Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

The following typical threads that plague martial arts sites will get moved here if not just deleted: 1 - My style is better than Your style" - 2 - "Internal & External" - 3 - Personal attacks - 4 - Threads that start well, but degenerate into a spiral of nonsense.

Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby meeks on Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:20 am

actually 1 thing that hasn't been touched on is energy vampires. people that often have little or no qi gong experience but just naturally drain the hell out of you to the point of being fatigued, dizzy, chest or stomach pains. I first encountered this with a guy in the mid 90s... we'd have a conversation and I'd end up feeling sick/nauseous and needing a nap. I had a student in my taiji class for awhile that naturally consumed all the qi being generated like pakman... after my taiji classes I'd get in my van and feel like taking a nap, but on days that she wasn't there everyone commented on how strong the energy of the class was, etc...

I even have a couple of people in my neighborhood that are like that. In fact some of them are so strong that if I'm on the phone with another energy sensitive person even the person on the phone with me will suddenly say "ow...wtf is that draining me...ouch..." and it's because my neighbor 2 doors down suddenly came outside into their yard. happens quite consistently. When my neighbor came to my house a few weeks ago for a few hours (he's a real cool guy and we're friends despite the drain he does) he drained the energy of my whole place and left me with chest pains for hours afterwards.

I try energy tricks like 'putting up a shield' and defining energetic boundaries but it doesn't seem to do a heck of a lot of good.
Last edited by meeks on Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby northern_mantis on Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:55 am

[quote="meeks"]actually 1 thing that hasn't been touched on is energy vampires. people that often have little or no qi gong experience but just naturally drain the hell out of you to the point of being fatigued, dizzy, chest or stomach pains.

Young kids especially around 2-3 years old seem to have that ability to feed on your energy. Talking about feeding has anybody fasted using energy arts to replace food? Have heard this mentioned briefly but never in depth.

Btw this is my favourite thread in a long time, absolutely fascinating. I keep checking all the time because I really hope methods is gona come in with something really cool.
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby Daniel on Thu Aug 04, 2011 10:53 am

Re Meeks´s comment: age or illness can often make people "natural" energy vampires. They are not conscious of doing it, their system is trying to pull energy from others to survive. There are ways of countering this with several different techniques, but the best way is to try to avoid them if possible, or to go in and help them consciously in case that´s the investment one wants to make. The latter usually demands a significant rise in training time involving health qigong, meditation and some MA.

There are also people who pull energy semi-consciously, through attention, whining, or other means. They are often damaged, ill, or have had an illness for so long that they have learned to use it to draw energy from others. These cases are much more difficult to be around and demand more caution to preserve one´s own health. Once there, it is difficult to make them change that habit.

Trained, conscious energy vampires are exceedingly rare. It is considered to be one of the worst possible things to do against other beings.

Re inviting any kind of being or "deity" into oneself: no. Never. This is incredibly dangerous. A simile might be going out on the Web with no firewall, no anti-virus programs, and no awareness about what viruses are. You want to have at least the first two in place, and just be yourself.


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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby Ralteria on Thu Aug 04, 2011 2:20 pm

That's interesting considering I've always associated energy vampires to be the kind of people who prey on you emotional, i.e. take and no give. I've known a few who consciously prey on other peoples fear or other negative emotional states. They have an excuse as to why they do so (tragic upbringing or something to that effect) but don't see any reason to act any differently as it's "not their problem". I've always found disassociation to be the cure.
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby I-mon on Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:39 pm

Yeah I've recently had a student/friend-of-a-friend of this type, hard core drain, and she was coming to me for therapy and yoga classes. Major challenge to try to treat, help, and educate - ie to give her as much as possible - while also having to really consciously put up an emotional wall that she couldn't get through. She felt it instantly, of course, like she does from everyone, which causes her to feel depressed and isolated and negative, which makes her more of a drain on other people....it's a tough cycle, and one which I didn't feel at all strong enough to help her with :/
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby I-mon on Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:46 pm

Daniel wrote:Re inviting any kind of being or "deity" into oneself: no. Never. This is incredibly dangerous. A simile might be going out on the Web with no firewall, no anti-virus programs, and no awareness about what viruses are. You want to have at least the first two in place, and just be yourself.


D.

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A lot of this sort of stuff in Tibetan culture. Psychic protection (and more!) through visualizing oneself as emptiness, visualizing oneself as a bodhisattva with infinite compassion, etc. Good old Tantric practices, tried and true, and often way way way off the path taught by the Buddha :D

The Most Generous Cut

By Alejandro Chaoul-Reich

THE TIBETAN PRACTICE of Chod, literally translated as "cutting", is a meditative practice, but not one done sitting quietly and comfortably on a cushion inside a shrine room. Instead, this meditation is purposely performed in frightening places, such as cemeteries and charnel grounds. Singing, dancing, and playing special bone instruments, the chod practitioner, or chopa, visualizes the dismemberment, cooking, and finally offering of one's own body as a banquet to an assembly of demons, spirits, and sentient beings. The contemporary Tibetan Lama , scholar, and chod master Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche, describes the aim of the practice in his book The Crystal and the Way of Light: "By summoning up what is most dreaded, and openly offering what we usually most want to protect, the chod works to cut us out of the double bind of the ego and attachment to the body. In fact the name chod means "to cut"; but it is the attachment, not the body itself, that is the problem to cut through."

Chod is attributed to the eleventh-century female Tibetan teacher Machig Labdron and the teachings of her teacher, the Indian Pandit Padampa Sangye. Over the centuries, chod practice has filtered into many different lineages of Tibetan Buddhism. It also exists in the Tibetan Bon religion. Bon predates Buddhism in Tibet, and the two traditions have influenced one another greatly over the centuries. In Bon, chod is traced to a different source, a relationship still being explored by historians and yet to be reconciled. What is clear is that chod is a Tibetan practice that, despite its shocking nature, works in many different ways for many different practitioners.

According to Machig's Mahamudra Chod teaching, also called the teaching With the Object of Cutting Demons, "A demon actually is anything which obstructs one's progress toward enlightenment.... Therefore, loving friends and relatives can become demons insofar as they obstruct one's liberation. Especially, there is no greater demon than one's self-grasping. As long as one has not cut this self-grasping, then all the demons are standing around with their mouths wide open." One's perception of demons depends on one's capacity as a practitioner: they can be perceived as existing outside of oneself or as part of oneself. Through this practice, one can recognize those obstructions or demons and use them as a bridge to reconnect to one's own nature, cutting the veils of one's ego-the self-grasping demon. By feeding the demons, and utilizing generosity as a means to cut the root of ignorance-self-grasping-the chopa clears away all obstacles to the understanding of one's true nature. It is only by cutting the self-grasper, the most powerful of demons, that one can free oneself from all obstacles and reconnect to one's natural state of mind, one's enlightened nature.

What follows could be understood as a generic template common to all chod traditions. Before performing the practice in the terrifying environment, the chopa is taught at a peaceful site, such as a monastery, a dharma center or one's own house. Once sufficiently trained, seated at night in a charnel ground or some other desolate spot, the chöpa blows a trumpet made from a human thigh-bone, calling all the spirits to invite them to the feast. Playing a bell and a damaru, a two-headed drum traditionally made from human skulls, he aims to enter and abide in a calm and fully aware meditative state of mind. In this state, he visualizes expelling his consciousness from his body, the former becoming a deity (most often a female one) and the latter a corpse from which the guests will feast. In the visualization, the deity severs the cranium and then chops the corpse in pieces, placing the flesh, blood, and bones inside the cranium, which becomes a cauldron. Over a low fire, the flesh, blood, and bones are cooked into nectar that satisfies all the desires of the enlightened and non-enlightened guests-Buddhas and bodhisattvas, demons and spirits, wrathful protectors and sentient beings alike. In other words, no being is excluded from this offering. After this offering-usually called a "white feast"-a second offering of a visualized "red feast" of just raw flesh, blood, and bones is offered for the more carnivorous guests, in a manner reminiscent of the Tibetan custom of "sky burial," in which a corpse is chopped up for consumption by vultures. As the goal is to satisfy all these guests, the offerings are made in the way of a banquet-some guests may want to choose from the white banquet and others from the red.

The visualized offerings are endless, in that they suffice no matter how many guests come or how big their appetite is, and infinite, in that they transform into whatever the guests desire. As he concludes this unique offering, the chopa feels that all the desires of every guest have been thoroughly satisfied, in both quantity and quality, and that everything one has to offer has been given. This aspect of generosity in the offering of one's body is crucial in the chod practice. The practitioner employs his body to finally cut the attachment to it. The body becomes the tool that the practitioner uses to play the instruments, to dance and chant vigorously, and at the same time it is the object of offering. This offering is also a "gift of dharma" where the practitioner's altruistic intention is that the guests feel so satisfied by the banquets that they do not want to harm anyone anymore, and instead see the benefit for themselves of developing the altruistic mind of enlightenment, or bodhichitta.

Like most Tibetan Buddhist and Bon teachings, chod has different levels of understanding according to the different lineages and practitioners. One way of approaching the meaning of the practice is to look at what it is that different practitioners understand is being "cut."

If what is cut is perceived as actual demons, in the sense of external natural forces or illnesses in the form of malignant spirits, one could say it is a shamanic perspective-in other words, the practitioner is in direct communication with the spirit realm and uses the chod practice to communicate with those beings and be free from the disturbances they can provoke.

From the standpoint of the essential teachings of the Buddhist sutras, sometimes called the path of renunciation, it refers to cutting negative emotions or hindrances to practice by means of abandoning them, offering them up, and acting in accordance with Buddhist teachings on ethics, such as the Prajnaparamita, or Perfection of Wisdom sutra. In the Jataka Tales, a collection of folktale-like stories of previous births of the Buddha, there are "gift of the body" tales in which bodhisattvas in the form of animals sacrifice themselves for the good of others. These can also be seen as sutric inspirations for the chod practice. As Buddhist scholar Reiko Ohnuma writes, "Perhaps what these stories attempt to suggest is that the Buddha's gift of dharma to living beings should emotionally be experienced as equivalent to someone who slices up his own body and gives his flesh away."

In the tantric view-the path of transformation based in the esoteric practices of Vajrayana Buddhism-chod refers to cutting and cooking one's body, usually considered defiled, and alchemically transforming it into pure nectar that becomes a wonderful offering even to enlightened beings. The flesh, blood, and bone are said in many texts to represent the ignorance, attachment, and hatred respectively that are also transformed through this practice.

In the dzogchen, or Great Perfection, view, the path of self-liberation based in the ancient teachings of Bön and the Nyingma school of Tibetan Buddhism, it refers to cutting through the root of the thought process, in other words, cutting off the "demon" of self-grasping and remaining in that non-dual state of self-liberation.
That it is pan-Tibetan and encompasses all these views-the shamanic, sutric, tantric, and dzogchen-is a beautiful aspect of this intricate and often misunderstood practice. Chod addresses issues for everyone, no matter what walk of life or perspective she or he is coming from. Everyone is fed-no one is excluded. And as for its efficacy, the late Gelug teacher Zong Rinpoche asserted that it is "like taking a jet plane to Enlightenment rather than walking."
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby Mr_Wood on Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:53 pm

This thread has got my attention now as I am well familiar with people who have a natural ability to drain, I used to share an apartment with a guy like this, i moved out after a few months as he was too much. I've also never heard of anyone who does this without actually coming into direct contact although just the thought of the presence of some people can be quite draining....Also there are those people you come across when almost instantly there is a bad connection / feeling, is this related ? I always put it down to a personality clash of some sort ? but at the same time these people tend to be very hard work and leave you feeling in a bad mood for no real reason.

So what are we saying here ? That these are psychic attacks ? That these people have negative energy due to what exactly ? I'd like to here from someone with more knowledge on these matters..
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby Dmitri on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:05 pm

I've also never heard of anyone who does this without actually coming into direct contact


Pheromones?
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby I-mon on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:19 pm

nonverbal communication. our brains and nervous systems can't help but pick up and be influenced by other people's states of beings. their body language, facial shapes and movements, changes in complexion, eye movements, tones of voice, breathing patterns, smells, etc, are all picked up by us and cause changes/reactions in our own systems. Our brains and bodies are resonating with those of the people around us, whether we like it or not and whether we are aware of it or not.
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby Mr_Wood on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:28 pm

Ok, so then how do spirits and the like fit in to all of this ?

So If we took a terrorist for ( an extreme ) example, not a religious nut, just someone who gets kicks out of other peoples fear. Then we could say that they are doing this on a massive scale as they are feeding on the fear they are causing ?
Last edited by Mr_Wood on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby BaguaKicksAss on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:51 pm

northern_mantis wrote:Talking about feeding has anybody fasted using energy arts to replace food? Have heard this mentioned briefly but never in depth.


Tried it, but it only works to a degree. However with liquid vitamins it worked far better. Energy arts, but also various teas and such.

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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby BaguaKicksAss on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:56 pm

Daniel wrote:s.

Re inviting any kind of being or "deity" into oneself: no. Never. This is incredibly dangerous. A simile might be going out on the Web with no firewall, no anti-virus programs, and no awareness about what viruses are. You want to have at least the first two in place, and just be yourself.


D.

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I would disagree in some cases. Not that a newbie should ever engage in such things, but there are more then a few spiritual paths where this is the central focus of the spiritual practices. Of course you wouldn't want to let any old random entity walk in (ie. channeling) and you would want to have enough experience, training (not books) and know how that you get the right one.... From what I recall there is even such practices in the Christian religion, when the priest or whomever (don't know the proper terms) brings in the divine, or God, or holy spirit? I have seen it done, just not so sure what exactly they were referring to it as.

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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby BaguaKicksAss on Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:58 pm

meeks wrote:actually 1 thing that hasn't been touched on is energy vampires. people that often have little or no qi gong experience but just naturally drain the hell out of you to the point of being fatigued, dizzy, chest or stomach pains. I first encountered this with a guy in the mid 90s... we'd have a conversation and I'd end up feeling sick/nauseous and needing a nap. I had a student in my taiji class for awhile that naturally consumed all the qi being generated like pakman... after my taiji classes I'd get in my van and feel like taking a nap, but on days that she wasn't there everyone commented on how strong the energy of the class was, etc...

I even have a couple of people in my neighborhood that are like that. In fact some of them are so strong that if I'm on the phone with another energy sensitive person even the person on the phone with me will suddenly say "ow...wtf is that draining me...ouch..." and it's because my neighbor 2 doors down suddenly came outside into their yard. happens quite consistently. When my neighbor came to my house a few weeks ago for a few hours (he's a real cool guy and we're friends despite the drain he does) he drained the energy of my whole place and left me with chest pains for hours afterwards.

I try energy tricks like 'putting up a shield' and defining energetic boundaries but it doesn't seem to do a heck of a lot of good.


The worst is elderly people in poor health on the bus :(. No wonder I always bikeride!

I recommend a mixture of salt and lemon juice. You can use some experimentation to figure out the how and when and where.

BKA
Last edited by BaguaKicksAss on Thu Aug 04, 2011 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby BaguaKicksAss on Thu Aug 04, 2011 5:02 pm

The Chod article was definitely interesting :). I've seen some very similar practices in other paths, just using different symbolism and Deity/s.

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Re: Fighting against spirits, defence from psychic attacks

Postby BaguaKicksAss on Thu Aug 04, 2011 5:06 pm

Mr_Wood wrote:This thread has got my attention now as I am well familiar with people who have a natural ability to drain, I used to share an apartment with a guy like this, i moved out after a few months as he was too much. I've also never heard of anyone who does this without actually coming into direct contact although just the thought of the presence of some people can be quite draining....Also there are those people you come across when almost instantly there is a bad connection / feeling, is this related ? I always put it down to a personality clash of some sort ? but at the same time these people tend to be very hard work and leave you feeling in a bad mood for no real reason.

So what are we saying here ? That these are psychic attacks ? That these people have negative energy due to what exactly ? I'd like to here from someone with more knowledge on these matters..


Most of the time it's your instincts warning you that this person is not good for you for whatever reason. It's actually the first thing I ask folks when they say they aren't psychic... have you ever felt that a certain person is bad to be around, but for no physical reason. Other times it's just an energy clash *cough* J and D *cough*. Sometimes it's that the person has some nasty energy around them from either negative thoughts, living in a really nasty area, or bad spirits. I have found that when I personally ignore those instincts and hang out with the person, something goes very very wrong in the end.

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