what happened to Zheng Manqing ?

[origami_itto]

Yes it was the same guy that death touched Bruce Lee

This is what I'm talking about specifically, from Ray Hayward's book "Lessons with master Liang"


i don't know what's wrong with the image host

could you make a small summary of the text ? would be interesting.

One time Professor Cheng was in trouble in the mainland. He defeated some foreign soldiers in a public match. As he was leaving, one master patted him on the back to congratulate him. The next day, Professor Cheng was sick, could not get out of bed. Cheng's friend knew his master and asked him to come and cure him. The master cured him and told him that now that Professor Cheng was famous he shouldn't be proud.

I don't recall if Stewart mentioned the story in his book or not, but I seem to remember there being a little bit more context around it, perhaps that the unknown master mentioned some affiliation with the Yang lineage through a different branch of transmission.

[wayne hansen]

First we must be able to différenciâte the substantial from the insubstantial
Many stories are told

[Trick]

One time Professor Cheng was in trouble in the mainland. He defeated some foreign soldiers in a public match. As he was leaving, one master patted him on the back to congratulate him. The next day, Professor Cheng was sick, could not get out of bed. Cheng's friend knew his master and asked him to come and cure him. The master cured him and told him that now that Professor Cheng was famous he shouldn't be proud.

I don't recall if Stewart mentioned the story in his book or not, but I seem to remember there being a little bit more context around it, perhaps that the unknown master mentioned some affiliation with the Yang lineage through a different branch of transmission.

interesting story.
come to think of the story where Wan Laisheng sneaked up behind YCF who was washing his face at a public bathroom and pushed him so he slipped and fell to the floor......
Wude been fair to push face to face.....But as Wayne wrote, lots of stories are told.
And ZMQ was said to have been up for a lei-tai against WLS in Nanjing（a grudge?） but the Japanese invasion halted that showdown.

[wayne hansen]

I am disappointed with YCF
That was the favorite game when I first started drinking
Most time we survived without a trip to the urinal

[Shinobi]

The incident is written about in Stuart's book but in this version it occurs in Taipei, not on the mainland, and the one responsible for it is named - Zhang Qingling. Apparently Cheng went over the top during a demonstration, saying he was the number one student of the Yang family. Zhang congratulates Cheng after his performance and gives him a pat on the shoulder, congratulating Liang on having such a skilled teacher. The next morning Cheng is in terrible pain, with the shoulder swollen to twice its normal size and black and blue. Liang mentions the shoulder pat from Zhang and sends a message to him about the state Cheng is in and he tells them to come immediately. After leaving them waiting an hour and a half, he sorts the shoulder out and tells him: ''You will live, don't worry. If you had not come here you would have died this evening. But the medicine you really need I don't have, so the best I could do is give you this warning and hopefully you will change. Your Tai Chi is quite good, but not as high as mine or others. You should not brag that you are number one. You're not even number one hundred.''

I remember reading some people doubt this story due to not believing that Zhang Qingling was ever in Taiwan.

[wayne hansen]

I’m no doctor but yet to see a shoulder swollen to twice it’s size
Sounds like fiction

[Trick]

and wasn't ZMQ a doctor of Chinese medicine ? and wasn't it mentioned in one of Robert Smith's books that ZMQ himself was knowlegeble about this kind of ”black hand”touch methods ? If that was so.he should have known immediately what had happened to him ?
Anyway all that happened before he came to the US where he lived for about 10 years. Returned to Taiwan and in a short time passed away......Someone patted him welcome back ?
How was his last years in the USA did he show of illhealth ?

[nicklinjm]

I doubt the person / teacher in the story is Zhang Qinglin - either that or it did not happen in Taiwan. Zhang Qinglin certainly never moved to Taiwan post-Liberation as AFAIK spent the remainder of his life in Shanxi province, where he also taught several students.

[Shinobi]

Cheng's death is also mentioned in Stuart's book:

''The one thing that really upset Liang, however, was Cheng's drinking. Too many of the new, younger, Western students knew that if they took Cheng out for wine they could get him to talk about Tai Chi. In 1975 after an evening of drinking with students in Taipei, Cheng died from imbibing poisoned wine. Many times Liang commented to me how mad he was when he heard the particulars of Cheng's death, because it did not have to happen. When Liang was with Cheng there was an unwritten, but very strict, rule about keeping him away from alcohol. The newer students, especially the American ones, really had no idea the damage they were doing when they invited Cheng drinking.''

Some of what Liang wrote about it:

''Upon learning of the death of Prof. Cheng from the local newspaper, I phoned Taiwan immediately to get the full particulars. As soon as I received those particulars, I immediately reduced my teaching load of twenty-eight private lessons per week to just a few. My reasoning was that I do not want to follow in his footsteps. In other words, I want to live longer.
Prof. Cheng died of intoxication which led to apoplexy. The next day his student found him lying on the floor, dead. It is a pathetic and untimely death. A lot of tension, furies, and disappointments were concealed deeply in his breast and he was unable and reluctant to express them outward. He could not borrow enough liquor to dispel all the real sorrows. All of these things were contained within and brought together into a heap, which in the end suddenly burst like a bomb.''

[Trick]

so very tragic indeed.
i had speculated that he（ZMQ）maybe had picked up bad habits during his time in the US, and partly it seem like so.
however in china alcohol is flowing too and quite freely.
i my self on one hand feel drained and low efter a ”dinner party” meeting with the local wushu association and all the ”ganbei”, on the other hand, the up part, one get to know and even informally touch hands with most of the top-dogs of the province..all friendly, and ”spirited”

[origami_itto]

Liang raised a lot of hell and drank before he started learning from ZMQ and had to deal with the ill effects himself, so it makes sense that he would be vigilant about keeping him away from booze when they were together.

[wayne hansen]

TT had lots of teachers so I don’t know how much influence he had over CMC
They didn’t spend much time together after the Ron le at the UN

[Trick]

Ron le at the UN

? sounds interesting, what does it mean

[wayne hansen]

I don’t know what words I used but spell checker changed it
CMC took over his class and kept the cash
TT wasn’t happy

[origami_itto]

Yeah that was the break as far as I understand it, they were pretty tight up till then.

As I understand it, T.T. had been a high ranking customs official back home with money and influence and now he was living like a pauper off the grace of ZMQ as his interpreter. ZMQ had taken over the class and payments, but there was a check that had no name on it and T.T. took it and put his name on it.

I can't remember if this was in Stuart's book or just something somebody who trained with some of the new york crew had passed along in idle chit chat so take it for the absolute nothing that it is