Is Obama a 'natural born' US citizen ?

[Steve James]

I am not trying to insinuate that Obama is like Hitler, merely that Hitler proved the danger a good speaker poses to a nation

So did Ronald Reagan, not to insinuate that he was like Hitler.

There are six official presidential candidates in this race, but nobody gives a shit 'cause the media told them not to. And yet when I call them "mob", Steve J. gets upset.

Shite, you give a shit. And, I don't object to calling "them" the mob. We just might disagree on who "they" are

[Steve James]

Obama is also in favor of a federal ban on all .223 and .308 rifle ammo, and those sizes are some of the most popular, so it's almost a ban on rifles, contrary to the 2nd amendment.

NRA Targets Obama http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008 ... obama.html
September 22, 2008
Updated: September 29, 2008

It falsely claims in mailers and TV ads that Obama plans to ban handguns, hunting ammo and use of a gun for home defense.

Summary
A National Rifle Association advertising campaign distorts Obama's position on gun control beyond recognition.

The NRA is circulating printed material and running TV ads making unsubstantiated claims that Obama plans to ban use of firearms for home defense, ban possession and manufacture of handguns, close 90 percent of gun shops and ban hunting ammunition.

Much of what the NRA passes off as Obama's "10 Point Plan to 'Change' the Second Amendment" is actually contrary to what he has said throughout his campaign: that he "respects the constitutional rights of Americans to bear arms" and "will protect the rights of hunters and other law-abiding Americans to purchase, own, transport, and use guns."

The NRA, however, simply dismisses Obama's stated position as "rhetoric" and substitutes its own interpretation of his record as a secret "plan." Said an NRA spokesman: "We believe our facts."

Perhaps so, but believing something doesn't make it so. And we find the NRA has cherry-picked, twisted and misrepresented Obama's record to come up with a bogus "plan."

Update, Sept. 29: The Obama campaign asked broadcasters to take down ads from the NRA, citing this article and a separate Washington Post article that called the ads misleading. The NRA attacked us on its Web site, claiming that we are neither impartial nor independent. We respond in the Analysis section.

[DeusTrismegistus]

Obama is also in favor of a federal ban on all .223 and .308 rifle ammo, and those sizes are some of the most popular, so it's almost a ban on rifles, contrary to the 2nd amendment.

NRA Targets Obama http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008 ... obama.html
September 22, 2008
Updated: September 29, 2008

It falsely claims in mailers and TV ads that Obama plans to ban handguns, hunting ammo and use of a gun for home defense.

Summary
A National Rifle Association advertising campaign distorts Obama's position on gun control beyond recognition.

The NRA is circulating printed material and running TV ads making unsubstantiated claims that Obama plans to ban use of firearms for home defense, ban possession and manufacture of handguns, close 90 percent of gun shops and ban hunting ammunition.

Much of what the NRA passes off as Obama's "10 Point Plan to 'Change' the Second Amendment" is actually contrary to what he has said throughout his campaign: that he "respects the constitutional rights of Americans to bear arms" and "will protect the rights of hunters and other law-abiding Americans to purchase, own, transport, and use guns."

The NRA, however, simply dismisses Obama's stated position as "rhetoric" and substitutes its own interpretation of his record as a secret "plan." Said an NRA spokesman: "We believe our facts."

Perhaps so, but believing something doesn't make it so. And we find the NRA has cherry-picked, twisted and misrepresented Obama's record to come up with a bogus "plan."

Update, Sept. 29: The Obama campaign asked broadcasters to take down ads from the NRA, citing this article and a separate Washington Post article that called the ads misleading. The NRA attacked us on its Web site, claiming that we are neither impartial nor independent. We respond in the Analysis section.

Really??

FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban
Obama was being misleading when he denied that his handwriting had been on a document endorsing a state ban on the sale and possession of handguns in Illinois. Obama responded, "No, my writing wasn't on that particular questionnaire. As I said, I have never favored an all-out ban on handguns."
Actually, Obama's writing was on the 1996 document, which was filed when Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate. A Chicago nonprofit, Independent Voters of Illinois, had this question, and Obama took hard line:

35. Do you support state legislation to:
a. ban the manufacture, sale and possession of handguns? Yes.
b. ban assault weapons? Yes.
c. mandatory waiting periods and background checks? Yes.

Obama's campaign said, "Sen. Obama didn't fill out these state Senate questionnaires--a staffer did--and there are several answers that didn't reflect his views then or now. He may have jotted some notes on the front page of the questionnaire, but some answers didn't reflect his views."

Source: FactCheck.org analysis of 2008 Philadelphia primary debate Apr 16, 2008

Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok
Q: You said recently, "I have no intention of taking away folks' guns." But you support the D.C. handgun ban, and you've said that it's constitutional. How do you reconcile those two positions?
A: Because I think we have two conflicting traditions in this country. I think it's important for us to recognize that we've got a tradition of handgun ownership and gun ownership generally. And a lot of law-abiding citizens use it for hunting, for sportsmanship, and for protecting their families. We also have a violence on the streets that is the result of illegal handgun usage. And so I think there is nothing wrong with a community saying we are going to take those illegal handguns off the streets. And cracking down on the various loopholes that exist in terms of background checks for children, the mentally ill. We can have reasonable, thoughtful gun control measure that I think respect the Second Amendment and people's traditions.

Source: 2008 Politico pre-Potomac Primary interview Feb 11, 2008

2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month
Obama sought moderate gun control measures, such as a 2000 bill he cosponsored to limit handgun purchases to one per month (it did not pass). He voted against letting people violate local weapons bans in cases of self-defense, but also voted in2004 to let retired police officers carry concealed handguns.
Source: The Improbable Quest, by John K. Wilson, p.148 Oct 30, 2007

Concealed carry OK for retired police officers
Obama voted for a bill in the Illinois senate that allowed retired law enforcement officers to carry concealed weapons. If there was any issue on which Obama rarely deviated, it was gun control. He was the most strident candidate when it came to enforcin and expanding gun control laws. So this vote jumped out as inconsistent.
When I queried him about the vote, he said, "I didn't find that [vote] surprising. I am consistently on record and will continue to be on record as opposing concealed carry. This was a narrow exception in an exceptional circumstance where a retired police officer might find himself vulnerable as a consequence of the work he has previously done--and had been trained extensively in the proper use of firearms."

It wasn't until a few weeks later that another theory came forward about the uncharacteristic vote. Obama was battling with his GOP opponent to win the endorsement of the Fraternal Order of Police.

Source: From Promise to Power, by David Mendell, p.250-251 Aug 14, 2007

Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions
Principles that Obama supports on gun issues:
Ban the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic weapons.
Increase state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms.
Require manufacturers to provide child-safety locks with firearms.
Source: 1998 IL State Legislative National Political Awareness Test Jul 2, 1998


So are you going to believe what he has said throughout his campaign or look at his history? Which supports several of the claims the NRA made, which I am sure still have a fair amount of exaggeration just like every other political ad.

[DeusTrismegistus]

I am not trying to insinuate that Obama is like Hitler, merely that Hitler proved the danger a good speaker poses to a nation

So did Ronald Reagan, not to insinuate that he was like Hitler.

There are six official presidential candidates in this race, but nobody gives a shit 'cause the media told them not to. And yet when I call them "mob", Steve J. gets upset.

Shite, you give a shit. And, I don't object to calling "them" the mob. We just might disagree on who "they" are

I am not sure what you mean by " So did Ronald Reagan" but my point is that we have to look past what political candidates say and look at what they have done.

[Steve James]

So are you going to believe what he has said throughout his campaign or look at his history? Which supports several of the claims the NRA made, which I am sure still have a fair amount of exaggeration just like every other political ad.

I am going to "believe" factcheck.org, obviously.

[DeusTrismegistus]

FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban
Obama was being misleading when he denied that his handwriting had been on a document endorsing a state ban on the sale and possession of handguns in Illinois. Obama responded, "No, my writing wasn't on that particular questionnaire. As I said, I have never favored an all-out ban on handguns."
Actually, Obama's writing was on the 1996 document, which was filed when Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate. A Chicago nonprofit, Independent Voters of Illinois, had this question, and Obama took hard line:

35. Do you support state legislation to:
a. ban the manufacture, sale and possession of handguns? Yes.
b. ban assault weapons? Yes.
c. mandatory waiting periods and background checks? Yes.

Obama's campaign said, "Sen. Obama didn't fill out these state Senate questionnaires--a staffer did--and there are several answers that didn't reflect his views then or now. He may have jotted some notes on the front page of the questionnaire, but some answers didn't reflect his views."

Source: FactCheck.org analysis of 2008 Philadelphia primary debate Apr 16, 2008

[Steve James]

Much of what the NRA passes off as Obama's "10 Point Plan to 'Change' the Second Amendment" is actually contrary to what he has said throughout his campaign: that he "respects the constitutional rights of Americans to bear arms" and "will protect the rights of hunters and other law-abiding Americans to purchase, own, transport, and use guns."

That's what was written in 9/2008.

[C-Hopkins]

The assumption is that Obama will not make a good leader because of the points stated above-

I submit that no one can say that because we've not experienced what the country as a whole would be like under those policies.

Those policies are NOT in effect for the most part (LARGE SCALE), and the country is fucked up NOW.

Is the assumption that if Obama gets in office that he'll implement these rules, and thusly will make the country not so good?

We're allready fucked BECAUSE of the policies of REPUBLICAN RULE.

We don't know what an Obama administration will be like, hence we can't say whether or not his POTENTIAL (not certain) policies would impact positively or negatively.

We CAN however see clearly that McCain/Bush policies have FUCKED the country through simple observation of facts, and can thusly draw an educated premise that McCain will continue to forward the same policies.

Those that have FUCKED the country.

The idea that Obama's policies will negatively impact the country is therefore baseless in the extreme, because it presupposes that we know what the outcome of an Obama administration will be in the FUTURE.

Again, and I've said this before, you guys should start a Psychic hotline.

[C-Hopkins]

The ATF has just disrupted a Skinhead plot to ASSASINATE BARACK OBAMA, and then GO ON to kill 100 other African Americans.

[qiphlow]

obama will most likely continue the same economic policies as we have now, simply because the same corporations that fund the rnc fund the dnc as well (and those fuckers will expect some favors for their donations).