Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby voidisyinyang on Mon May 07, 2018 2:55 pm

everything wrote:I was trying this small experiment. Put your hands about 4-5 inches apart in front of your dan tian, with palms both facing toward you. Try L closer than R, then try R closer than L. It will feel different.


yes males are to put the left hand first which is the dragon (yin qi) and tiger (right hand) is yang qi but for the lower body the left hand is yang and right hand is yin, which is to say males are yin externally - as the yang qi gets lost as the "substance."

Have you seen Santi Shi explained based on dragon and tiger before? or these complementary opposites of the right hand to the left foot and the left hand to the right foot? I can only find those two sources - and just the one is explicit and the other saying it is dragon and tiger qi. Then I found several sites of Western teachers who do not explain this cross or complementary opposites - noncommutative phase as it is called in Western math. So to me this is the secret of the training and yet it does not seem to be well understood by many teachers?!

I will look on the youtube vids of Santi Shi - but from my search of websites - those are the only two hits I got giving this secret of the Santi Shi training.

I noticed that the lower tan t'ien definitely is hot after the training - so this is a good sign that the Yuan qi is being created from the alchemical process of shen under the jing - and the yin-yang qi undivided is the yuan qi.... and the diaphragm muscle is sore....

So the goal is to restore the generative force - as the yin qi energy - which is the first step to activate the T'ai Chi of the ancestral cavity - the third eye - from the lower tan t'ien being filled with yin qi energy. The yin jing has to be converted to yang jing (yin qi) instead of being deconverted into generative fluid as it normally would do so - for males.

And so it has to be restored to a 16 year old - which is different depending on the ancestral generative force of the person, the age of the person, how celibate they have been, how much of their qi they have already used up, etc.

And as I quoted - most people never even get past this first stage of the training and so the training stays on a physical level. But it seems that - the actual Daoist aspect of the training is not even understood by most? No one explained it to me when I first posted on the Santi Shi posture.... Anyway like I said - I am just learning. But it is very affirming to discover the secret of this standing exercise if the same secret of the book Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality. The author of that book was also a martial artist as well - so he assumed people doing the small universe meditation would also be doing a foundation training in martial arts.
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby everything on Mon May 07, 2018 7:18 pm

If I put right hand closer to dantian with left over right, things heat up quickly, but not necessarily in a good way. It's as if the polarity is all messed up. It seems to "generate" qi and heat and sweat (literally), but doesn't seem good.

Martial artists don't seem too interested in qigong or "internal" anything (even on an "internal" board). Even if they are, almost by definition, they will only want to learn a tiny subset of the available knowledge, and then discount anything as not practical (which seems perfectly reasonable to me; I don't have any issue with that). It's most likely better to pursue TCM and qigong knowledge that has nothing to do with MA.

I tried to read some L R stuff on MA sites, but they just said it's "advanced" and don't worry about it until later. Doesn't sound like they had any clue.
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby voidisyinyang on Mon May 07, 2018 9:44 pm

everything wrote:If I put right hand closer to dantian with left over right, things heat up quickly, but not necessarily in a good way. It's as if the polarity is all messed up. It seems to "generate" qi and heat and sweat (literally), but doesn't seem good.

Martial artists don't seem too interested in qigong or "internal" anything (even on an "internal" board). Even if they are, almost by definition, they will only want to learn a tiny subset of the available knowledge, and then discount anything as not practical (which seems perfectly reasonable to me; I don't have any issue with that). It's most likely better to pursue TCM and qigong knowledge that has nothing to do with MA.

I tried to read some L R stuff on MA sites, but they just said it's "advanced" and don't worry about it until later. Doesn't sound like they had any clue.


O.K. I took several hours to search the Santi Shi vids on youtube - watched all of them, plus the Yiquan vids, etc. and then I did another internet search.
Amazingly NONE of them refer to this Daoist alchemy secret of the left hand focused on the right foot and the right hand focused on the left foot.
http://elixirfield.blogspot.com/2018/05 ... itely.html

I quote from the original teachers of Yi Quan - documenting directly the connection to the small universe or microcosmic orbit meditation - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=23868&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=45#wrap So that thread on what "yi" means - gets into this a bit:

It's about training the nervous system of both sides of your body equally, so that the nerves, neuromuscular junctions, etc. are the same on both sides.
貫穿 Guanchuan is threaded from end to end, but developing a body that is 不偏不倚 Bupianbuyi (Even Handed) connects the thread into a circle, a circuit.
So that one's Yi-Qi-Li can travel in a circuit.

It's also about the meridians, in tcm you can needle the Jing Mai in, say the uninjured knee, to relieve the swelling in the injured knee (as needling the swollen knee could bring more blood and swelling into it). See Distal Points and "great loops"~ http://www.acupuncturetoday.com/mpacms/ ... p?id=28439

More importantly is that you want the Luo Mai (vessels of the primovascular system) to be developed evenly, and equally throughout your whole body, as these small channels transport fluids, nutrients, and neurotransmitters around our body.


So they quote this acupuncture article that gives this secret principle:
The principle of great loops treatment is simply that, for pain on or around a joint, go to the joint on the opposite quadrant of the body, as shown in the joint correspondence pictures above, and palpate for very tender points. When treated, these distal points will likely be highly effective for relieving pain in the symptomatic area.


And so the right elbow goes to the OPPOSITE left knee, etc.

http://www.acupuncturetoday.com/mpacms/ ... p?id=28439

left shoulder to the right hip, etc.
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby wiesiek on Mon May 07, 2018 11:59 pm

wow,

10th page! -cheer-
no topic competitor is growin` -woot-

-joint-
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby RobP3 on Tue May 08, 2018 12:45 am

everything wrote:
Martial artists don't seem too interested in qigong or "internal" anything (even on an "internal" board). Even if they are, almost by definition, they will only want to learn a tiny subset of the available knowledge, and then discount anything as not practical (which seems perfectly reasonable to me; I don't have any issue with that). It's most likely better to pursue TCM and qigong knowledge that has nothing to do with MA.



Actually, they very much are, IME. It's just that they prefer information presented in a cogent and coherent fashion with some weight of personal and practical use behind it. Not just cut and paste from a wide range of disparate sources. Every "senior" martial arts teacher I've trained with has "internal work" of some form or other, often in great depth. Though, to be fair, I've yet to meet one who could take a full blown axe strike to the chest.
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby Steve James on Tue May 08, 2018 6:51 am

I've yet to meet one who could take a full blown axe strike to the chest.


Thanos?
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby voidisyinyang on Tue May 08, 2018 7:31 am


Martial artists don't seem too interested in qigong or "internal" anything (even on an "internal" board). Even if they are, almost by definition, they will only want to learn a tiny subset of the available knowledge, and then discount anything as not practical (which seems perfectly reasonable to me; I don't have any issue with that). It's most likely better to pursue TCM and qigong knowledge that has nothing to do with MA.

Actually, they very much are, IME. It's just that they prefer information presented in a cogent and coherent fashion with some weight of personal and practical use behind it. Not just cut and paste from a wide range of disparate sources. Every "senior" martial arts teacher I've trained with has "internal work" of some form or other, often in great depth. Though, to be fair, I've yet to meet one who could take a full blown axe strike to the chest.


Yes another "top" Yi Quan teacher corroborates my OP - as the founder stated it's all about dragon and tiger qi energy:

The left hand harmonizes with the right foot;
the left elbow harmonizes with the right knee;
the left shoulder harmonizes with the right hip,
and conversely so on the right side


The Essential Points in Xingyi Boxing’s Six Harmonies and the Extremities

http://sancai.se/wiki/wikipages/xing-yi ... 88-liu-he/

So riddle me this - how come I watched every youtube vid on how to do Santi Shi and NONE of them mentioned the above.

http://elixirfield.blogspot.com/2018/05 ... f-key.html

Jin Yun Ting: A 3rd Corroboration of the key secret of Yi Quan: Dragon and Tiger and right-left polarity qi harmonization

it's the secret of complementary opposites as the key core principle of Daoist alchemy!

It's AMAZING that this does not even get taught in ALL the youtube vids on Santi Shi - and this is only the 2nd source I can find that is explicit about what the dragon and tiger qi energy refers to. haha.

http://store.bokleipo.com/index.php?id_ ... er=product

That's his Yi Quan training manual.

So now I have two Yi Quan teachers - on record - corroborating my OP. haha.

Westernization of the Yi Quan training appears to have lost the secret of the Daoist alchemy energy harmonization.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_Shou_Tao

Except this Tang Shou Tao Association - since they translated the above Xingyi training manual.

.
It offers a rare and unique perspective on the martial and healing aspects of the internal art of Xingyi Quan. Author Biography: Jin Yunting was a student of Shang Yunxiang and Sun Lutang and grand-student of Li Cunyi. John Groschwitz began his martial arts training in 1995 with the study of Northern Shaolin. He began training in Xingyi Quan in 1996 and is currently an Assistant Instructor in Xingyi with the North American Tang Shou Tao Association.


http://www.natsta.org/

That's the North American branch.



Maybe this doc will mention the secret. haha.





http://www.chineseboxingclub.org/

nope - that doc doesn't have it yet...



o.k. so now it gets into acupuncture....and meridians....
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby wiesiek on Wed May 09, 2018 5:38 am

don`t think so...
even hundreds bunches of the needles and all meridians full of the qi doesn`t build golden bell cover good for the full ax blow
if
you`re standing there and playing Superman ... ;D
however,
IF
you`re in spiritual form already and lost material connection -
then
even sword stabbing is piece of cake :-*
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby everything on Wed May 09, 2018 9:45 pm

Void why not try something much simpler?

Make the proverbial qi ball. Hold it in front of dantian. Circle your hands. See if you feel a difference depending on L vs R positioning. Don't worry too much about any theory or MA or santi or anything else for the moment. You don't even need to be standing.
Last edited by everything on Wed May 09, 2018 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby voidisyinyang on Thu May 10, 2018 8:06 pm

everything wrote:Void why not try something much simpler?

Make the proverbial qi ball. Hold it in front of dantian. Circle your hands. See if you feel a difference depending on L vs R positioning. Don't worry too much about any theory or MA or santi or anything else for the moment. You don't even need to be standing.


yes the first time I felt qi was from qigong master Effie P. Chow saying she had filled the room with qi and having us make "qi balls" with our palms facing each other in front of the tan t'ien. I could feel very strong magnetic force pushing my hands apart! Then when a security guard wandered in - an obese lady - wondering what was going on in our room since the fuse had gotten blown in the room behind (Effie P. Chow) - that really convinced me this was definitely worth investigating much deeper. That was 1995.

The thing is with the right hand and left foot and left foot and right hand - it is similar to the right hand facing the upper body and left hand facing the lower body. The key is you have a double reversal - kind of like lesser yin and lesser yang and greater yin and greater yang...

Anyway yes worry is too much left brain thinking and the reason it is the pancreas-spleen is this organ connects to the spinal sympathetic nervous system directly - when you do deep reverse breathing - so you have the intention of activating the yang qi up the spine.

As for not even needing standing - yes I am sure this is good - a lady in the Spring Forest Qigong training shared how she healed herself just by doing the "qi ball" movement - you just slowing expand and contract the hands and visualize the energy.

I have found the corroboration I was wondering about. Someone wanted me to check out another Yi Quan teacher and so I asked - o.k. show me where he teaches the right hand goes to the left foot and left hand to the right foot. Because if he can't even emphasize that key core Daoist alchemy training point - then I don't see the point in wasting my time. haha.
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby Dmitri on Fri May 11, 2018 4:13 am

voidisyinyang wrote:Then when a security guard wandered in - an obese lady - wondering what was going on in our room since the fuse had gotten blown in the room behind (Effie P. Chow) - that really convinced me this was definitely worth investigating much deeper

Yeah fuses blowing in rooms filled to the brim with qi is a fairly common occurrence. I am wondering however, what's the importance or relevance of the security guard being obese (and/or a lady) to this story?
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby Trick on Fri May 11, 2018 10:08 am

Dmitri wrote:I am wondering however, what's the importance or relevance of the security guard being obese (and/or a lady) to this story?

That you can only understand when you hav been in celibacy for16 years 8-)
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby voidisyinyang on Fri May 11, 2018 3:10 pm

Dmitri wrote:
voidisyinyang wrote:Then when a security guard wandered in - an obese lady - wondering what was going on in our room since the fuse had gotten blown in the room behind (Effie P. Chow) - that really convinced me this was definitely worth investigating much deeper

Yeah fuses blowing in rooms filled to the brim with qi is a fairly common occurrence. I am wondering however, what's the importance or relevance of the security guard being obese (and/or a lady) to this story?


So how come John chang's qi didn't register? Yet he could light up the new kind of light bulbs using quantum diodes - cause his energy is frequency coherent based on quantum frequency.
And then if you wonder why the security guard wandering in was a fat female then my answer is why did John Chang's chop stick hit the female sound lady right in the center of her forehead (by accident)?
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby everything on Fri May 11, 2018 8:21 pm

how is all this working for you?
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Re: Right hand white tiger (lungs) left hand green dragon liver

Postby voidisyinyang on Fri May 11, 2018 9:44 pm

everything wrote:how is all this working for you?

http://elixirfield.blogspot.com/2018/05 ... -from.html

I blogged it - origin of John Chang Charge is from virtual photons as reverse time relativistic superluminal momentum energy
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