master Gao Zhuangfei

The following typical threads that plague martial arts sites will get moved here if not just deleted: 1 - My style is better than Your style" - 2 - "Internal & External" - 3 - Personal attacks - 4 - Threads that start well, but degenerate into a spiral of nonsense.

master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:48 pm


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7T7jTPK9Wg

translation by one of my students..
much of what is translated has been talked about on this site.

Time stamp: 0..1:0:
Need to know what "TaiChi" means in order to learn it well.
TaiChi means: "no pole" (Field/Circle/Empty) which generates "poles" (YingYang/In & out/Body).
The core of TaiChi Quan is to interchange the act of Field affecting body and body reacting to field.
Ying & Yang are two faces of one thing, cannot be separated.

1:0 ..1:25:
When we contact, we consist of the "no pole" (combine our fields?), if he is Yang, then I will be the Ying; vice versa.
I can hit him by breaking his own Ying & Yang.

1:26..1:36
I can hit him by my internal as outside is hard, expand my internal out.

1:37..1:53
I can hit him by my outside, go to my inside then hit him by my outside.
When he came in, I am Ying, then become Yang. I am Yang, then become Ying.
It is all about the ying/yang change.

1:54..2:20
When he touch me, I can use my circle to hit him; use my center to hit him; my center expanded to hit him.

2:21..2:55
I can also hit him by changing curve to straight, by my knee, by my hip by expansion, by my Dantian, by my waist due to loosing my shoulder and back to my waist,

2:56..3:30
I can hit him by my shoulder, shoulder sinks to my YongQuan (on my foot).
I can hit him by one finger softly. When I touch him, I grab his foot root and hit his foot.
The change of Ying/Yang is layer by layer with angle.

3:31..4:11
I do my form to have my field first, then follow the field, change my shape to bring in my field, I move within my field.

4:12..4:39
My single foot is not only support my weight, also can farjin. This is due to expansion/compressing; i.e. ying/yang.
Last edited by windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.
rule 19
windwalker
Wuji
 
Posts: 5543
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:08 am
Location: Hisnchu, Taiwan

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:17 pm

Too much bunny hopping for my taste -- not impressed.

If this teacher has skill, he's chosen a very bad way to demonstrate it.
C.J.W.
Wuji
 
Posts: 1338
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:02 am

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:19 pm

Here he is again doing some no-touch fajin:

C.J.W.
Wuji
 
Posts: 1338
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:02 am

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby Bao on Wed Nov 18, 2015 4:19 pm

Thanks for the translation. My chinese is a bit ... Mediocre..., I never have patience to listen in details to what they say. But I like the philosophical explanation. It should be valuable to put in many different contexts.

C.J.W. wrote:If this teacher has skill, he's chosen a very bad way to demonstrate it.


Interesting comment... Let's see...

So... What skills and in what manner would you prefer? You mean that it might be better to show technique in a way that resemble how a normal student, preferably a beginner should to it to make it work for the student instead of a way that only the master can do it? So it will be more comprehendable for common viewers? I see.... But to lower himself to student level, would such a demonstration really make justice to his skills? ... ;) That was what you wanted, right? :P So how can you say that this isn't representative of his skill? Or why do you think that there is not some kind of skill behind it?
O:)
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog)
- Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert
- To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
Bao
Great Old One
 
Posts: 5323
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 12:46 pm
Location: High up north

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 4:58 pm

Bao wrote:
C.J.W. wrote:If this teacher has skill, he's chosen a very bad way to demonstrate it.


Interesting comment... Let's see...

So... What skills and in what manner would you prefer? You mean that it might be better to show technique in a way that resemble how a normal student, preferably a beginner should to it to make it work for the student instead of a way that only the master can do it? So it will be more comprehendable for common viewers? I see.... But to lower himself to student level, would such a demonstration really make justice to his skills? ... ;) That was what you wanted, right? :P So how can you say that this isn't representative of his skill? Or why do you think that there is not some kind of skill behind it?
O:)


The validity and value of the type of demonstration seen in the clips have been debated to death here on RSF over the years, so I don't see any need to drag the dead horse out of the grave and start beating it again.

Judging by the tone of your response and the series of sarcastic questions, you seem impressed by what he is showing. It's perfectly a-ok with me because we are all entitled to our own opinions, and I stand by mine.

But I must say I am a little surprised -- I thought you were more of a realist when it comes to Taiji. How is his demonstration (especially the no-touch linkonjin stuff) different from that of Yan Fang, the mysterious Chen Taiji lady who is now widely recognized as a charlatan and has been ostracized by others from Li Jinwu's lineage?

Last edited by C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
C.J.W.
Wuji
 
Posts: 1338
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:02 am

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:16 pm

C.J.W. wrote:Too much bunny hopping for my taste -- not impressed.

If this teacher has skill, he's chosen a very bad way to demonstrate it.


of course, your not impressed no one asked you to be.

its demo, demonstration the concepts he's talking about.
its not about impressing anyone. He taking in Chinese to those who understand what
skill sets he's talking about.

Some have asked about translations, I thought this might help make it more clear.

Until one has felt it or do it
much of what is shown is kind of academic

all of what he says, and shows can be explained.
Kinda surprised people comment on what they see not tie ing it into what is said or explained.

Cross body alignment
yin, yang point
central axis
pivot point
inner and outer changes
single weighted foot.
center
6 harmonies
dantian

ect,,,all things that many write about but somehow never seem to
understand when its viewed

whether one likes what is shown or not
its his way of getting his point across in a clear manor
rule 19
windwalker
Wuji
 
Posts: 5543
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:08 am
Location: Hisnchu, Taiwan

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:20 pm

But I must say I am a little surprised -- I thought you were more of a realist when it comes to Taiji. How is his demonstration (especially the no-touch linkonjin stuff) different from that of Yan Fang, the mysterious Chen Taiji lady who is now widely recognized as a charlatan and has been ostracized by others from Li Jinwu's lineage?


this has very little to do with this thread, also there is a back story. not public
the process by which it works is the same,,,,,,,
rule 19
windwalker
Wuji
 
Posts: 5543
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:08 am
Location: Hisnchu, Taiwan

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:27 pm

So... What skills and in what manner would you prefer? You mean that it might be better to show technique in a way that resemble how a normal student, preferably a beginner should to it to make it work for the student instead of a way that only the master can do it? So it will be more comprehensible for common viewers? I see.... But to lower himself to student level, would such a demonstration really make justice to his skills? ... ;) That was what you wanted, right? :P So how can you say that this isn't representative of his skill?
Or why do you think that there is not some kind of skill behind it?
O:)


all good questions
why would a master show beginning level skill sets trying to show high level taiji concepts.

for some instead of focusing on what he said or has been translated, or how it relates to what is shown it gets down

not impressed.


ok got it :-\
Last edited by windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
rule 19
windwalker
Wuji
 
Posts: 5543
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:08 am
Location: Hisnchu, Taiwan

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:28 pm

The core of TaiChi Quan is to interchange the act of Field affecting body and body reacting to field.
Ying & Yang are two faces of one thing, cannot be separated.


which is exactly what he shows.
rule 19
windwalker
Wuji
 
Posts: 5543
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:08 am
Location: Hisnchu, Taiwan

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:32 pm

C.J.W. wrote:Here he is again doing some no-touch fajin:



if your a native speaker why not post what he's talking about.
a little more constructive then your post.

The master talks about what he is doing and how, and all your got is

"here he is again"

on an English speaking web site..
why not help others to understand what is said, and then contrast it
to what is shown.....
Last edited by windwalker on Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:50 pm, edited 3 times in total.
rule 19
windwalker
Wuji
 
Posts: 5543
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:08 am
Location: Hisnchu, Taiwan

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:16 pm

windwalker wrote:
C.J.W. wrote:Too much bunny hopping for my taste -- not impressed.

If this teacher has skill, he's chosen a very bad way to demonstrate it.


of course, your not impressed no one asked you to be.

its demo, demonstration the concepts he's talking about.
its not about impressing anyone. He taking in Chinese to those who understand what
skill sets he's talking about.

Some have asked about translations, I thought this might help make it more clear.

Until one has felt it or do it
much of what is shown is kind of academic

all of what he says, and shows can be explained.
Kinda surprised people comment on what they see not tie ing it into what is said or explained.

Cross body alignment
yin, yang point
central axis
pivot point
inner and outer changes
single weighted foot.
center
6 harmonies
dantian

ect,,,all things that many write about but somehow never seem to
understand when its viewed

whether one likes what is shown or not
its his way of getting his point across in a clear manor



The concepts and principles he talks about are nothing new. The ways he demonstrates them, however, are terribly misleading and fall within the realm of cooperative parlor tricks that have long given Taiji a bad name.
Last edited by C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
C.J.W.
Wuji
 
Posts: 1338
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:02 am

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby C.J.W. on Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:20 pm

windwalker wrote:
C.J.W. wrote:Here he is again doing some no-touch fajin:



if your a native speaker why not post what he's talking about.
a little more constructive then your post.

The master talks about what he is doing and how, and all your got is

"here he is again"

on an English speaking web site..
why not help others to understand what is said, and then contrast it
to what is shown.....


Sorry, but bouncing an opponent away without physical contact is something that obviously transcends this native speaker's level of understanding.

I'm sure your student will be happy to oblige.
C.J.W.
Wuji
 
Posts: 1338
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:02 am

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby Bao on Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:52 pm

C.J.W. wrote:Judging by the tone of your response and the series of sarcastic questions, you seem impressed by what he is showing. It's perfectly a-ok with me because we are all entitled to our own opinions, and I stand by mine.

But I must say I am a little surprised -- I thought you were more of a realist when it comes to Taiji. How is his demonstration (especially the no-touch linkonjin stuff) different from that of Yan Fang, the mysterious Chen Taiji lady who is now widely recognized as a charlatan and has been ostracized by others from Li Jinwu's lineage?


It's not a matter of being realist or not. I am deliberately trying to provoke an answer on what you believe is skill and how to show skill. ;) I thought it was a little bit funny way to express it "if he had skill". But again... Me Impressed? I can tell you that there are cultural contexts behind what you see and what you think is odd. The reactions you see in the clips is, IMO not very interesting and not worth debating again. But He might have some very interesting practice in his background, knowledge and skills. I dislike many things about certain demonstrations. But still, I am not so easy to judge a teacher or his actual skills due to the demonstrations I see. But again, I would like to see other things. Like what practice his students are practicing. Why can't we have a more productive discussion than going on with the same endless things again and again and again? These debates leads to nowhere. @@@
Last edited by Bao on Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog)
- Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert
- To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
Bao
Great Old One
 
Posts: 5323
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 12:46 pm
Location: High up north

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby Bao on Thu Nov 19, 2015 1:07 am

Also, it was not meant as sarcasm. I am genuinely Interested in your thoughts.
I am very tired on this kind of discussion and desperately trying to find another angle to look at the teachers involved. Again, just to make the discussions a little bit more productive.
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog)
- Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert
- To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
Bao
Great Old One
 
Posts: 5323
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 12:46 pm
Location: High up north

Re: master Gao Zhuangfei

Postby middleway on Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:35 am

ughhhhhhhhhhhh ..... I (and i wager quite a few others here) am so sick of seeing this shit, and seeing it endlessly debated by the true believers and the skeptics, The 'you have to feel its' and the ' It doesnt work on me's' ....

The debate will rage until a video is released of one of these guys getting punted in the face.... so, by way of comparison:

Watching this video people could be easily fooling into thinking that this guy has some skills. nothing he shows here is that different to what some Tai Chi 'masters' are showing in their demos.




But we all know what happened when this 'Master' of subtle skills met a distinctly low level MMA guy.



We need to move past these demo's if we are to really examine and progress the utility of the internal arts. They are truly powerful combat systems ... but not because of what occurs to compliant students in these demonstrations.

I live in hope that at some point we will return to discussions on the merits of Tai Chi Chuan as a truly useful fighting art.

Chris.
"I am not servant to the method, the method is servant to me"
Me

My Blog: http://www.martialbody.com/Blog-Research
middleway
Wuji
 
Posts: 4171
Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 2:25 am
Location: United Kingdom

Next

Return to Been There Done That

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest