.”

That sounds very efficient compared to wind. No idea about solar, except that it seems to depend on how much sunshine your area gets.

[everything]

There was also the teen who won the Westinghouse Siemens Competition back on 2005 by putting a gyroscope in a buoy to convert the wave energy to electricity. Not sure what happened since.

https://spectrum.ieee.org/wringing-watts-from-waves

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm ... story.html

ENCINITAS, Calif. — Growing up minutes from the waves in San Diego County, Aaron Goldin has long been familiar with the ocean’s power and abundance. Now, the wiry 17-year-old with a passion for sailing and physics has found a way to turn the force of the ocean’s waves into electricity.
Aaron’s invention, fashioned in his garage from castoff pieces, could lead to a huge benefit for mankind: practically limitless pollution-free power. It has already paid off in a big way for him. The San Dieguito High School senior won $100,000 in the national Siemens-Westinghouse Competition in Math, Science and Technology for his invention, which he calls the Gyro-Gen.

Finding clean ways to generate electricity is a challenge that vexes the best minds in science. Aaron’s idea came to him one day when he was playing with gyroscopes in his garage.

Despite its humble origins, Aaron was immediately aware of the potential for his discovery. “It’s the closest I’ve seen to [a power source] being environmentally benign,” he said.

[wayne hansen]

You guys should check out the Pellman wheel
It can produce enough energy from a slow moving stream to power a whole house
The Rainbow Power company from Australias Hippy capital Nimbin has been selling them world wide for over 30 years

[wayne hansen]

PS it is no bigger than a shoe box

[Steve James]

Do you use one Wayne? I live in an apartment building.

[everything]

couldn't find it on the rainbow site (but might not know the terms well enough).

[Steve James]

fwiw, I have solar panels to charge-recharge an acid cell power supply. It'd run my laptop, charge my phone, run a fan, and light some lights. I have water filters, too. But, I don't pretend to be off the grid. In cities, the main problem is keeping the refrigerators in the food stores working.