Why do we hate Iran

[Sprint]

http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/mi ... index.html This link provides a historical perspective on what's happening now. I'm pretty much getting to the conclusion that we don't live in a democracy and have n't done for a long time.

[yusuf]

google Mossadeq to see why they hate the US

[Walter Joyce]

I hate to be Clintonesque, but exactly how do you defne democracy?

Because the fact is, we have never lived in a simple democracy, we live under a repesenatative democracy, there is a difference.

I checked out your link, and I don't see the link between being a democracy, of whatever stripe, and interference with foreign governments.

In ancient Greece, where many of our ideas about politics have come from, Athens, one of the first democracies, was seen as a democracy from the inside and a tyranny from the outside.

I have always taken that to mean that for the citizens of Athens, the rule of the demos, the ordinary people, was sacred, but the way treated other countries was ti impose its will through force.

You seem to be making the argument of the outsiders, as an insider. You are in effect putting your position as a citizen of the world ahead of your status as a US citizen.

If you had linked to an op-ed piece about the political buying power of corporations and special interest groups and its corrupting effect on our representative democracy. Then I could have understood your point a bit better.

[Chris Fleming]

Why do we hate Iran? We don't. We are told how to think by the media puppets on TV and the political puppets in office. From this comes "public opinion".

[Sprint]

I suppose I was thinking that in a democracy all the rights and privileges that come with liberty ought to be guiding principles in dealing with other countries. I hear what you are saying about the origins in Greece. Maybe we should also consider that the Senate and President is an idea lifted from the Roman Empire, where they had an Emperor, just like we do today. What happened in Iran before and is happening now is that we are waging war on a country whose only "crime" seems to be disagreeing with what either the UK or the US wants. Where is the equality in that?

Maybe "public opinion" has been privatized.

[Darth Rock&Roll]

There is a lot of propaganda being put out against Iran because Iran simply refuses to have anything to do with the USA.
Frankly, I believe Iran is tired of being ass fucked by US policy and manipulation as are a few others.

They probably also believe, and rightly so, that the US will not attack a Nuclear power and therefore, they have more or less sealed their plans to go ahead with it.

This will effectively break the American/Israeli power structure in the middle east.
This in turn forces America to spend more money on oil imports or on recreating it's own infrastructure to shift away from oil dependency.
There is a lot of resistance to this because oil money is america is tightly controlled and you know what? Those companies are NOT regulated!
Can you believe it? America does not regulate it's energy companies.

you know why? Because your congress and senate are a bunch of corrupt assholes and the president can't do shit about it or won't do shit about it.

if you don't regulate your energy industry and your military industrial complex, then America will be sucked up by the debt they create.

[Doc Stier]

Sadly, in any event, whatever last great act of political defiance or outright warfare which is eventually initiated by the idiot leadership in Tehran will not produce a happy outcome for themselves or for the powerless people of Iran, IMO.

[affa]

why? because their abrahamic roots aren't showing and they've dyed their indo-european drapes to match.

[Doc Stier]

why? because their abrahamic roots aren't showing and they've dyed their indo-european drapes to match.

No. It's really quite simple. Pissing into the wind always results in essentially pissing on yourself.

[yeniseri]

Iran is not following the script but they have many reasons NOT to!
1. They dare to develop their own energy policy
2. They say things about Israel that many believe but many are fraid to acknoweldge.
3. They threaten to attack a country when said country has not provoked conflict.
4. The corrupt mullocracy wants to keep its power so they throw out the "paper tiger syndrome" to see who will bite or not.

[zenshiite]

^I'm pretty sure Iran isn't actively threatening anyone. Near as I can tell they've only said they will retaliate against any military actions taken against them by either the US or Israel.

[Darth Rock&Roll]

Yes well, when you tell the US that you will take action if they decide to rape you, that gets interpreted as a threat to the US somehow.

It's called the pretzel logic of US foreign policy. Also known as pissing on your head and then telling you it is raining and then threatening you to not look up and see for yourself.

[zenshiite]

True enough. We are talking about a country who experienced one US orchestrated coup and it's led to paranoia on the parts of Iranians ever since. Not unwarranted paranoia either. It's the overthrow of Mossadeq that led directly to the Embassy hostage crisis in '79. You spend 30 years talking about how you're plotting "regime change" in Tehran and then you expect the powers that be to NOT squash any and all opposition? Makes no sense. Fact is, the United States government doesn't give a shit about what's best for the Iranian people or the opposition parties. If Iran were towing the party line you'd hear nothing about non-proliferation and suspected nuclear weapons programs, because they'd have the US's okay just like the Shah had in the 70's before the Iranian people got sick of him and threw his ass out. Had Khomeini played ball it'd be much the same, no doubt.

[Bär]

I love Iranians. Iranians gave me my first beer all to myself when I was 7.

[Steve James]

Imo, both sides use the politics of fear and ignorance to maintain power and influence public opinion. It's true that the state of Israel is at the center of the struggle for power. The issue of Palestinian rights, or even the existence of Palestinians, is combined with the demonization of Jews. Israel becomes the tangible proof of the West's attempt to control the region, and the Holocaust was --to them-- just a trumped-up excuse for that attempt (similar to the way 9/11 is seen as a diversion ...).

If Israel didn't exist, however, many Iranians would still feel that they are destined for empire. Iranians are Muslims, yes; but they're also Persians. Having "The" bomb and nuclear capability is a natural extension. They sell much of their oil to Europe and countries East. Those countries can't afford to lose oil resources. They're the ones who'll be most interested in mediating between the US and Iran. Last time, iirc, the French supplied the stuff; the Iranians started to build; and the Israelis blew it up.

On top of that is the seemingly predominant perspective that Arabs or Muslims have no regard for human life. Ok, it's easy to point out that Iranians are not Arabs and that, if all Muslims wanted to commit suicide attacks, there wouldn't be much that could stop them. But, the fear is that the Iranians would give their nuclear tech and material to anyone (else) who'd use it against the US or Israel. Of course, this is a magnified gun-control argument, no? People should have the right to defend themselves, right?

I sorta think that mutually-assured-destruction worked because even the (crazy, red Soviets who threw themselves against tanks) really didn't want to see their society destroyed; nor did the Japanese before them; nor the nutty Nazis; nor anybody, actually.