the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

A citizen is a citizen
The problem as I see it, as shown in other countries
once a certain population density is reached those that hold beliefs
based on a religion seek to impose them on others which is something
I never agreed with nor really understood...No matter what religion.

From what I've read concerning Islam, its not about the peace.

no, I'm asking an American man.

Ah, so I'm an American with all the rights and privileges. Good to know. But, about whether he supports a system that condone slavery. Well, since American slavery was based on Christianity (and capitalism), I should think that there's something wrong with Christianity and capitalists. But, I don't. Even if I carry money with images of slave holders on one side and "In God We Trust" on the other. Ya know why I don't generalize? It's simple. I know too many Christians and Americans who would never support the oppression of any group of people because of their religion.

From what I've read concerning Islam, its not about the peace.

Yeah, yeah, from what you've read. I've read quite a bit about Americans, too. Do you actually know any Muslims. But, ya know, that population density argument could apply to Chinese, Koreans, Mexicans, Buddhists, etc.

Steve James wrote:

no, I'm asking an American man.

Ah, so I'm an American with all the rights and privileges. Good to know. But, about whether he supports a system that condone slavery. Well, since American slavery was based on Christianity (and capitalism), I should think that there's something wrong with Christianity and capitalists. But, I don't. Even if I carry money with images of slave holders on one side and "In God We Trust" on the other. Ya know why I don't generalize? It's simple. I know too many Christians and Americans who would never support the oppression of any group of people because of their religion.

From what I've read concerning Islam, its not about the peace.

Yeah, yeah, from what you've read. I've read quite a bit about Americans, too. Do you actually know any Muslims. But, ya know, that population density argument could apply to Chinese, Koreans, Mexicans, Buddhists, etc.

Um, you're asking a Black man in America. Think about that for a sec

why? should it matter ?

I had edited my post because I felt it had little to do with a net discussion based on recent events that pertain to
acts carried out in the name of an ideology.

Slavery is a documented fact concerning Islam which is still practice today in many parts of the world.
But you'd rather address something that has been addressed in the US and other parts of the world on a thread that's about what happened in Brussels.

Treat the ideology with caution and candidness. Treat the Muslim as an individual.
Don't judge Islam by the Muslims that you know, and don't judge the Muslims that you know by Islam.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages ... slims.aspx

interesting thread to a point.
later

always makes me laugh

Do you actually know any Muslims

rightttt I dont know any,,,lol

Anyone else notice the tactic of not answering the question? It's fascinating.

Steve James wrote: Well, since American slavery was based on Christianity (and capitalism),...

Slavery in the United States was brief compared to the Arab slave trade.
And by the way, the abolition movement started in Christian countries (the U.S. and Europe).

Slavery in the United States was brief compared to the Arab slave trade.

So?

And by the way, the abolition movement started in Christian countries (the U.S. and Europe).

That, btw, doesn't change anything. American Christians (actually, "alleged" Christians) put money before morality, and raped, killed, and oppressed other human beings. Therefore, "Christianity" did not prevent "Christians" from enslaving people --including other Christians. Christianity has not stopped Christians from burning crosses on lawns. There are still Christians who argue that the South was right, slavery shouldn't have been abolished, etc., etc. Christianity, in other words, has nothing to do with what Americans have done.

Anti-slavery was started by the people who resisted slavery in the first place. I.e., not the Christians. It's true that anti-slavery societies were populated by Christians. However, they didn't generally argue in terms of Christian principles. They argued that slavery was inhumane and morally reprehensible --in the British Parliament and French National Assembly during the 18th century. The arguments there --and I can produce them, or you can just google-- were political and economic. Secondly, it was the Enlightenment; the age of rationalism over religion. That is, except in the U.S.

First of all, dying in ecstasy - isn`t bad idea at all , hope you do will agree, D. ?

Second, IF I recognize holy verses as , well, >mistake<,- they aren`t holy for me, any more.
We have the brain, gift from the God - everybody get it for free,
just not to many really try to using it.
Funny, if you consider, that ONLY 200 hundreds years ago Vienna Medical Academy Doctors believed , that something like " bacteria" idea - is stupid...
so
anyway,
I agree, and have nothing against - that, some part of mankind can believe in holly book/s/
BUT
I do not agree to be forced to think, AND live their way !
Let it be : Muslims, Christians, Buddhists, whatever...
My speech is short , then:
have to kill you!

btw,
interesting, somebody know Buddhists terrorist?

Then, Steve - book or brain ?
Me thinkin` that mind produced book...
You can not defend the mummy, if you press, there will be dust only.
US is very strange place , Mormons league just pops up in my mind

If you squeeze religions into the main points/principles, most of them amazingly looks the same...

I have to agree with the Lenin:
Religion is pulp-fiction /opium in original/ for the masses
or
in my own words:
in the reality: religion is, and always was, used to rule.
Not the big discovery if you skip thru our history.
and, the final note for today :

HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE


e. for clarity

wiesiek wrote:btw,
interesting, somebody know Buddhists terrorist?

Maybe not exactly terrorism:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhism_ ... l_examples

Also the CIA-funded Tibetan Uprising of 1959:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_ ... n_uprising

(+ A Chinese guy who served in the military in Tibet told me soldiers couldn't leave the base individually; quite a few of the ones that did turned up beheaded.)

well,
when German Army occupied Poland , soldier alone, out of the base- didn`t live to long...

wiesiek wrote:well,
when German Army occupied Poland , soldier alone, out of the base- didn`t live to long...

Because of Polish Buddhists?

Well, there's been plenty of violence committed by Buddhists against members of other religions, including Muslims. However, I think that the pattern to notice is that people direct their violence against specific religions. So, religion "A" is identified as evil, and members of religion "B" argue that the only way to solve the problem is to eliminate religion "A". Of course, religion "A" argues that all religion "B" wants to do is exterminate them. Therefore, it's fair to exterminate religion ... by this time, both sides are equally evil anyway.

Anyway, when people talk about "God-given" gun rights on Easter Sunday, it's easy to see how easily anything can be considered Christian. That's my point. Anybody can legitimize anything in or with their religion, and they do. It doesn't mean that any "religion" is bad. But, history is the best reason to avoid vilifying a religious (or any other group). It always turns out worst for the ones who vilify. Muslims should stop because they're killing Muslims. Christians have the same reasons. "Americans" do too, and so on down the line.

wiesiek wrote:First of all, dying in ecstasy - isn`t bad idea at all , hope you do will agree, D. ?

Second, IF I recognize holy verses as , well, >mistake<,- they aren`t holy for me, any more.
We have the brain, gift from the God - everybody get it for free,
just not to many really try to using it.
Funny, if you consider, that ONLY 200 hundreds years ago Vienna Medical Academy Doctors believed , that something like " bacteria" idea - is stupid...
so
anyway,
I agree, and have nothing against - that, some part of mankind can believe in holly book/s/
BUT
I do not agree to be forced to think, AND live their way !
Let it be : Muslims, Christians, Buddhists, whatever...
My speech is short , then:
have to kill you!

btw,
interesting, somebody know Buddhists terrorist?

Then, Steve - book or brain ?
Me thinkin` that mind produced book...
You can not defend the mummy, if you press, there will be dust only.
US is very strange place , Mormons league just pops up in my mind

If you squeeze religions into the main points/principles, most of them amazingly looks the same...

I have to agree with the Lenin:
Religion is pulp-fiction /opium in original/ for the masses
or
in my own words:
in the reality: religion is, and always was, used to rule.
Not the big discovery if you skip thru our history.
and, the final note for today :

HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE


e. for clarity

Of the Muslims I know/knew past co workers and such. In privet they world express one thing among the group they would tend to follow the dictates of the group even to having to grow a beard when going back to visit some relatives back home. We would joke about it back then. They would say I'm in terrorist mode now.

This would be before 9/11. The reactions on 9/11 among my co workers at the time was interesting. Coming to work that day everyone watched it on TV. Most where engineers working in high tech...
The new guy from China, was quite upset, very angry. I was quite surprised. The person from Iran, was very quite and soon left when some mentioned asked about why. My own reaction was one of feeling now the US understands what most of the rest of the world knows and lives with.

Some here talk about past events as comparisons to what is happening now trying to draw a moral equivalence to the events currently happening.

List of Islamic Terror:
Last 30 Days


This is part of the list of Islamic terror attacks maintained by TheReligionofPeace.com.

During this time period, there were 136 Islamic attacks in 25 countries, in which 1016 people were killed and 2914 injured.

(TROP does not catch all attacks. Not all attacks are immediately posted

No other religion has to attach "phobia" on the end of its name in order to bully others into silence - lest they be accused of harboring irrational fear for suggesting that Islam is different. Yet, all other religions combined do not account for even a fraction of terrorism in the name of their god that Islam produces each day. No religion is so demanding of respect while doing so little to earn it.

In fact, Islam is more than a religion. It is a rigid political and cultural system with a mandate to conquer and govern the lives of others via necessary force "until religion is only for Allah." Violence is sanctioned by the Quran, a book which not once tells Muslims to love those outside the faith.

The enemy of this orthodoxy is not just intellectual dissent and free speech, but human freedom. The divine charter of Islam is to impose itself and thus prevent the individual from discovering a different meaning for their own lives.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages ... -site.aspx

In fact, Islam is more than a religion. It is a rigid political and cultural system with a mandate to conquer and govern the lives of others via necessary force "until religion is only for Allah."

At the heart of the matter, if it was not considered a faith based system of belief I think most would tend to see it for what it is and act accordingly just as is done with nation states that are called communist.

The OP asked about what could be done, if anything. Externally until more view it for what it is, and act accordingly they will end up with very clear current examples of the end result.

Internally, until some type of reformation is made within the belief system itself regarding Jihad.
I don't see much change, with the only protection against it being to deny population densities that will allow them in time be able vote in laws or changes to laws that will favor and foster their beliefs. This is currently part of the immigration debate in the US, in other affected countries all are taking steps to mitigate a self imposed problem. For some it may be to late.

Being able to change something, is not something that those being allowed to immigrate to other countries could do within their country of origin. They learn fast

Graphs are great.

onebir wrote:

wiesiek wrote:well,
when German Army occupied Poland , soldier alone, out of the base- didn`t live to long...

Because of Polish Buddhists?

`cmon , onebir
because: Germans was aggressor/enemy on our own territory
like Chinese are in Tibet now,
we had the right to kill them all, like Tibetans , it is NO terror but SD.
hehe,
for the same simple reason we have right to kill all terrorists, doesn`t matter- if they are from middle east or domestic shithead.
In addition - religion is cover here, in Poland and Tibet example - religion is irrelevant .