resting HR?

[everything]

Anyone routinely track your resting heart rate?

I've arbitarily decided this number is a better overall number for me to track (if I had to pick one) than, say, weight, or cholesterol or BMI. It's incredibly easy to do. It should indicate my level of fitness is improving and the overall health of my heart muscle itself, where weight or BMI or cholesterol can't do that, and only weight is easier to measure.

So, being goal oriented, I guess my goal is to get it down to 40 or so (resting HR right after waking up but before moving around). The only problem is I can't ever remember to take the measurement in the morning.

[Alexander]

Well, I would have to say yes and no.

I don't know the science behind what i'm saying, but for example: does high intensity training (10 / 20 minutes or less) affect your circulatory system as well as long-distance training? I highly doubt it. I think it affects your respiratory system and VO2 max more.

If, however, you are in the habit of running 5 miles a day (and have been doing this regularly) you can probably expect a resting HR 20+ below the average male (which is around 70 I think?).

It would be cool to do this in the sake of science, but is it necessary? I 'd say no, because you can physically gauge how well conditioned you are. Are you out of breath when training more than you'd like? Ramp up the workouts...

[Steve James]

Cyclists routinely use heart rate as a monitor of their efficiency. The Olympics does it with every athlete. When I was paying attention, the lowest measured was (iinm) Paavo Nurmi (a runner) with a resting heart rate of 31 or so. I think there are others, though. Low heart rate has to be combined or related to lung capacity. For a slow rate, the O2 intake from each beat must be greater, especially under stress. Anyway, just remember to do it when you wake up. 40bpm would be impressive, but that would be waking heart rate, not resting (as we used to measure it, [Edit] though that what it's called now). For us, Resting was our normal rate [end edit] during the day or, in a cyclist's case, his rate while riding but not really exerting himself. But, what they'd really measure if how high (and how quickly) your rate could go from rest to, say, 95% exertion, for 30 seconds, and then how long it would take for your heart rate to return to "resting." Many Olympic athletes can go from resting 40 to 190 bpm in a minute; then return to 40 a minute or so later. The easiest way you could test that for yourself would be a step test. Measure your heart rate and then run up about 5 flights, measure your rate; then keep measuring at minute intervals until it returns to the first rate. Improvement in that time differential will be directly proportional to improvement in cardio vascular efficiency. WARNING You could have a heart attack, so don't try unless you're in shape already or you've worked your way up. HOW TO TELL? Easy, don't hold your breath. When you run out. STOP. Measure there. You should only get your heart rate up to 180-200 if you're in good condition. For other people, that's close to cardiac arrest. For real.

[everything]

Steve, thanks. I hear you on the heart attack. No way am I going to push it too hard just to try to find out what's what. I am ramping up the intensity very slowly. As an aside, I just read an article in my wife's fitness magazine about healthy women having heart attacks or strokes due to arterial damage that isn't detected (pre-menopausal women have a certain risk I can't remember what's called now) even though they are fit by most measures.

What I've been using is Tabata intervals (intense but can add on in increments, even just adding 30 seconds (20 seconds) at a time if needed, though I go ahead and add the full 4 minutes), then measuring my heart rate a few minutes afterwards. I need to do the every 1 minute measurement to see how long it takes to go back down to my average normal rate (60-70). And I need to measure my waking (resting) rate (50 - 60 last time I checked). If these numbers keep reducing then I'll be happy. I do have a heart rate monitor, so I think I'll start using that for these checks (except the first morning check - still gonna have to remember). Also, do you take your reading at the wrist? On my "some day" list I want to start learning TCMA methods of reading the pulse.

[Steve James]

Well, if it's quiet, you can often feel your waking heart rate. But, I do take mine at the wrist when I'm training. On thing about doing it as soon as you wake up is that you can slow it down (too) easily by managing your breath. If you're like me, your heart rate speeds up on inhale; so, the longer the inhale, the slower the heart rate. (In fact, you "should" also count your breaths per minute). Oh, you should also know that the slower your resting heart rate, the more likely it is that you'll be diagnosed with an "enlarged" heart by your doctor.

Hey, I just went to the wiki. I saw that Miguel Indurain had a resting heart rate of 28 which was still only "one of the lowest ever recorded." Lance Armstrong's is 32. Both are supernormal though. I mean they are genetically better prepared, with bigger lungs and better circulatory systems. You should look it up, if you haven't already. But, I thought this would be interesting:

Recovery heart rate

This is the heart rate measured at a fixed (or reference) period after ceasing activity; typically measured over a 1 minute period.
For death, it has been hypothesized* that a delayed fall in the heart rate after exercise might be an important prognostic marker. Less than 30 bpm reduction at one minute after stopping hard exercise was a predictor of heart attack. More than 50 bpm reduction showed reduced risk of heart attack. [6]
Training regimes sometimes use recovery heart rate as a guide of progress and to spot problems such as overheating or dehydration [7]. After even short periods of hard exercise it can take a long time (about 30 minutes) for the heart rate to drop to rested levels.
Devices with built in accelletry and heart rate sensors can automatically measure heart rate recovery. For instance the BioHarness [8] can be used to measure heart recovery as the device also logs and transmits the vector magnitude units of the person acceleration. The acceleration number is used to determine when the person is moving and at rest and hence detect the start time for the heart rate recovery period.
[edit]Target heart rate

The Target Heart Rate (THR), or Training Heart Rate, is a desired range of heart rate reached during aerobic exercise which enables one's heart and lungs to receive the most benefit from a workout. This theoretical range varies based on one's physical condition, gender, and previous training. Below are two ways to calculate one's Target Heart Rate. In each of these methods, there is an element called "intensity" which is expressed as a percentage. The THR can be calculated as a range of 65%–85% intensity. However, it is crucial to derive an accurate HRmax to ensure these calculations are meaningful (see above).
Example for someone with a HRmax of 180 (age 40, estimating HRmax as 220 − age):
65% intensity: (220 − (age = 40)) * 0.65 → 117 bpm
85% intensity: (220 − (age = 40)) * 0.85 → 153 bpm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_rate

[everything]

Hmm yeah thanks. Good info. I definitely don't expect or need the resting HR of an elite cyclist or any kind of athlete for that matter. Although I do want to get my waking HR to 50 or below, not that HR is the end goal, just as a side indicator.

I'll start tracking better this weekend, I think.

Also, do you measure over a full minute? If so, how do you do the multiple measures by each minute? With a monitor?

I just took a 6 sec measure X 10 and got 60. Not bad considering I'm not particularly in good shape (not exactly bad shape tho).

I'm concerned about the Max HR thing. I mean what does it mean? At 40, I can't go over 180 so at 160 - 170 I need to slow it down immediately???? Is it like a yellow zone?

Also, I can't tell but the beat doesn't seem either 1) super steady rhythm or 2) same strength on every beat. Anyone care to comment in general, especially from a TCMA POV on these two areas?

[Steve James]

Get a digital sports watch with a large dial. There are monitors made for just what you want, or so I've heard --I never owned or used on. By the time these things came along I was no longer competing. I literally would take a piece of paper and a pencil. (If you want to be serious, use graph paper. Make a column for each day. You'll end up with a nice chart. I think there are even wrist monitors that do that and give you a print out ... but the principle is the same.

Your max hr will depend on your age and general condition, especially weight. There is a formula, but I think you'd better look up the current one. In general, the optimal training rate (where you get the most benefit) is around 80% of your max. But, if you do 70%, you're in a safer range and still have good training effect, though not enough compared to an elite athlete's regime. My opinion has always been to "take it easy at first." Your worst enemy is over-training.

Anyway, now I'm going over to amazon to see about the new heart rate monitors. Ok, done: I'm going to order one of these. Timex T5G971 Unisex Sports Personal Heart Rate Monitor Watch http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images ... 400&sr=8-3


Amazon.com Product Description
Combining stylish looks with heart rate monitoring features, this larger Timex Personal Heart Rate Monitor watch (model T5G971) can be worn by both men and women. It features a chest strap heart rate monitor, easily accessible function buttons, durable resin case, and comfortable resin strap with a stylish tapered profile. For integrating heart rate monitoring into your training, this watch enables you to continuously track your heart rate during exercise as well as pre-set target heart rate zones with alarms that notify you when you are out of the zone. It also offers an automatic activity timer and a workout review that recalls activity time and average/peak heart rates. This streamlined watch also has a month/day/date display with 12/24-hour time.
The Indiglo night-light uniformly lights the surface of the watch dial using patented blue electroluminescent lighting technology. It uses less battery power than most other watch illumination systems, enabling your watch battery to last longer. The watch is water resistant to 30 meters (100 feet), which protects it from rain and water splashes. All Timex heart rate monitor sensors have batteries that can be replaced by consumers without requiring them to be returned to the manufacturer.

Product Description
Zone Trainer Digital Heart Rate Monitor with a gray resin strap and digital display with orange accents, INDIGLO night-light, 100-hour chronograph, 27-lap memory, 100-hour countdown timer, Alarm with 5 min back up, Water resistant to 50 meters, Target zones, Zone trainer, Average heart rate, Time in zone, Calories burned, Recovery timer, Max heart rate, Digital transmission, Data Recorder compatible

[bailewen]

Whenever this topic comes up I always freak out and figure I am doomed to die of a heart attack at 45 or so.

My resting pulse has always been scarily high. Right now it's about 85 and all I'm doing is sitting in front of a computer. When I wake up, that's before the first of several cups of coffee I drink through the day, it's still like 75 or so. I train 12-15 hours a week, I run 2k (1.25 miles) about 3 or 4 times a week and I am not overweight and my blood pressure is totally normal.

I'm just speedy I guess.

There was a point in the past where I was running maybe 3 times a week for like half an hour to 40 minutes at a time and my pules only sank to the mid 60's. My wife is completely sedentary and her resting pulse is about 60. I train all the time and it's in the mid 80's? I dunno. I've tried all sorts of stuff to bring it down and my endurance seems fine. It's not great compared to yer average athlete but compared to all the average Joe's around me who are huffing and wheezing when I have not yet broken a sweat it seems ok.

I also have never been able to bring it up above about 140 or so. Lap swimming for an hour....even running 5 miles. I have to be seriously sucking air to get my pulse up above 120 even so none of these figures really make sense to me.

[everything]

hmm boy yeah bailewen 75 - 85 seems a little strangely high for someone who trains a lot. what kind of running do you do? maybe you need to make it more like intervals.

I woke up this morning and tried to remember to take my pulse but first I went to go wake up my kid then remembered. So it was still around 60, not much lower than my normal sitting around rate, which seems to be 60-70. I'll try to remember tomorrow. Also, first thing in the morning, it was kinda hard to find it - the beat didn't seem "strong" like it does after some exercise ---

What do you make of the "strength" of the beat? How do you interpret that aspect? Esp from a TCMA view

[Steve James]

Bailiwen: one size doesn't fit all. Some people just have high rates. Never take internet advice on anything this serious, but I guess you've already talked about it with a regular doctor. I wonder if you've ever measured your breaths per min. It's a cardio-respiratory system and, if you feel fine and can work out, things have to be balancing out. I used to have a saying: "breathe slow: live slow." Hmm, maybe you could get a monitor and see what happens when you do your taiji.

[fuga]

But, what they'd really measure if how high (and how quickly) your rate could go from rest to, say, 95% exertion, for 30 seconds, and then how long it would take for your heart rate to return to "resting." ... Improvement in that time differential will be directly proportional to improvement in cardio vascular efficiency.

This seems like the more important measure: the one focused on recovery. It is more relevant to my training in which, after periods of heavy effort, I need bring the heart rate and breathing back down to prepare for another period of heavy effort.

-pete

[bailewen]

Steve,

That's what I keep telling myself but I still find it kind of disturbing. It's like having a spare tire but invisible. Lacking a six pack really doesn't say much about your fitness other than proving your not an elite athlete and it kind of irrelevant kung fu skill or even fighting ability but it just seems like a serious long term martial artist oughta have one. Likewise with the high pulse. My endurance has never kept me from keeping up in any standup martial arts class I have taken. I did fine even training Muay Thai. (groundwork is another story but that's more about being out of my element than true endurance)

Doctors I have asked have nothing to say about it because a pulse of 80 in the doctors office is not considered unhealthy or dangerously high. It's just high "for someone who works out a lot". Also, since it's couple with a reasonably low blood pressure they always give me a clean bill of health.

...what kind of running do you do? maybe you need to make it more like intervals.

Only started running a few weeks ago. The running I alluded to earlier was over 15 years ago. I hate running. Always have. I just have been convinced that regardless of how irrelevant it may be to my martial arts training (according to recent studies anyways...and Shifu's opinion too) there just doesn't seem to be anything even close to it for burning fat or . . . lowering my pulse. The only time in my life I have ever seen a pulse get down to even the mid 60's, I was running through golden gate park with my girlfriend at the time. A little stop and start but overall we'd run maybe 5 miles or so maybe 2 or 3 times a week. Come to think of it....I did ok with swimming too, which I enjoy much more. Like lap swimming for an hour 3 times a week. Too bad there's no pool access I can afford here in Xi'an during most of the year.

I'm also curious to see what would happen if I managed to kick caffeine for like, a whole week maybe. I'm a pretty heavy coffee drinker. I bet even when I haven't had a cupa yet on any given day, just being constantly buzzed like that sets my BMR on the high side.

[Azer]

Cycling is good for lowering heart rate. I spent about 3 months at one point cycling about 12-15 km a day in one sitting, resting heart rate went down to around 50 bpm.

[DeusTrismegistus]

Well, I would have to say yes and no.

I don't know the science behind what i'm saying, but for example: does high intensity training (10 / 20 minutes or less) affect your circulatory system as well as long-distance training? I highly doubt it. I think it affects your respiratory system and VO2 max more.

If, however, you are in the habit of running 5 miles a day (and have been doing this regularly) you can probably expect a resting HR 20+ below the average male (which is around 70 I think?).

It would be cool to do this in the sake of science, but is it necessary? I 'd say no, because you can physically gauge how well conditioned you are. Are you out of breath when training more than you'd like? Ramp up the workouts...

The heart adapts in multiple ways. The way it adapts to HIIT is different than endurance training but both decrease your resting BPM.

Also the max HR is estimated by 220-age. However it is very inaccurate. The only way to test it is to gradually increase work intensity and see where it plateaus.

[everything]

I'm also curious to see what would happen if I managed to kick caffeine for like, a whole week maybe. I'm a pretty heavy coffee drinker. I bet even when I haven't had a cupa yet on any given day, just being constantly buzzed like that sets my BMR on the high side.

That's gotta be it. Coffee seems to increase my HR when I have it. I don't drink it every day but I love it. Whether that's healthy or not, who knows. Coffee is good for you. Coffee is not good for you. It's all too confusing. Everything in moderation. I'm gonna do an anecdotal test now and take my HR before and after the first cup for today, lol. Will let you know how it goes.